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GOTM 191 Spoiler

Discussion in 'Civ2 - Game of the Month' started by Ali Ardavan, Aug 8, 2017.

  1. Ali Ardavan

    Ali Ardavan Mathematician Moderator Civ2 GOTM Staff

    Joined:
    May 29, 2002
    Messages:
    2,930
    Location:
    Michigan, USA
    This was posted 2 months ago and no spoiler yet?

    I started playing last night. Went for the visible hut hoping for a unit and instead got 50g. Was going to apply that towards a quicker size 1 settler. Meanwhile something unprecedented in years of playing Civ2 happened: I got not one, not two, but three advanced tribes (plus a unit) out of my next huts. By -3000 I have 4 cities, 3 from advanced tribes.
     
  2. Jokemaster

    Jokemaster Insert something here

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2010
    Messages:
    524
    Wowza, that luck. Never heard of that either!


    GOTM191. Japanese, 40*50, restarts off. Quick EC, like everyone else. On the bright side, I just got a job! YAAAY!!!... for only six months. Nice economy you got there… Anyhow, size1 required.

    4000 BC: Pop hut: Archers. At least I did get a unit, which is average. Uncover buffalo.

    3950 BC: Hut: NONE horsemen. Not average anymore!

    3900 BC: Build Kyoto at (26, 22) Will have a settler ready in 13 turns.

    Interturn: Meet Chinese Chariot. Icy Chinese offer peace. Probably since I literally had nothing to offer in tribute.

    3850 BC: > Alphabet. Chinese capital seems to be 8 squares north of Kyoto.

    3750 BC: We have 5 civs minimum. Find inoccupied Chinese capital… we sack it. Steal Masonry. The World of Jules Verne is promptly replaced by Funeral March. Been a while since I had music on. Sadly, I only have 13 tracks instead of the 45-something you find on Youtube… weird. Anyone else? (4civs left)

    3700 BC: Forgot to rush 1s in Kyoto after sacking Beijing. Whoopsie.

    3500 BC: Find a hut, but will wait to pop it. Don’t want to endanger my size1.

    3300 BC: Find another hut. 2 turns until size1 settler.

    3200 BC: Kyoto size1. Hut: Horseman. Hut: Pottery. Well, that was not worth it.

    3150 BC: Osaka built.

    3100 BC: Hut: BARBS!

    Interturn: Lose my archer to barb horseman. Only unit east, and best attacker. Big loss.

    3000 BC: Alphabet > Burial.

    2950 BC: Nobody home in the NE… Hut: BARBS. Risk attacking inside a jungle, horse in red HP but vet. Still a bad outcome.

    2900 BC: Hut: BARBS AGAIN. This time I’m on a mountain. I should live with the 200% defense bonus if I’m not unlucky.

    Interturn: AAAAAAND I’m unlucky. Of course. Nothing can ever go right in this game. (Except the Chinese falling over.)

    2750 BC: Osaka 2nd Warriors, will start building Settlers now. After all this exploration, I still have only 2 cities.

    2600 BC: Hut: 50g. Finally a good outcome. Edo built. A bit far, but I need to get my cities on rivers to get the free road pre-BB. Especially important during EC games.

    2550 BC: Burial > CoL. Hut: 100g! Nice.

    2500 BC: Rush a settler for 52g in Osaka. Neither of Osaka warriors are near anything.

    2350 BC: Hut: BARBS. At least it was my Vet horseman, which dispatches it easily. More healing tho…

    2300 BC: Satsuma built. (36, 34) warrior near Thebes.

    2200 BC: CoL > BW. Hut: BW. Hut: BARBS. At least it was not the Egypt bound warrior, but holy. 5/12 Barb outcomes, jesus.

    2150 BC: > Monarchy. Meet Egyptian settler: trade for Mysticism, peace.

    2000 BC: Can’t find the Egyptian capital anywhere…



    STATUS AT 2000 BC: (Beginning of 42nd turn)

    Population: 6 0.000 Cities: 4 Government: Despotism Total advances: 7 (researching Mon)
    Gold: 64 T4L0S6 Income/Cost per turn: 4 income, 0 cost. Production: 11MT 0 polluted tiles
    Wonders: None.

