Ghengis Khan got a new job as mid game floor wiper.

[Drosophila-fly]

Seriously, it's quite crazy how much the game makes life easy for mongolia.
You get +9 combat strength for your first war, which you most likely will be fighting with horsemen around turn 50-60 on standard speed. That's +6 from a trade route, and +3 from mongol horde.

Whats more, the horseman tech is timed nicely, the time it takes to rush horseback riding along with mining, (around 50 turns without a natural wonder or scientific city state bonus), fits nicely with getting a second city on that second horse resource, and getting early empire for magnus, as well as military training for the maneuver policy card. With these set, chuck magnus in a city with more than 4 woods or stone, harvest them, and come out with seven to eight 45 strength horsemen at turn 60!

Entering late mid game, around turn 125, you'll have printing and maybe even diplomatic service. With printing tech and a spy, you can get up to +21 combat strength! Spicy!

I've tried this out on Deity, it works as long as you don't get moped in the first 40 turns or so.

(ignore this shameless advertisement) Check out this 136T mongolia victory to see what I mean.

Guys. Are there any civs out there that are better than the mongols at quick dominations? Please! I'm asking this for pure research purposes!
(ignore the fact that I need ideas for my next series)

 

[Victoria]

Guys. Are there any civs out there that are better than the mongols at quick dominations? Please! I'm asking this for pure research purposes!

What is best? It is a crazy concept to me, I hate the word best.
For faster domination Nubia currently probably but nerfed with better walls.
Aztecs, out of the starting gate OP ness.
Sumerian steamroller
All of these are earlier and that means a resource head start which gets them to knights faster.
Rome culture with a culture CS gets them to knights faster.

Once at knights early enough it really does not matter if you are +12.

With Mongols it is about surviving until you get a trade route. Even then, on higher levels your bonus does not work out so well...especially when golden against Mapuche but regardless you will steamroll.
Printing at 120 is steamrolling?

We had someone swearing Nubia was best a few months ago. What is best for me is crap civs because they give a better challenge and teach me humility on deity.

 

[Whistled Blues]

No need to be rough, dear victoria.
As a main Mongolia, i can affirm this civilization is fearsome for conquering but it's clearly NOT the best cause i agree that we can't say a civ is the best in a particular domain.
Have you seen Nubia, Zulus or even god damn trajan who can steamroll evryone in classic era ?
Except for zulus, Nubia or Romans have a spike power when Mongolia have his bonuses the whole game.
Scythia is of course also monstruous for conquering.

There was a time my friends was complaining about me playing only genghis khan, i always annexed them. I said ok i picked Zulus well it's no big difference xd.

So yeah, try Zulus. (and wait for gathering storm and the polynesians they're broken)

 

[BarbarianHunter]

No need to be rough, dear victoria.
As a main Mongolia, i can affirm this civilization is fearsome for conquering but it's clearly NOT the best cause i agree that we can't say a civ is the best in a particular domain.
Have you seen Nubia, Zulus or even god damn trajan who can steamroll evryone in classic era ?
Except for zulus, Nubia or Romans have a spike power when Mongolia have his bonuses the whole game.
Scythia is of course also monstruous for conquering.

There was a time my friends was complaining about me playing only genghis khan, i always annexed them. I said ok i picked Zulus well it's no big difference xd.

So yeah, try Zulus. (and wait for gathering storm and the polynesians they're broken)

​

You should throw Macedon into the mix every now & then. Declare war & never make peace. The war weariness should drive them to ruin while you bank science from making units in your Basilikoi Paides.

 

[Arent11]

What is best? It is a crazy concept to me, I hate the word best.
For faster domination Nubia currently probably but nerfed with better walls.
Aztecs, out of the starting gate OP ness.
Sumerian steamroller
All of these are earlier and that means a resource head start which gets them to knights faster.
Rome culture with a culture CS gets them to knights faster.

Once at knights early enough it really does not matter if you are +12.

With Mongols it is about surviving until you get a trade route. Even then, on higher levels your bonus does not work out so well...especially when golden against Mapuche but regardless you will steamroll.
Printing at 120 is steamrolling?

We had someone swearing Nubia was best a few months ago. What is best for me is crap civs because they give a better challenge and teach me humility on deity.

But that's more showing how unbalanced the game is. Certain civs kill you in antiquity, others kill you if you let them survive long enough. That's not how it should work.

In principle, every civ should be able, if a player is clever enough to anticipate what the enemy forces will consist of, to devise some counter. If I spam spearmen or pikemen, I should be able to stop a pure cavalry cold. & that should force Scythia & Mongolia to build at least some melee units to break up my pike lines. And then I have to think how to counter melee + horses, so maybe I'll go for melee + pikemen. And then it becomes a question of who is the best tactician.

 

[Victoria]

That's not how it should work.

We can all come up with how it should work and our should's should be different because our own agendas are. I personally think abilities should be linked to era's and be quite strong in that era. Your post is still sound though, rock paper scissors would be ideal.

However to defend Firaxis I would say having OP civs and easy civs makes for another level of challenge. Playing as Mongolia versus Spain, Norway, England, Egypt, Holland, Cree and Goergia on deity is easy but playing as Gerogia versus Sumeria, Rome, Mongolia, Scythia, Macedonia, Korea and Nubia on deity is not so easy and you are just going to have at least some type of decent challenge.

Every civ does have a counter, France is Mongolias. With Mongolia you should be spamming culture early to get your visibility up and also try to get to printing, get that spy in one of their cities... If they cannot get to you immediately send them a trader to get a trading post in their nation. The easy answer is a bit naff, declare war on them the turn you meet them to avoid that +6 for the trader.

To play as them it is ridiculous, 1 turn to set up a trading post, declare war on them and then move the trader to the next victim... Spies and printing early and you can really just chew people with whatever you have.

 

[MarigoldRan]

Oh yeah, that was me. Nubia remains the best all around. They can survive the early game better than anyone else and they have the tools to conquer, too.

Also, don't forget about Scythia (buy one, get one free), which can spam horsemen TWICE as fast as Mongolia and has a +5 bonus against damaged units.

 

[Fluphen Azine]

Oh yeah, that was me. Nubia remains the best all around. They can survive the early game better than anyone else and they have the tools to conquer, too.

Also, don't forget about Scythia (buy one, get one free), which can spam horsemen TWICE as fast as Mongolia and has a +5 bonus against damaged units.

I recently messed about with the Deity GOTM this month.
If you put Nubia in place of Gilgamesh and play it out I am not so certain you would finish faster.
I think Sumeria is a stronger Civ compared to Nubia.

A strong debate could be made that these Civs are above Nubia...

Rome
Sumeria
Aztec
Scythia
Persia

I tend to think Gorgo can be better as well with all that free culture but that is personal preference.

 

[Victoria]

A strong debate could be made that these Civs are above Nubia...

These debates with marigold ran have been done before. They are in love with the pitati and that is a wonderful thing that is a little blinding. You really are

 

[Cedbird77]

So that's why Genghis is always a beast in my games. I usually value my culture lowest on my priority list until mid game.

I don't fully understand the visibility system either. Except giving gold gifts for embassies etc give u visisbilty with other Civs.

Also trade routes for Genghis.

The other thing that makes Ghengis a beast. Is the ability to take your horse soldiers and make them his.

I love going against him on Emperor. I know I have a foe to actually contend with

 

[MarigoldRan]

It's not just the Pitati, but also the bonus to slinger construction for early game. It just synergizes really well.