Getting crushed on Warlord

human101101

Chieftain
Joined
Jul 7, 2011
Messages
21
I think I am just not understanding how to get ahead of the AI on Warlord (which is supposed to be easy). I just played a game all the way to the 1960's and found the Iroquois are way ahead of me despite them always declaring war on me. Finally I knew I was doomed when they sent three sets of fighters against me and I was 8 turns aware from the "Flight" tech. At that point, I threw in the towel.

It seems to me that it is critical to stay ahead of the enemy as far as tech goes. Yet, how do I know what research order is best? Hiawatha (Iroquois) keeps attacking me and then asks for peace after I hold him off. I seem to spend all my time and money building military units to defend myself yet Hiawatha seems to keep building out his kingdom and technology while attacking me at will.

I am also loss on how to manage City-States. When Hiawatha declared war on me, 6 other City-States joined in to attack me as well. How do you get City-States to trade with you and to enter into alliances with you?

I have no idea on how to proceed. Perhaps I am not understanding how to best manage the empire. I am thinking am abdicating my throne and handing it over to my brother despite his public speaking problems.

I think what I need is a primer on how to best survive in Civ 5. It seems so different than Civ 4 where I used to do fairly well. I should also note that I only play for domination victory. My favorite part of the game is strategic warfare. Any help would be most appreciated. Thanks.

P.S. Is there a chat or IRC channel where people talk about Civ? It would be great to ask questions LIVE.
 

chgrogers

Prince
Joined
Dec 18, 2010
Messages
396
Location
Central US
Actually it sounds like your about even with the Tech of Hiawatha maybe even a little bit behind. Not bad.

If your having trouble with fighters, Build Anti Air guns placing them behind a screen of melee and ranged units.

City States are allied by buying them with Gold. 500G will get them to barely allied status with out competitors. With another Civ competing a large investment is required to keep them allied.

Teching I as your play high levels is about bee-lining and converting that advantage into the game. Like Teching straight for Iron Working then immediately upgrading warriors to Swordmen and smashing the nearest Civ to build a puppet empire.

I have justed started playing Immortal and I always take pottery --> writing --> then mining.
I use that to stay in range with the other CiVs. After that I will beeline for Iron Working Chivalry or another military Tech. It just depends on what civ im using.
 

human101101

Chieftain
Joined
Jul 7, 2011
Messages
21
Thanks for the reply!

So instead of trying to obtain all the techs in an era before moving to the next, you go directly for specific techs? You mentioned Iron Working. What other techs do you feel are essential to get?

In Civ 4 I would buy the techs I left behind, but that does not seem possible now. Is there a similar strategy in Civ 5?

The 500 gold cost for City-States is rough. I just never seem to have that much money to spare.

I have been watching some of the game walk-throughs by other players on YouTube. I would like to find one that covers each move and explains why they did what they did.
 

chgrogers

Prince
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Dec 18, 2010
Messages
396
Location
Central US
I don't bother with videos I am a play first then come to the forum when I hit a wall or to work through a particular issue.

Iron-Working is for a Swordman Rush.

Rush Pottery --> Writing --> build Great Library rush Philosophy. and Build the National College in just 1-2 cities.

Rush Chivalry Pottery --> Writing and then go up Animal Husbandry to grab Chivalry. Useful to Civ with Knight UU like Siam/ Mongols / Songhai.
 

FromBirth

Chieftain
Joined
Feb 23, 2011
Messages
82
Location
Sunderland, UK
To back up what chgrogers already said, pick a tech and go straight to it without detour (bee-line) is a good way to get a particular unit you want to produce a lot of and wage war as soon as you've got 4-6 of those units with a few others supporting usually.
However I'd take a step back from that and ensure you've got a few solid cities first and enough gold coming in to afford those CS you are struggling to get.
Look at the techs you need to be able to hook up the luxury resources around your capital.
Hover over the tile and it will tell you calendar, trapping etc.
Get those first, build/steal/buy/libertySP a worker and get those tiles working.

When you have a luxury, start to trade with the civs you've met. If they have enough money at Warlord level you can ask for 240 gold. A few of these will get you the 500 you need.

Another point just to be sure, have at least one scout so you can meet as many civs as possible soon, pick up goody huts and pick sites for new cities.

Settle new cities as required on sites with more luxuries (ideally ones you don't have yet) and once you have the relevant techs, horse and iron. Don't go crazy for more cities 2-4 of your own is usually enough for most play styles.

Once you're happy with these basics you'll probably be able to work on tech choices and some of the more subtle aspects of the game.
Apologies if I'm teaching you to suck eggs as that wasn't specifically what you asked in the OP.

Good luck
 

grandad1982

Deity
Joined
Dec 4, 2007
Messages
2,552
Do you sell spare resources and open borders to the AI? This is how you get the money you need to buy of city states.

Tech what you need and what you are going to need. Sounds stupid so I'll give an example.