    Chinese: Dead

    Egyptians: Peace

    Others: Not met.



    GOALS: Swap to Monarchy, expand, get Trade and Map Making, explore the map. Most likely not getting Marco’s soon.
     
  3. grigor

    grigor Chieftain

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2001
    Messages:
    353
    Beginning until Monarchy

    So, with Restarts off and a small map, of course early conquest!!
    But no starting techs means getting to Monarchy is a priority.

    Plan: Found first city on a river; no size in the interest of faster science; plan to research HB as the off-tech.
    Try to conquer with Elephants. If not practice, we must wait for Mono, which would need HG and MC. Another possible tech plan is is Feud/Sun Tzu, depending on huts
    MPE may be necessary to find all the cities from the AI.

    4000 First conundrum: Pop the hut or not? Science will be 2 turns later, but no options are bad. (Money is great, and If WC, go Feud/Sun Tzu/Knights) So: Hut: NONE Horse. Good. I can pop one more hut.
    3950 Hut: Chariot. Excellent – maybe I will be able to get rid of an AI civ early. Plus, I can still pop a hut. Move back to river,
    3900 Kyoto founded. Working shielded grass river.
    3850* Res Alph
    3800 Chinese settler found. We seem to be near Beijing. WAR.
    3750 Unoccupied Beijing found. Beijing razed, Chinese Destroyed. We take HB. Now for sure pop no huts till Monarchy.

    3450* Alph => Hey, I thought I would get something towards Monarchy! Go for Writing (Library)
    3350 Kyoto size 2
    3200 Kyoto Settler. Egyptians: trade Alph for CB. Peace. They have Masonry too.
    3150 Osaka Founded.

    Status 3000BC
    2C 32 Techs, res Wri (22/36)
    1 Horse, 1 Chariot


    2800 Wri => CoL (2/45)
    2700 Memphis found.
    2650* Egyptians give me 25g.
    2600 Thebes found.
    2550 We withdraw. There will be time.
    2450* 2 more settlers. Kyoto is building a library now.
    2300 Edo.
    2250* CoL => MM, maybe the Egyptians will give it to us. This is the slowest I have been to Monarchy in a long time! Egypt: get 100g. Satsuma (4)
    2200 Egypt: get MM in tribute. Buy Library.
    2150 Res Monarchy (19/84).
    2000 Egypt develops Monarchy. We will get it in tribute eventually. Egypt: 100g.

    Status 2000BC
    4C, 0 Sett. 6 Tech res Monarchy.
    1 Horse, 1 Chariot. 1 library.


    Goal for 1500
    Monarchy.
    Then HB or Trade
    ICS to 8 cities
    Plan for taking out Chinese.

    1950 Egypt: 50g.
    1900 Egypt: Monarchy (as advertised). Revolution.
    1850* gov: Monarchy. Hut popping can start.
     
  4. grigor

    grigor Chieftain

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2001
    Messages:
    353
    Monarchy to Trade

    1800 Hut: Kagoshima. Res Poly.
    1750 Barbs land near Kagoshima.
    1700 Chariot kills one archer => Vet. Takes out other archer easily. Hut: Archer (Osaka).
    1650* Poly => BW. Egypt: 50g. More barbs near Kagoshima.
    1600 French start Pyramids. Nara (6)
    1550 Chariot takes out one archer. Other one bribed for Egyptian attack. Egypt: Masonry.
    1500 Nagoya (7). Hut: Pottery. Egypt: WAR.
    Status 1500BC
    7C, 0 Sett. 10 Tech res BW.
    1 Warr, 2 Archer, 1 Horse, 1 Chariot, 1 dip, 1 Elephant.
    .

    Plan for 1000
    Trade
    Take out Egyptians
    Find French and Russians.
    HG, Pyr should be planned.

    1450* Bribe barb horse (NONE)
    1350 hut: Nomads.
    1300 Barb leader 150g.
    1200 Thebes captured. Memphis captured. Hut: BW.
    1150 res Curr. Egypt: take all gold. Give Wri and BW for their map. They have only one city left.
    1100 Curr => Trade.
    1050* Heliopolis bribed x2. Get a Barracks! Egypt Destroyed. Hut 50g.

