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[PTW] GOTM 156 France Emperor 20k - Final Spoiler - Game Submitted

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Game of the Month' started by Più Freddo, Feb 23, 2017.

  1. Più Freddo

    Più Freddo From space, earth is blue

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    This is the thread where you tell us how you did - win, lose or retire.

    Only read or post in this thread when your game is ended and successfully submitted.
     
  2. Nata

    Nata Chieftain

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    I finished the game ages ago and didn't keep the log, so going through the most eventful things from memory.

    Finished in 1782AD, without ever using a Great Leader, or building a FP.

    Cathedral at 10BC (after getting Mono from GL after Persia and Ottomans).

    Got a lucky break in getting Monarchy from GL just when running out of things to build.
    Hanging Gardens in 290AD, which started my GA.
    Used GA well: built Bach's Cathderal in 450AD (researching it after Theology). Then hurried Uni by 490AD. Then started on Copernicus which was almost built during GA. Finished Copernicus in 690AD.
    Meanwhile I was researching towards Shakespeare myself not trusting AI to get there in time. Got Shakespeare in 870AD.

    Then there was mad rush to the end of MA with major wonder cascade. I managed to grab Magellan Voyage in 1050AD and that was it for MA.

    I got unlucky in entering IA as no one drew Steam Power and I had to research it myself. If I got Steam Power couple of turns earlier I would get Coal in Paris plus all the RRs around it, I had all the Workers standing by for it. I lost some wonder - Newton University I think, because of losing those Steam Power turns.

    After I got into IA the rest was fast and easy. Iron Works were crucial in keeping parity with other Civs as they were building like crazy.
    I got every Wonder that was left, but had a close shave with Spain and Persia both building UN and me beating them to it by just 3 turns.

    I had some wars during MA and IA, mostly grabbing the straggler cities from other Civs in my corner of the universe, consolidating my territory and putting lots and lots of units on the border with Persia who became a runaway. I also didn't share my science at all from IA and onwards, trying to slow down the progress and avoid other Civs playing around with Nukes during my grand finale. I just paid them cash for lux and behaved nicely.

    The most WTF moment was me getting my only Great Leader of the game in the beginning of IA, making an Army with a single Cav with it and moving it towards other two Cavs, anticipating Heroic Epic etc, while the rival Cav stepped out of the fog and killed my Army! Never happened to me before!
    But by that time it didn't matter much, the game was basically set by decent AA and MA.
     

    Attached Files:

  3. tR1cKy

    tR1cKy taking over the world

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    There's a flaw in the initial save game. On a large map, the treshold for 100k cultural victory should be 120k, not 100k.

    I was set for a 20k victory in 1758 AD. But a few turns earlier, i reached 100k cultural points overall. I was aware of that, but didn't care at all because i expected the limit to be 120k, as it should be. Unfortunately, it was not: victory screen, and game totally screwed. Bah.

    EDIT: I have a way around this issue, but i'm not sure it would be considered legit. What i can do is to feed the autosave from the last turn before the 'victory' to a hex editor and manually editing the total culture counter - ideally to a value of 20k lower than it is, in order to match the right limit.

    The game is basically set, i'm 10 turns away from scoring a 20k in Paris and none of the surviving AS can possibly do anything about it.

    I have performed a test and it works. If i have green light from the staff i'll perform this operation, complete the game and submit.
     
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2017
  4. Lanzelot

    Lanzelot Moderator Moderator

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    Could it be that we have a general bug in the GOTM bix and COTM biq files? I also noticed something strange when playing my 100K game in COTM128: CivAssistII predicted my victory date for when I would reach 80K, but in game I had to go to 100K, before I got the victory. (And I think, someone also reported in another game, that the Fobidden Palace can be built earlier than it should?!) Can it be that we have some kind of conflict/mismatch between mapsize and OCN?

    In any case, I would support your request, tR1cKy. If the game is broken, one is allowed to reload from the latest autosave, fix the problem and continue! (Just like when the Great Wall bug hits you.)
     
  5. Scratcher

    Scratcher Chieftain

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    I also support tR1cky, the last 10 turns will not have any impact to the result of a 20k game. After the hours committed to the game it would be a just reward to have the game included.

    Scratcher
     
  6. Nata

    Nata Chieftain

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    +1 for tR1cky replaying last turns and submitting the game.
     
