Gold / Gems/ Silver Start Poll
- Thread starter Genv [FP]
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TheMeInTeam
If A implies B...
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- Jan 26, 2008
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I like it, but the difference between them in a capitol vs a 2nd city isn't THAT huge.
While everything in a map from what leaders you face to what kind of land each gets to which ones are near each other affects difficulty, gold/gems/silver starts are only minimal impact by comparison.
Strategic resources and such in the fat cross and favorable AI locations are much stronger than a gems start.
Hell, the surrounding land might be weak and you won't even know until you play, so the answer to this is "maybe", but usually not.
While everything in a map from what leaders you face to what kind of land each gets to which ones are near each other affects difficulty, gold/gems/silver starts are only minimal impact by comparison.
Strategic resources and such in the fat cross and favorable AI locations are much stronger than a gems start.
Hell, the surrounding land might be weak and you won't even know until you play, so the answer to this is "maybe", but usually not.
Gold etc. can make a big difference to research in the first 150 turns or so. But it needs to be paired up with adequate food. I've had a start with 2 gold mines and a cow in the BFC, and that didn't go too well, as I had to choose between growth (working grassland farms) or gold mines. That game never got finished. So with that proviso it makes a big difference and allows several gambits which wouldn't otherwise be possible on higher difficulties.
Diamondeye
So Happy I Could Die
I think it has a huge importance since that extra commerce allows you to REX even more before your tech goes in the gutter, which what I usually do. Claiming more land (and having the techs to use it/commerce influx to keep it running) will wi the game for you eventually. Sure, one Gem/gold/silver might not do wonders, but I've tried a start with Gold in capital and two silvers in 2nd city with Zara... When I landed in Korea with 6 Oromos, he had archers and hwachas. This was on Prince or Monarch. So it can make a lot of difference if you know how to utilize it (and have the food).
Gems yes, multiple gold/silver in 1 city takes too long. If I see multiple gold I'll try and split it between a couple of cities. If I see silver I'll probably have poor land - it usually seems to be near tundra/ice so no thanks.
Rubbaduck
Artificial waterfowl
It CAN be game changing, most of the time it's not, but when you have three grassland gems with a river and lots of good land around, it gets pretty boring
azzaman333
meh
Most of the time, Gems are surrounded by jungle, but that means grassland, which means great land long term with Gems to power the short term. So yes for Gems.
Most of the time, Gold is located in the desert areas of the map. That means that there are floodplains from the river generated to go through your capital/fat cross, which are very powerful tiles, especially compounded with Expansive. So yes for Gold.
Most of the time, Silver is located in the Tundra. That means that there is no food in the area, unless you're lucky. And Food is of utmost importance, and a lack of food kills. So no for Silver.
Most of the time, Gold is located in the desert areas of the map. That means that there are floodplains from the river generated to go through your capital/fat cross, which are very powerful tiles, especially compounded with Expansive. So yes for Gold.
Most of the time, Silver is located in the Tundra. That means that there is no food in the area, unless you're lucky. And Food is of utmost importance, and a lack of food kills. So no for Silver.
Everyone seems to be concentrating on the commerce benefits of working early mines with these resources. I did myself when first considering the question. But there is another aspect that can be just as important; the happiness boost. Any one of the happiness resources is very welcome in the early game even if it can't be worked efficiently and these three are the best type of happiness resources. I find having a size 6 capital and size 5 for other cities is a huge percentage increase in tiles that can be worked and that can be as game breaking as the extra commerce.
If I have 2 different types of these happiness resources then I know the game will go well. Getting Metal Casting early is worthwhile then, even if I can get Monarchy and run HR for happiness as well. The forge gets +2 happiness and saves on having to build and maintain a large garison in my bigger cities and that saves time and gold. I'll sometimes found a city in the tundra just to control silver if I already have gold or gems.
So there are two ways that these 3 resources can influence the game and affect the outcome.
If I have 2 different types of these happiness resources then I know the game will go well. Getting Metal Casting early is worthwhile then, even if I can get Monarchy and run HR for happiness as well. The forge gets +2 happiness and saves on having to build and maintain a large garison in my bigger cities and that saves time and gold. I'll sometimes found a city in the tundra just to control silver if I already have gold or gems.
So there are two ways that these 3 resources can influence the game and affect the outcome.
The upside of this is that in your capitals BFC there can't be any jungle, so if there are gems they will be mineable from the get go.
Krick19
Prince
- Joined
- Dec 3, 2005
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- 419
Which leads me to say, "darn, I wish this was OCC"
boost.
Berkobob
Warlord
I'm in the camp of it being a big advantage - that one tile is usually supporting another city or two. I have had a few gold or gem starts on Monarch which were won pretty easily.
Also, UncleJJ, I agree with your other reasons am I not going to deny that having the bigger happy cap is an advantage - but isn't most of the happy advantage mitigated by the fact we are whipping our first few cities at size 4 in most situations during the early game? (usually by the time I stop/reduce whips I have more happy from religion/resources/HR)
Perhaps I have been applying the whip too much when I have an early happy resource? Enlighten me.
Also, UncleJJ, I agree with your other reasons am I not going to deny that having the bigger happy cap is an advantage - but isn't most of the happy advantage mitigated by the fact we are whipping our first few cities at size 4 in most situations during the early game? (usually by the time I stop/reduce whips I have more happy from religion/resources/HR)
Perhaps I have been applying the whip too much when I have an early happy resource? Enlighten me.