    Status 1000BC
    10C, 3 Sett 11 tech res Trade
    5 Warr, 3 Archer, 2 horse, 1 Chariot, 2 Ellie, 1 dip.


    How did I do?
    Trade - looks like about 7 turns.
    Take out Egyptians - √
    Find French and Russians. – not yet
    HG, Pyr should be planned.- Next cycle.

    Plan for 750
    Trade
    If Russians are not found, MPE
    Otherwise, HG or Pyr.
    Develop home: connect 4 cities
    Egypt needs roads and some irr. Yse the NONE settler and a Thebes settler to irrigate a Heliopolis square. Then mine coal. Memphis settler to build 4th city.
    Heliopolis will build a vet Ellie, then dip. hopefully there will be a place to rehome it.


    975 Hut: 50g.
    925* Barbs land near Egypt. Russians: get 200g. They have IW.
    900 Ellie kills barbs. Izumo (12) Russians checkmate my NONE chariot. Horse finds barbs. Uh-oh…
    875 Horse dies. Russian archer takes out the rest of the barb horses. Chariot is released.
    825* Trade => Lit .
     
  5. grigor

    grigor Chieftain

    Joined:
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    Trade to MC

    750 Nagasaki (15)
    Status 750 BC
    12C, 7 Sett 13 tech res Lit
    8 Warr, 3 Archer, 2 horse, 1 Chariot, 3 Ellie, 1 dip.
    2 vans.


    How did I do?
    Trade -√
    If Russians are not found, MPE - we get a wonder in two turns.
    Develop home: connect 4 cities - √
    Egypt development -. √
    Heliopolis Ellie - √

    Plan for 500
    Russians: find cities. Will 2 ellies, 1 archer, a horse and a dip be enough? I think not with legions defending. Need 2 more ellies and 1 more dip,
    Temple in Kyoto, also HG
    Build MPE after HG.
    Home: 1 round settlers, then spam vans to be ready for Mono.
    Egypt: 2 elephants and 1dip, then settlers
    Lit, Myst, Phil, Mono.

    725* Orleans builds Pyr. Yokohama (14)
    700 Russian leader immolates on wounded vet Archer on a mountain. Hut: 50g.
    675 French start Copernicus. Heliopolis mine finished.
    650 HG in Kyoto. Shimonoseki. Russians kill dip.
    625* Lit => Myst.
    600 French: peace, trade Lit and Trade for Myst, Astro. They also have Wheel and IW,. Kiev found
    575 Researching Philosophy
    550 Matsuyama. Kiev captured (29g, IW). Russians: 100g for peace.
    500 Barracks in Kiev.
    Status 500BC
    16C, 8 Sett HG 17 tech res Phil
    10 Warr, 3 Archer, 2 horse, 1 Chariot, 6 Ellie,
    2 vans.


    How did I do?
    Russians: find cities. - √ Kiev captured.
    Temple in Kyoto, also HG - √
    MPE with next round. maybe
    Home: 1 round settlers, then spam vans to be ready for Mono - Settlers done
    Egypt: 2 elephants and 1dip, then settlers - √
    Lit, Myst, Phil, Mono. - Researching Phil

    Plan for 250BC
    Mono, MC, MPE. 8 vans in home are building. Maybe MPE in Egypt?
    Expand to 25 cities (+9) - some from Russia
    Take out Russians if possible.
    Find French. They seem to be in the NW.
    Organize conquest of French. Orleans has Pyr in it so that should be first.

    475 Sapporo. Hakodate. Ise.
    450 Paris, Orleans found. Hut: Elephant (Matsuyama)
    425* French: Gift tech, get Wheel. So that Mono will be available upon Philosophy.
    400 Toyama
    375 Phil, Mono => Republic. Russians break cease-fire, immolate on Archer. Fukushima. Suo. St, Petersburg found. Set Science to 30.
    350 Hut: 25g.
    325* French sneak attack. Hut: 50g. St Petersburg captured (Math)
    300 Russians: 50g for peace.
    275 Barbs near Fukushima. Bizen.
    250 Russians: WAR. Moscow destroyed. Warrior Code. Russians destroyed.