  7. tR1cKy

    tR1cKy taking over the world

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    Thank you all for the support!

    About this issue:

    It may be, but i don't think the OCN has actually something to do with it, because its progression doesn't quite match the one of the 100k limit.

    I have to correct myself on one thing. Supposing that CivAssist does its calculations using the right limits, the 100k limit for a large map should be 130k and not 120k, as i previously stated. This matches *exactly* the rate of growth of the default map width - or height - multiplied by 1000. This is a strong hint that, indeed, the 100k limit is calculated by taking the default map size and multiplying this value by 1000. But this cannot be the cause of the problem, because the map is large and, therefore, the limit should be the right one... unless you, Lanzelot, actually created a *standard* map, but with width and height altered to match the size of a large map and some other stats modified accordingly. If this happened, then it's most likely the root of the problem, but i don't see why you should have gone through all this instead of just... producing a large map.

    My (highly speculative) idea is that the game normally uses these values but, for some unfathomable reasons, in case custom rules are applied, as it's the case with the GotM / CotM scenario files, it defaults to the 100k limit for a *standard* sized map, regardless of the real map type.

    If this is the case, then there's nothing we can do about it, other that acknowledging the fact that the 100k limit is 100k everywhere, and being aware of it while we play our game.
     
  8. Più Freddo

    Più Freddo From space, earth is blue

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    I was just sneak attacked by the Chinese and will have no way to finish on time. I've submitted the retired game.
     
  9. Scratcher

    Scratcher Chieftain

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    Now I remember why I don't play 20k games. The hours of micro managing, worker turns, changing specialists, managing city growth, that was a real effort to get to the finish.

    Victory 1794ad
    Firaxis 7998
    Jason 6659

    Scratcher
     
  10. aobaki

    aobaki Chieftain

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2003
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    Location:
    Istanbul/TURKEY
    Game date:1836 AD
    Firaxis score: 5921
    Jason score: 5066
    Time played: 25:17:17
     
  11. supersova_SU

    supersova_SU Chieftain

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    Location:
    Siberia
    Cultural 20K Victory for France
    Game date: 1880 AD
    Firaxis score: 5478
    Jason score: 4350
    Time played: 27:07:11
     
  12. tR1cKy

    tR1cKy taking over the world

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    ANCIENT AGES
    ------------

    I didn't see any reason to move away from an excellent coastal spot, so i decided for a strategy of settling in place, building the Forbidden Palace in a nearby city and moving the capital later. The initial build order was warrior -> settler -> worker -> Pyramids, but then i met India, traded CB and switched to temple.

    City 2 (the future FP city) and a few other settlements were built at RCP-4 from the capital. Research was set at Writing at minimum, followed by Code of Laws, Literature and Republic. Philosophy and a bunch of other techs were provided by the AS.

    After the early temple Paris produced another settler, then it was time to decide what GW to build: i considered the Colossus as a lost cause (and i was right, it was completed abroad before 2000 BC!) and i put my bet on the Pyramids instead. The great building potential of Paris was enough to overcome the 20% discount of the AS and the magnificent Pyramids of Paris were completed in 1225 BC. Persepolis was a close contender but i was fast enough to beat it and the Persian capital immediately cascaded to the Great Lighthouse.

    This was good news actually, because the Oracle was already built, and therefore there was no further cascade possible. It was time to research Literature and move on my next big project. I withold Literature for a while, took my chances in building a library first (to help discovering Republic faster) and only after that i went for the Great Library. My calculations still gave me an edge on all the known AS, but if someone abroad had researched Literature early enough, it would beat me.

    The QSC stats weren't anything great, because i built no granaries and didn't use Paris as a settler pump, as i would have done with a different victory condition. I reached the 1000 BC mark with:
    1 city, 7 towns; 26 pop units;
    army: 2 spears, 8 warriors, 8 workers, 2 slaves;
    one temple, 3 barracks, granaries everywhere due to Pyramids;
    Rep in 23, missing a buttload of techs;
    128 quids, -4 gpt;
    Know all the AS in the home continent;

    By 650 BC Republic was known; i revolted immediately, got only 2 turns of anarchy (lucky shot) and of course didn't even think about rerolling :D At this point, i decided to put all my chances on completing the Great Library and put research at zero. The bet paid off and i completed it in 270 BC; on the less pleasant side, India cascaded to the Great Wall. Next turn, my shiny new Great Library gave me all the 3 compulsory AA techs i was still missing, plus Monotheism and Feudalism :D The Middle Ages had just begun.

