Getting back to the Basics. Your first moves?

[jray]

i'd rather wait till i have mathematics before i start chopping anyway.

Eek! That's like saying "I'd rather wait til I have Rifling before I start making military units. Why make weak ones before that?" The starting chop yield is still huge compared to the cost of units in the early game. I'll stop my chopping once I start researching Mathematics, but postponing all chopping is missing out on some huge initial boosts. It's optimal to have a big chopping rush at the very beginning of the game, and then another big one right after Mathematics. At the other times, chops are comparatively weak.

 

[Seras]

no, i just have better things to do with my workers until then, like building improvements on ressources...though i mostly beeline towards math after bronzeworking anyway so the wait is quite short.

(also..i usually don't have workers till im 1-2 techs away from math anyway)

 

[Rusty Edge]

It varies.

Often I'll put barracks in as the default, then pre-empt it , so that they are always working on the barracks when I can't think of something better for them to do.

Workboat is the priority if I have the tech and resource.
Scout is a usual choice. I figure 2 scouts are always worthwhile on Huge.
worker when I have the techs to use one.
defender
settler

 

[ezwip]

I prefer playing on Noble so that there is no AI advantage in the tech field, and because I love wonders.

This is how I usually approach a start:

City 1

1. Settler
2. Worker
3. Warrior
4. Pyramids

City 2

1. Settler
2. Warrior
3. Worker
4. Oracle

 

[Esgaro]

I normally play on monarch. Generally, I will start with a worker, chop a second worker, and chop a settler. Those forest hammers are far too valuable in the early game to leave sitting around.

If I am a civ with fishing, and I start on the coast with food resources, I might start with a work boat.

Man, a lot of people building wonders. I wouldn't even think about building a wonder while I only have two cities. That is a good way to get your head kicked in. If on a crowded map, I would build troops to get more cities. Otherwise I would expand with settlers. The opportunity cost of wonders at that point is just way too high.

 

[Bad Brett]

1. Worker
2. Stonehenge
3. The Great Wall
4. Settler
5. Warrior

 

[Dajet24]

Warrior, warrior, Worker then stonehenge.. = monuments for all saves u atleast 10 turns per new city in the beginning helps u cut off land with borders faster.

I tend to be late with the first settler but i kick 3 out in a row normally to make up for it.

so

war
war
worker
stonehenge
settler
settler
archer
settler
???

 

[jimbob27]

I generally start by partially building a barracks, grow to size 2, and then start building a worker. I still pretty much always go straight for bronze working, so I try and sync things up, so my worker is complete and has moved onto a forest the turn I can chop trees. Then I'll chop a second worker, and then chop a settler.

I do a few variations, depending on whether I start with mining, or if I have fishing and there are food resources to be worked. I'm still a huge believer of the boost that early chopping gives, even after the nerf.

 

[weregamer]

There is a detailed article on build order to get your first settler out fastest over in the War Academy. It presumes that you go for Bronze Working as your first tech, and chop like mad, but it spells out scenarios and assumptions very clearly.

Since I play Noble +/-, and am generally interested in having at least one religion of my own (I also prefer early growth and late conquest), I tend not to beeline for BW so that guide was more informative than prescriptive for me. Depending on my starting location my most common start is scout/worker/settler/stonehenge or worker/settler/stonehenge - unless I am Creative in which case I might skip Stonehenge.

 

[Spearthrower]

Some of the comments here simply prove one thing - the entire game and all corresponding strategies are completely down to the settings you choose at start up.

I play Huge / Marathon and there's no way in hell I could wait until Mathematics before building workers!!! I'd be dead from the raging barbs due to not having hooked up copper/horses. On the other hand, there's generally no point in starting with a worker due to not having enough techs to work with (and with Marathon, having to wait 20+ turns for the next one)


Personally, for the original question.... I look at what I have and play accordingly. If I have plenty of food sources, I will probably build a warrior/fishing boat out of the gate and let me city grow to pick up those food sources which will be more of a boost to the first worker build. I tend to get 2 workers out before a settler, then a warrior or 2.

Typically it goes like this

Warrior > Warrior > Worker > Worker > Settler > Warrior > Wonder.

Personally, I still REX like mad and will have anything from 6 - 10 cities, depending on their proximity to my capital, before I turtle down.... I then keep their pops low through whipping and b-line to courthouses.

 

[Dubzilla8]

I cant see the advantage of popping out a settler before popping out a worker. Without a worker you cant work any tiles with improvements...Gold, cows, corn, and all other early resources will be inaccessible. The city will grow slow since the resources are not improved. This applies to both cities; at best, you will have some flood plains with 3 F 1 C, which is pretty pitiful.