    Status 250 BC
    24C, 2 Sett HG 22 tech res Rep
    22 Warr, 1 Phalanx, 3 Archer, 3 horse, 1 Chariot, 7 Ellie, 2 Crooks, 1 dip.
    1 Trireme, 3 vans.


    How did I do?
    Mono, MC, MPE. – vans delivered for MC. 3 of 4 on the way for Colossus. 1 of 4 on the way for MPE.
    25 cities (+9) - some from Russia - √ minus - only 24.
    Take out Russians? - √
    find French. - √ Orleans is on a river and will need some muscle..


    Plan for 0 AD
    Finish game
    Pyr (Conquer), MC, MPE, Colossus, maybe more.
    Switch to Republic and grow.

    225* Osaka builds MC. Hut: 50g. Science up to 70.

    I was not able to finish before 1AD, so there is an opening for green star.
     
  6. Jokemaster

    Jokemaster Insert something here

    Joined:
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    Messages:
    524
    An opening which I will most likely miss. My game speed was quite poor. Don`t remember why. Maybe should have went The Wheel and been more aggro early?


    1850 BC: Still cannot find for the life of me, Egyptian capital!

    1800 BC: Hut: Settlers. That’s decent. Osaka settlers.

    1750 BC: Find Egyptian city of Memphis, undefended. It’s on a river, so I decide to break my treaty again. Barb chariot east of Kagoshima… Well dang, Egyptians decided to demand treaty from me even if I have unit right next to them.

    That’s nice!
    In both senses of the word. Sack Memphis for 40g. Nara built.

    Interturn: More barbs near Kagoshima. Well crap.

    1700 BC: Hut: Map Making. Will delay Monarchy, but at least I have it. Still need a city that’s connected to ocean mass 1.. which I do not have. Nagoya built

    1650 BC: Barb horsemen seem to be going after Egypt: only the chariot is going after Kagoshima. I’ll try a cheap defense outside boundaries, but will most likely have to pay tribute. Izumo built.

    1600 BC: Monarchy > HBR. Oedo year 1650 BC.

    1550 BC: Finally find irrigation in suspected Egypt lands.

    1500 BC: More Barbs near Kagoshima. Egypt gives me 135g for peace. Not so cocky now, eh?

    1450 BC: Finally dispatch last Barbs near Kagoshima. Forgot to swap to Monarchy.

    1350 BC: Most likely Paris, east of Nagoya?

    1300 BC: Hut: 100g. REVOLUTION.

    1250 BC; Monarchy established. Barbs near Satsuma.

    1200 BC: Hut: Archers.

    1150 BC: Nagasaki built. Yokohama built, port city.

    1050 BC: HBR > Polytheism. Find Egyptian Heliopolis. Lose a warrior fighting Barb archer. Shimonoseki built. Matsuyama built.

    950 BC: Archer is attacked by Barb archer, survives and becomes vet.



    STATUS AT 1000 BC: (End of 62nd turn)

    Population: 160.000 Cities: 12 Government: Monarchy Total advances: 11 (researching Poly)
    Gold: 32 T4L0S6 Income/Cost per turn: 10 income, 0 cost. Production: 36MT 0 polluted tiles
    Wonders: None.
    Chinese: Dead
    Egyptians: Peace
    Others: Not met.

    GOALS: Get Trade and Marco’s, and some form of army for Moscow and Paris. Thebes is on a river, so expand by land near Egyptians since I will need plenty of army for them. (Save for last?) A good road network as well!

    900 BC: Satsuma riots. One warrior is near St. Petersburg, and I seem to have missed the French. Bad performance. Sapporo built. Poly > Trade at some point.