    MIDDLE AGES
    -----------

    On the military side, after some expansion i begun the invasion of India. I don't remember exactly when it started because i wasn't taking notes by that time, it can be either the late AA or the beginning of the MA. Anyway, the Indian proved to be surprisingly tough and what, in my mind, should have been a quick and dirty job actually protracted itself well into the Middle Ages. India was finally disposed of in 430 AD, not an exciting date actually. In the meantime, there were two short wars with Ottomans and Persia that i used to take over a few small settlements they had managed to sneak into my sphere of interest, but besides that i left their core nations totally intact, because i wanted to exploit their research potential to my advantage.

    About the far landmass, i soon realized that there was no safe passage abroad, even with the Great Lighthouse. Nonetheless, making contact was important, if anything for meeting the 3rd scientific civ. I assembled a fleet of galleys and sent them away from different starting points. Two of them made their journey and the rest of the AS were met on the last BC turn. Some fruitful trades were made, but unfortunately Babylon didn't get the missing MA freebie, so i had to research Engineering myself in order to "stimulate" the AS to research on the lower path.

    Until then, Paris had produced a colosseum, a marketplace, a cathedral, and was prebuilding with Sun Tzu. However, in the very same 10 BC turn, Monarchy was known with the Great Library. Too early! I immediately switched to Hanging Gardens but ended up losing the race to the Ottomans for a mere 3 turns :mad: Ok, there was a plan B: Back to Sun Tzu, then speed up for Engineering, trade immediately for Theology and switch to Sistine. But even this plan was at risk of failing: in 330 AD Sun Tzu was built in Trondheim, and the Persian city of Susa switched to... Sistine.

    By 370 AD i had got knowledge of Chivalry and Invention, and i was 4 turn away from completing Sistine. So i decided to trade for Education, de-facto deactivating my Great Library. The rationale was to research at full speed to Music Theory and have a plan C for the worst case scenario: should i lose Sistine, i could still have good chances to cascade to Leonardo's and then turn to Bach's. On the other hand, if i had success with Sistine, i could still benefit from this course of action because of a spare leader gained during the Indian campaign, that i could use to rush immediately Bach's.

    By 410 AD, i managed to complete Sistine. Immediately after, Susa cascaded to Leonardo's... and completed it! Geez, i just realized i was only one turn away from losing Sistine, what a thrilling race! Playing 20k at Emperor level is not for the faint-hearted :D Next turn, Music Theory was known and the leader was spent to rush Bach's. Two good points scored.

    Research went on Astronomy, with Paris building a university as an intended prebuild to Copernicus. I bought Astronomy half-way from the Ottomans and switched immediately. Research continued with Navigation. In the meantime, i got two useful techs from abroad: Gunpowder (Scandinavia) and Printing Press (Spain). Navigation was known in 580 AD and by that time i already had assembled a fleet of caravels with enough units (and with a bunch of musketeers included) to launch an invasion oversea.

    My plan was to hit at Spain first, then go on with England and America, followed by Scandinavia. At that point, i still had to build a second core. The idea of using the former Indian land was rejected because it would have taken too much to turn that jungle nightmare into something at least decently productive, so i decided that i would have built my new capital in-between England and America, where there was enough room for a nice RCP5 first ring and an equally good RCP7 second ring, plus some stragglers.

    War started, i got my musketeer victory and the French Golden Age could finally be started. With the bonus of the GA, i completed Copernicus, built a fast university (shortrush is your friend here) and started on Magellan's. The possibilities were open at this point: i could either complete Magellan or use it as a prebuild for a more culturally strong wonder. In the meantime, i had kept research low until i could trade for Banking (Ottomans) and Chemistry (England), then i went for a 4-turn research on Physics and used it to trade for Democracy (Ottomans) and Free Artistry (Persia). The strategy of keeping the Persians and the Ottomans intact was paying off, as i could switch to a more lucrative Shakespeare's with an unbeatable advantage.

    I kept the 4-turn pace with Magnetism, bought Metallurgy and Economics from the Ottomans (good guys :D) and then went for the final research, Gravity. In 780 AD my Middle Ages were over, and i could also buy Military Tradition once again from the Ottomans. In the very same turn i completed Shakespeare and turned to Newton, which would be complete the next turn thanks to a spare leader. The three AS got each one a different freebie, and most importantly Babylon got Nationalism. By selling off all i had i had good chances to trade for it and buy all the rest.