Building a worker first, assuming you have some resources and the appropriate technology for the resource, allows you to grow/build/research much faster than having a second city with similar un-improved conditions.

Compounding the issue of having two cities before producing a single worker is the fact that one worker can not keep up with improving two cities. So, not only have you spent 20 turns building a settler right off the bat, but you might wait X number of turns for a warrior then a worker. So, maybe 40 turns into the game you bring out your first worker and he has to improve, not just the capitol, but a second city as well!?

Good luck with that.

 

[thomson_2001]

agh its such a tought call. do u let a city naturally grow to size 3ish before popping out a worker or settler (stalling growth) as they should be made quicker (more tiles worked). or do you pop a worker on size 2 and try to get extra food (although working less tiles) for later settler. i guess chopping a settler could work but im just stuck in the mindset of having a good capitol before i stop me growth for workers/settlers.

the ballance of one good vs two mediocre cities is v hard to get. id need to work out ave number of turns to a) make worker, b) move to and improve a food tile (say wheat) vs the natural growth rate.

 

[BYC]

It's pretty much always:

Worker
Settler
Warrior

For my 2nd city, it varies a bit but usually:

Monument
Warrior
Warrior

For techs, there's 2 routes:

Mining
Bronze Working (1st if Mining from start)
varies, but usually Mysticism

Meditation/Polytheism (depending on if I have commerce, if I do, I go Meditation, if not, I go Polytheism. OR if I have Industrious trait, I go Polytheism for earlier wonders skipping Meditation until way later)
Mining
Bronze Working

In multiplayer, I often go Warrior, Warrior, Worker.

 

[Arlborn]

If I got a food resource around me for which I have the tech, I will first build a worker(or work boat) then to use this resource.

If not, it depends a lot...

 

[PibbZ]

I tend to go something like this (given that i dont start at the shore).

Start researching Bronze Working
1. Worker (Start mining)
2. Worker (Start mining)
3. Units (Warriors / Archers / Spearmen depending on techs from huts) until i can choprush Stonehenge
4. Stonehenge
5. Settler (Founding my GP farm, starts producing a few workers)
6. Settler (Founding my main production city, starts producing a few units)
7. Random stuff based on what i need
8. Basically whip as many buildings as possible, but a bit more careful in my capital as i want it to grow cottages as soon as possible (Capital is always my main source of income so i tend to cottage everything thats not mined).

 

[Orion071]

I play on Emperor, and I start with a Worker 90% of the time. You don't realize what a huge advantage it is to have an early Worker out there. Improving a Cow or a Corn tile DOUBLES its output. Mining early Gold or improving an Ivory tile provides a necessary happiness benefit (for these higher levels, at least).

If you haven't tried an early Worker, give it a shot for a game or two. A couple of things to consider: You have to prioritize the Workers techs (Mining, BW, Agriculture, AH, Wheel, maybe Pottery). You have to make sure your Worker is constantly going. Also, you always need more Workers. Even in the very early game, I like to have at least 1 Worker per city. So that usually means I start Worker -> Warrior -> Warrior -> Settler -> Worker. Sometimes I get the 2nd Worker first and chop the Settler.

Times I don't start with a Worker:

1) When I have Fishing and a coastal start with seafood. Then I start with a Workboat. If I don't have Fishing, then I build a Warrior, then the Workboat.

2) If I want an early religion. If I don't start with the Worker techs and I don't research them right away, there's nothing for the Worker to do. So I start with a Warrior.

 

[RedRalph]

I never ever build warriors. I go:

1. worker (or workboat, ideally)
2. Barracks
3. Archer

 

[ShannonCT]

Assuming I have cows, corn, pigs, deer, sheep, rice, or wheat in my first city's fat cross (which is almost always), and assuming it is safe to do so (not playing multiplayer), the worker first build is a no brainer for me. Most initial cities start with a net food/hammer yield of 4 (2 food, 1 hammer in city, 1 more food or hammer on worked tile). Letting your city grow to size 2 is only going to increase your net yield to 5, since the extra population will need 2 food to support it. 1 extra yield doesn't get that first worker out much faster. Improving an animal or grain resource increases the yield of that tile by 2 or 3. A size 1 city working an improved resource is just as productive as a size 3 or 4 city working unimproved resources, and a size 2 city working 2 improved resources is as productive as a size 5 to 7 city working unimproved resources.

Early chopping (and whipping) is pretty necessary on higher levels. I never limit myself to chopping only after Mathematics. 20 hammers on turn 30 is probably worth a lot more than 30 hammers on turn 150. However, I almost always improve resources before chopping.