    850 BC; Meet Russians: They are far SE of the map. Get maps, peace, and 100g. 2 cities.

    825 BC: Hakodate built. Hut: BARBS. Nowhere, thankfully, and I can get back to my boat.

    725 BC: Ise built.

    700 BC: Hut: 50g. Hut: Math.

    675 BC: Toyama built. Find French NE: Trade for Seafaring and Writing. No maps.

    650 BC: Fukushima built.

    600 BC: French start Pyramids. Trade > Literacy. Share maps with French. They have 5 cities.

    575 BC: T7L0S3. Paris only one defender. If I can hurry up… probably won’t be able to.
    Interturn: Warrior survives Barb horseman with 1hp.

    550 BC: Suo built.

    525 BC: Bizen built. Some vans starting to be ready… for what? HG?

    500 BC: Echisen built. Egypt: Share maps.


    STATUS AT 500 BC: (End of 81nd turn)

    Population: 400.000 Cities: 20 Government: Monarchy Total advances: 16 (researching Lit)
    Gold: 45 T7L0S3 Income/Cost per turn: 39 income, 0 cost. Production: 59MT 0 polluted tiles
    Wonders: None.
    Chinese: Dead
    Others: Peace.



    Obtained all I need. Plan is to hit Paris and send troops to fight there. Try to get a small boat expedition to Moscow, bribe StPete afterwards. Egypt for last.
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2017
  7. grigor

    grigor Chieftain

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2001
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    Jokemaster, I think you may be ahead of me. Even with missing your first crack at Monarchy, you have French maps and 4 more cities than I did at 500. By that time I had not even found the French! I was closer to Mono, though, and my best turnset was from 500bc to 250bc. So good luck! I found the terrain very challenging, and I don't think I played it elegantly at all.

    I like your conquest plan of saving the closest AI for last. Peaster plays that way with great success. I have never been able to resist taking out the near civs when I find them.
     
  8. Jokemaster

    Jokemaster Insert something here

    Joined:
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    Messages:
    524
    Me neither. I am well aware of Peaster`s exploits with EC: but I find that farthest-out-first is not always feasible when a very high amount of civs is in game, or when you don't have a very good start. It usually ends up with one early close-by conquest first, solely to increase the production base.
    If I can manage a settler/trireme, and send them to each enemy civ, it`s more feasible: but higher number also means more competition for wonders, MPE being more crucial, and such and such. (Can`t send vans for trade if you need to snag HG/Lighthouse/Marco`s at home: which kinda nerfs the settler strategy.)
    In this game, it was more feasible due to lower number of civs (Chinese down early) + Egyptians losing a city early. Not as much of a threat.


    Also, small spoiler: it was not the Egyptians who were last to fall. It was the Russians. Egypt had more focus than usual, since Thebes built walls as a rivered city. Needed quite a few dips to bring them down. Still a believer in your game being faster than mine.

    Edit: Just noticed you did take down Russians! That is quite a good point in your favour. One less enemy to worry about.

    500-250 BC:


    450 BC: Izumi built.

    425 BC: Omi built.

    400 BC: KYOTO HG. Will attack Paris next turn. Hopefully a recruit ellie can kill a single Archer… Echigo built.

    375 BC: Lyons has 2 units defending… and is size4. Will probably use a dip to bribe the city once I declare war. Attack… SERIOUSLY. I lose an Ellie, and a catapult is sitting right next to Paris as well. This is disaster. Best case scenario… I get the city for only a few turns. Worst case scenario, lose this first attack and the element of surprise. Damn it!

    Interturn: French kill my horseman, but no new units nearby.

    350 BC: Conquer Paris for 47g+Barracks. Catapult disappears. No idea what was the logic of that. Sado built.

    325 BC: Hut: Astronomy.

    Interturn: French propose cease-fire. I accept, since they had an elephant near Paris.

    300 BC: It will take 335g to bribe Lyons. Since the city is on a river, I am not a fan of attacking conventionally, would be too bloody. At least the break will allow me to get troops in as well. Update Egyptian maps.

    275 BC: Naples built.

    EDIT 2: Wait, why the early library in Kyoto? Wasn`t a settler or two going to be more useful? Even trying to research Monarchy... 0_o
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2017
  9. grigor

    grigor Chieftain

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2001
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    Early library - somebody noticed!