    INDUSTRIAL AND MODERN AGES
    --------------------------

    I rushbuilt Newton's as planned, then went back to Magellan, but with very low chances to actually build it. However, if the tech pace was fast enough, i could use it as a prebuild for an Industrial wonder. The attack went on, research went on as well and after three turns on Nationalism i could buy it from Babylon and collect the other two first-tier techs as well. A pleasant surprise was the presence of coal: Paris was switched immediately to Iron Works, even if it meant to forego Magellan's.

    An added bonus of the Spanish campaign was the capture of a city that had just completed Magellan. In 880 AD Spain was no more and i immediately started to pluck England and America. A third leader came up and it was used to form an army and score an army victory. Paris completed IW and begun to build Heroic Epic. One turn before its completion, Smith was built in Istanbul, so i was out of prebuilds. For the first time in centuries Paris built a non-cultural building, a bank.

    I sped up Electricity (which i gave away to everyone) and then i went fast for Industrialization in order to get enough of a head start for Universal Suffrage. I completed it in just 10 turns (IW is great!), built a factory and a hospital. Meanwhile, the 4th leader of the game allowed me to finally build my new capital in Hastings and from now on i could use the Palace prebuild in Paris.

    By now, the building potential of Paris had become enormous. I netted Evolution as well (the very same turn i moved my capital) and got another lucky shot by immediately obtaining the 5th leader, that i used to rush Hoover Dam. At that point i had netted all the IA wonders and the rest of the IA was a rush to build all the minor wonders i could and, at the same time, complete the IA as fast as i could. Toward the end of the age i run out of wonders to build, but i could use the free turns to build a stock exchange and a commercial dock.

    On the military side, things went smoothly with the demise of England (1050 AD) and America (1160 AD). In 1335 AD, with the purchase of Flight from the Chinese i made it into the Modern Ages. Both Persia and the Ottomans got Computers, while Babylon got Ecology, but i was at war with them because the pesky Vikings had dragged them in. I researched Rocketry, made peace with Babylon, traded the freebies and turned my palace prebuild into SETI. Successive goals were Miniaturization and Genetics. Scandinavia was gone in 1425 AD and, after the 20 turns of peace expired, i got rid of what remained of Babylon as well.

    With the help of two more leaders, i could build all the Modern wonders as well and then i turned into the remaining small wonders. As nobody was controlling all the necessary resources to build a spaceship (and i had no intention at all of trading them), my plan was to just give up the conquest (in order to save some time) and be milking my game up to 20k, with an open eye on the Chinese and Ottomans borders, but at some point China obtained a source of aluminium and started building spaceship part. To be honest i almost lost my game because of that: when i checked on the spaceship race, for pure fun, i discovered that China had 5 components build and the remaining 5 under construction!!!

    I assembled a force as fast as i could and stormed China with all my might. Their reaction was brutal, and i immediately collected a buttload of war weariness to the point that i had to run at 60% luxury rate! But, most importantly, i could destroy their spaceship just in time. I took over all of China, then donated a part of it to the Celts (which were my good buddies for the whole game) and then just sat at 1 tile below the domination limit until the 20k was reached.

    The end result is a 20k victory in 1758 AD, for a Firaxis score slightly above the 10k mark and a Jason score of 8k plus something.

    Here are some logs:

    Complete tech progression:

    4000bc: Masonry, Alphabet (prerequisites)
    2550bc: Ceremonial Burial (trade, India);
    2150bc: Writing (research); Bronze Working, Warrior Code (trade, Persia);
    1950bc: Iron Working (trade, Persia);
    1500bc: Code of Laws (research); Wheel, Mysticism (trade, Ottomans); Pottery (trade, India); Horse Riding (trade, Persia);
    1125bc: Literature (research); Philosophy (trade, Persia);
    _950bc: Map Making (trade, Ottomans);
    _630bc: Republic (research); Mathematics (trade, India);
    _250bc: Polytheism, Construction, Currency (Great Library);