You have started a game as Hiawatha and in you capitals BFH (Big Fat Hex) there is 2 cotton, a silver and a cow. One of the cottons is on a forest tile. In this situation I would start with mining (silver and forest chop), followed but animanl husbandry (the cow and to reveal any horses). After that the two most obvious tech paths are pottery > calendar or bronze working > iron working. Which one you choose would probably depend on what your scouting has revealed and what kind of plan you may have for your game. Lets assume you went iron working and spammed loads of Mohawk Warriors and did some damage to the AI. Time has passed and you have a strong core of promoted units. Using GSci bulbs and RA you may want to get to rifling as fast as possible so you have a force that will dominate the enermy for as long as possible. If this is your goal concentrate on it!

Getting to Education as fast as possible is another popular beeline. This will allow you to build unis and start producing GSci.

As for spending all you money/production on units try to preserve them. Give ground if it means your unit won't die. AIs are rubbish at taking cities anyway.

EDIT:
Oh yeah don't feel the need to build every building in every city. Don't know if you do this or not but if you do it will drain your gold.
 

jerbacca78

Chieftain
Joined
Jul 6, 2011
Messages
54
Location
Ontario, Canada
In general civ is a game of timing and focus. Know the timing and prepare. If your next social policy (SP) will pop in the next couple turns then it may not be a good idea to settle you next city until after that. Or if you know you are going to unlock the philanthropy SP (the one that gives more influence per gold) next turn, then wait to make your next gold investment even if you go :c5unhappy: for a couple turns. Monitor the progress of Tech, SP, and building (even golden age progress)

Know your goals and focus on them. Try not to get distracted by something that you think that you need. (If it is not required for the next goal then you can get it later or find an alternate.) If you are bee-lining to steel (longswords), then forget about universities (for now). Also if you are bee-lining education (universities) and you are having happiness issues, then try to avoid researching construction (required for colloseum and also needs masonry tech). Make sure you have enough :c5gold: to ally with a CS, or maybe you can build circuses (trapping which you need anyway) if you have horses or ivory, or maybe you can buy a tile to un-lock a needed happiness resource.

That said, teching is always important and so is getting the National College (NC requires philosophy) built before you get too big (2-3 cities if possible). Science is needed for all victory conditions. Conversely, if you are leading the way in science then it is not critical to bee-line to public schools (though you don't want to lose your edge either). though if you are going for a science victory, then it might be a good idea as long as you have the latest military units.

For domination, make sure you have at least +10:), before you go conquering since you will be gaining +3:c5unhappy:/city and +1:c5unhappy:/pop. And don't be afraid to burn any useless cities. And spam tp (trading posts) to control the population of any puppets you may acquire ("Help control the pet population: Have your pet spayed or neutered." - Bob Barker)
 

human101101

Chieftain
Joined
Jul 7, 2011
Messages
21
Thank you both very much for the advice!

I tried making a "beeline" for the tech I wanted and that really helped. I found that I could go back and get the techs I left behind when I had time. Thanks for the tips regarding the scouts. I am now on a Warlord game and edging out all the other nations. Getting ready to crush Hiawatha.

I tried trading techs but the other nations wanted VERY unfair deals. Like three of my luxuries for one of their luxuries. In fact every time I try trading I find the other leaders only except very lopsided deals.

Also, how do research agreements work? How do you determine which tech you get? Is there ever a reason to not participate in a research agreement? I would hate to pay for a tech that is only 3 turns away.
 

jerbacca78

Chieftain
Joined
Jul 6, 2011
Messages
54
Location
Ontario, Canada
I tried trading techs but the other nations wanted VERY unfair deals. Like three of my luxuries for one of their luxuries. In fact every time I try trading I find the other leaders only except very lopsided deals.

If they only have 1 resource left then yes they expect very unfair trades.

Also, how do research agreements work? How do you determine which tech you get? Is there ever a reason to not participate in a research agreement? I would hate to pay for a tech that is only 3 turns away.

RA now work differently, and there is roll-over (so it is just a boost to your science). It will add to whatever tech you are currently researching, however the roll-over is random (unless you have the next tech queued). So if you have an RA that will end soon, make sure that you have your techs properly queued. Also the value of science added is the half of the median of your available techs (at the time that the RA ends).
 

Roghar

Warlord
Joined
Nov 30, 2007
Messages
284
Location
Perth, Western Australia
Hiawatha (Iroquois) keeps attacking me and then asks for peace after I hold him off. I seem to spend all my time and money building military units to defend myself yet Hiawatha seems to keep building out his kingdom and technology while attacking me at will.


It sounds like you're quitting the wars too early.. Hiawatha asks for peace because he isn't winning. By giving him peace you give him a chance to rebuild, likely with higher production than you. If you've weathered an attack and managed to avoid losing too much, take the opportunity to attack. At the least keep the war going so he wastes resources, and perhaps offers a more attractive settlement some turns later.
 

Rpger29

Prince
Joined
Aug 11, 2011
Messages
309
Yes. Keep the pressure on an enemy until you are offered a settlement for peace. Keep in mind (iirc) that you will only get one of these per civ. If you plan on warmongering against this civ again in the future, just take them down to all but one crappy city - you won't get anything else out of them.
 
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