    What a crummy plan. I thought it would get me to Monarchy faster. (As it happened, I got monarchy in trade from Egypt). Also, I thought Kyoto was so strapped for growth that an extra settler might cripple it. I had built much of the library the hard way, so it was a crummy plan long in the making. When I got the 100g from Egypt, I only had 3 small cities, all with slow growth rates, so the settler plan seemed fraught. But at the very least 2 dips in Kyoto would have sped up the exploring and I might have found the French earlier. And three dips would have obviated the need for MPE. Maybe I'll try that next time we get a restarts off conquest game with nasty terrain.

    I was also remembering the Sioux game from about a year ago. But in that game Chicago had special status and a gold mine, so the early library was a winning strategy. But in this game, the rivers were not enough to make the library pay, and as proof of that, I was only one tech ahead of you by 500AD.
     
  10. Jokemaster

    Jokemaster Insert something here

    Joined:
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    524
    175 BC: THEBES CITY WALLS. That is going to require attention. And dips.

    125 BC: Literacy > Philosophy. Cunaxa built. Cremona built.Now getting a force rebuilt in France.

    100 BC: Update Russian maps: hi Kiev.

    75 BC: Cannae built. Russian invasion force has some ellies ashore: going back to get 2 more. Sell Barracks in Paris for 40g: bribe Lyons for 397g, get 85ish back+Barracks and Vet Ellie+Catapult after getting them to declare war.

    50 BC: Kill defender in Reims: city stormed for 28g.



    STATUS AT 1AD: (End of 101st turn)

    Population: 1.090.000 Cities: 33 Government: Monarchy Total advances: 19 (researching Philo)
    Gold: 180 T7L0S3 Income/Cost per turn: 50 income, 0 cost. Production: 13MT 0 polluted tiles
    Wonders: HG.

    Chinese: Dead
    French: Soon dead.
    Others: Peace.



    Only things that are required are a single dip for StPetersburg (for the sake of speed+reliability), and more for Thebes’ walls. Aiming for a sub-200AD finish. Kind of ambitious tho…
     
  11. WildPony

    WildPony Chieftain

    Joined:
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    192
    Location:
    Southern California, USA
    Beautiful : ).
     
  12. WildPony

    WildPony Chieftain

    Joined:
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    Messages:
    192
    Location:
    Southern California, USA
    My plan as in most instances to play a civ building game towards Republic then trade unless redirected by circumstances. With one starting settler i plan as well to build a size one settler unless circumstances dictate otherwise.

    First hut in 4000 bc - none horse. 2nd hut: none horse. 3rd hut: none horse : ). Had found a buffalo just east to access from a grass river for a size one settler, but given the added exploration, a silk to the west was found for a much better size one option. Settler walked to get there and my Cap with silk and oasis access was ready to build on grass river 19/27 in 3750. Having found another hut, i waited before building and opened up a none archer. Then explored further and found another hut delaying my city build for another turn, opening up a 4th none horse. With no additional huts in sight, finally built cap in 3650.
    3650 Status: 1 city, and an exceedingly rare 4 none horses and one 1 none archer. 51,000 land area. 0 gold.
    3600: > Alphabet.
    3550: hut-50g. rush settler production from 6 shields to 10 for 8g leaving a balance of 46.
    3450: Hut - another horse, but it is a barbarian. My horse kills it with it's 2nd movement, but barely.
    3400: Alphabet > Code . 7th hut: 50g and now able to rush settler to completion. Meet Chinese: I decline offer for masonry and accept peace. I refrain from demanding tribute because they might tribute me masonry. Want to keep opening huts until i am forced to my one off path tech.
    3350 Meet Egypt. They offer peace and i decline. They offer 100G for it and i accept. This is enough gold for a quick 2nd size one settler before building 02. Will not open the hut i found until 2nd settler emerges at the risk of it being a tribe. Jockey for position so the Chinese warrior can't open the hut which is meant for me : ).
    3300: next hut: 50g. Not enough to rush another size one settler. 2nd size one settler emerges and moves to where 03 will be. 1st size one settler builds grass/river 02 which shares access to the silk.
    3250: 03 built on grass/river 16/28 with access to a bull. Gold reserves 47.
    3200: 3rd settler production rushed to 10 shields as the two before it. Gold reserves: 14. Hut : Tribe 9 steps west and north of cap for 04 at 8/20. Placement could have been a bit better, but is pretty good on a plain that accesses a whale.
    3150: Code > Writing
    3100: 4th city rushes settler production from 4 to 10 and gold reserves dip to 9. My horse opens next hut on hilltop and it's a barbarian horse which my horse may or may not survive.
    3050: My horse was defeated.