Not to bash anyone here, but I think the early barracks build is a pretty weak strategy. The only time I would consider it is if I were playing an aggressive Civ (half price barracks) and was planning on archer rushing (or quecha, skirmisher, bowman, etc.) a close neighbor. Otherwise, you're spending 50 hammers (normal speed) on something that wont give you much early benefit. 1 upgrade isn't going to make your early scouts/warriors/archers much better at what they need to do early, which is to find huts, meet neighbors, bust fog, and kill barbs. I wouldn't even use barrracks as a placeholder build. I'd rather have more 0XP warriors in almost every situation, for busting more fog, defending cities better, and increasing my power rating.

I play on Emperor, and I start with a Worker 90% of the time. You don't realize what a huge advantage it is to have an early Worker out there. Improving a Cow or a Corn tile DOUBLES its output. Mining early Gold or improving an Ivory tile provides a necessary happiness benefit (for these higher levels, at least).

If you haven't tried an early Worker, give it a shot for a game or two. A couple of things to consider: You have to prioritize the Workers techs (Mining, BW, Agriculture, AH, Wheel, maybe Pottery). You have to make sure your Worker is constantly going.

wholeheartedly.

 

[Lightwave]

Assuming I have cows, corn, pigs, deer, sheep, rice, or wheat in my first city's fat cross (which is almost always), and assuming it is safe to do so (not playing multiplayer), the worker first build is a no brainer for me. Most initial cities start with a net food/hammer yield of 4 (2 food, 1 hammer in city, 1 more food or hammer on worked tile). Letting your city grow to size 2 is only going to increase your net yield to 5, since the extra population will need 2 food to support it. 1 extra yield doesn't get that first worker out much faster. Improving an animal or grain resource increases the yield of that tile by 2 or 3. A size 1 city working an improved resource is just as productive as a size 3 or 4 city working unimproved resources, and a size 2 city working 2 improved resources is as productive as a size 5 to 7 city working unimproved resources.

Well said! I had evolved to almost a "worker first" mentality, but I had not posted since I did not have as good of an explanation as this. I guess I often actually do a Warrior first for the reasons you describe after then a Worker, but the idea is mostly the same.

Early chopping (and whipping) is pretty necessary on higher levels. I never limit myself to chopping only after Mathematics. 20 hammers on turn 30 is probably worth a lot more than 30 hammers on turn 150. However, I almost always improve resources before chopping.

Not to bash anyone here, but I think the early barracks build is a pretty weak strategy.[...snipped]

I think you are right on the mark here as well. Great explanations IMHO.

 

[jray]

Assuming I have cows, corn, pigs, deer, sheep, rice, or wheat in my first city's fat cross (which is almost always), and assuming it is safe to do so (not playing multiplayer), the worker first build is a no brainer for me. Most initial cities start with a net food/hammer yield of 4 (2 food, 1 hammer in city, 1 more food or hammer on worked tile). Letting your city grow to size 2 is only going to increase your net yield to 5, since the extra population will need 2 food to support it. 1 extra yield doesn't get that first worker out much faster. Improving an animal or grain resource increases the yield of that tile by 2 or 3. A size 1 city working an improved resource is just as productive as a size 3 or 4 city working unimproved resources, and a size 2 city working 2 improved resources is as productive as a size 5 to 7 city working unimproved resources.

Early chopping (and whipping) is pretty necessary on higher levels. I never limit myself to chopping only after Mathematics. 20 hammers on turn 30 is probably worth a lot more than 30 hammers on turn 150. However, I almost always improve resources before chopping.

Not to bash anyone here, but I think the early barracks build is a pretty weak strategy. The only time I would consider it is if I were playing an aggressive Civ (half price barracks) and was planning on archer rushing (or quecha, skirmisher, bowman, etc.) a close neighbor. Otherwise, you're spending 50 hammers (normal speed) on something that wont give you much early benefit. 1 upgrade isn't going to make your early scouts/warriors/archers much better at what they need to do early, which is to find huts, meet neighbors, bust fog, and kill barbs. I wouldn't even use barrracks as a placeholder build. I'd rather have more 0XP warriors in almost every situation, for busting more fog, defending cities better, and increasing my power rating.

, but one thing I might add to your points is that sometimes a high population is nice for whipping. But it's hard to get a high population fast enough anyway without a Worker... unless you start out with 3 fish or something.

Also agree on the Barracks being a silly early choice! Instead, you could build 4 or 5 units to go out and earn xp the old-fashioned way by hunting animals and barbs. Plenty of time for a Barracks later when you have better production. Those 4 or 5 units will serve you well, as fog-busters, new city guardians, and later on either upgraded beasts or unhappiness-quashers.