    _250bc: Monotheism, Feudalism (Great Library);
    __10bc: Monarchy (Great Library);
    _210ad: Engineering (research); Theology (trade, Ottomans);
    _280ad: Chivalry (Great Library);
    _370ad: Invention (Great Library); Education (trade, Ottomans);
    _420ad: Music Theory (research);
    _480ad: Astronomy (trade, Ottomans);
    _500ad: Gunpowder (trade, Scandinavia);
    _550ad: Printing Press (trade, Spain);
    _580ad: Navigation (research);
    _600ad: Banking (trade, Ottomans);
    _660ad: Chemistry (trade, England);
    _700ad: Physics (research); Democracy (trade, Persia); Free Artistry (trade, Ottomans);
    _740ad: Magnetism (research); Metallurgy, Economics (trade, Ottomans);
    _780ad: Theory of Gravity (research); Military Tradition (trade, Ottomans);

    _810ad: Nationalism (trade, Babylon); Steam Power (trade, Persia); Medicine (trade, China);
    _900ad: Electricity (research); Communism (trade, Persia);
    _940ad: Sanitation (research);
    _980ad: Industrialization (research);
    1020ad: Corporation (research); Replaceable Parts (trade, China);
    1060ad: Scientific Method (trade, Ottomans);
    1120ad: Steel (research);
    1150ad: Atomic Theory, Electronics (ToE);
    1230ad: Refining (research);
    1265ad: Combustion (research);
    1290ad: Espionage (trade, Babylon);
    1305ad: Radio (research); Mass Production (trade, Ottomans);
    1325ad: Motorized Transportation (research);
    1335ad: Flight (trade, China);

    1365ad: Rocketry (research);
    1370ad: Computers (trade, China); Ecology (trade, Babylon); Amphibious War (trade, Persia);
    1395ad: Miniaturization (research);
    1420ad: Genetics (research);
    1430ad: Space Flight (trade, Ottomans); Fission (trade, Persia);
    1440ad: Recycling (research);
    1465ad: Nuclear Power (research); Satellites (trade, Ottomans);
    1485ad: Laser (research); Superconductor (trade, Ottomans);
    1500ad: Synthetic Fibers (trade, Persia);
    1525ad: Smart Weapons (research);
    1550ad: Integrated Defense (research);
    1580ad: Stealth (research); Advanced Flight (trade, Ottomans);


    Cities up to QSC:

    4000bc: Paris
    3050bc: Orleans
    2190bc: Lyons
    1990bc: Rheims
    1450bc: Tours

    1425bc: Marseilles (furs);
    1150bc: Chartres
    1050bc: Avignon


    Meetings:

    2550bc: India
    2150bc: Ottomans, Persia
    __10bc: everything else


    Kills:

    _430ad: India
    _880ad: Spain
    1050ad: England
    1160ad: America
    1425ad: Scandinavia
    1510ad: Babylon
    1675ad: China


    20k progression:

    4000bc: Palace
    2470bc: temple
    1200bc: Pyramids
    _950bc: library
    _270bc: Great Library
    _210bc: colosseum
    __90bc: cathedral
    _410ad: Sistine Chapel
    _430ad: Bach's (leader)
    _610ad: Copernicus
    _640ad: university
    _780ad: Shakespeare's
    _790ad: Newton's (leader)
    _880ad: Iron Works
    _910ad: Heroic Epic
    1080ad: Universal Suffrage
    1150ad: Theory of Evolution - palace is gone
    1160ad: Hoover Dam (leader)
    1230ad: Military Academy
    1255ad: Wall Street
    1280ad: Battlefield Medicine
    1305ad: Intelligence Agency
    1375ad: SETI Program
    1420ad: The Internet / research lab
    1430ad: Cure for Cancer (leader)
    1445ad: United Nations (leader)
    1475ad: Manhattan Project
    1495ad: Apollo Program
    1500ad: Longevity (leader)
    1545ad: The Pentagon
    1565ad: Strategic Missile Defense
    1758ad: 20k

    A shot of Paris in the victory turn; the research bar was raised just to show its potential:

    gotm156-end.jpg
     
  13. Lanzelot

    Lanzelot Moderator Moderator

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    As far as I can see, you did not build the FP in Paris, so why did you move the Palace?! Just to be able to use it as prebuild?? Aren't the 400s of an Army enough as a prebuild?
     
  14. tR1cKy

    tR1cKy taking over the world

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    Correct. I built the FP in Lyons (NEx4). I moved the capital mainly to have a better, more powerful, core of productive cities. And while the 400s of an army are a nice prebuild, the 1000s of a palace are much better :D
     

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