    3000 status: 4 cities (all size 1 for the moment) , 0 settlers, production of settlers in all 4 cities is about half way. 2 techs, 3 horses, 1 archer, 141,000 land area, Income: 7 science, 5 gold, 9 shields. Gold reserves, 17.
     
  13. WildPony

    WildPony Chieftain

    Joined:
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    Messages:
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    Location:
    Southern California, USA
    2950: Writing > Masonry. Chose Masonry instead of bronze as my off path tech towards Republic because the Chinese have it and i can trade them for it. Will hold back on huts at least until research on Republic is underway. Hailed Chinese, they offered to trade techs and the Japanese procure masonry as hoped. Settler production in cap rushed from 24 to 30. Treasury: 11 gold.
    pre-2900: French horse approaches a Japanese horse and offers Warrior Code which is declined. They offer peace and this is accepted (lest i risk losing my horse).
    2900: Masonry > Lit. Size one 16 food settler production in 02 rushed from 24-30. Treasury: 3 gold.
    2800: Cap completes settler which moves towards separate river which is 2 steps north and east and will for now delay the roading of the plain which will adjoin the two rivers. status: 4 cities, 1 settler. Settler production in size one 18 food 03 rushed from 26 to 30. Treasury: 4 gold.
    2750: Build 05 on grass/river end 20/24 with oasis and wheat access. 02 completes settler, status: 5 cities, 1 settler. Settler production in size one 04 with 20 food rushed from 26 to 30. I feel that each of these minor or major city management tinkerings make a positive impact on the the outcome of the game, but i will not further mention these details in this log. Treasury: 5 gold. French horse which i was trying to avoid due to this very possibility sneak attacks and kills my horse. Now we Japanese are down from 4 horses to 2.
    2700: Lit > Republic. Undisturbed, Republic will easily complete in the 2250 oedo year. Build 06 at grass/river tip 15/33 with wheat access. 03 completes settler, status: 6 cities, 1 settler, 2 horses, 1 archer. Japanese horse finds and for the time being avoids a risky hut that is near my civ at plain 14/22 with an adjacent mountain at 16/22. The scenario i imagine is opening the hut with a horses first movement point and having a barb horse emerge on the mountain top that can not be killed and which would proceed to kill my own horse. Or worse yet, multiple barb units emerging, killing my horse and then threatening my core cities. I look the map over more carefully and notice island "2" slightly east which could prove highly strategic as a future self trade partner, especially if one or more of the future island cities demand hides. A 22/6 grass/whale city would provide the transportation. Plan to soon lay road on 3 immediately usable high food squares, two wheats and an oasis.
    2600: 6 cities, 1 settler, 16 gold.
    2550: Road on plain built which connects river end cities from 2 separate rivers.
    2500: 04 completes settler.

    2500 status: 6 cities, 2 settlers, 2 horses, 1 archer. Despotism with Republic almost certainly 5 turns away and Sci is reduced to 40%. 171,000 land area.

    2450: Build grass/river 07 at 23/23. Pirates including 2 archers land fairly nearby and fortunately my own archer is nearby as what might contribute to the solution. Will likely need a diplomat for the complete solution.
    2450 Status: 7 cities, 1 settler, 39 gold.
    2350: build 08, grass/whale 11/17. Find mountain hut and wait until at least 2250 to open it. Slow sci to 20% to correctly time oedo.
    2300: My archer protecting the west kills one of two barb archers in a surprisingly easy battle and becomes a vet. The other archer stacked with an explorer heads east towards my defenseless core and is only 2 steps away from city 03. I have rushed a dip in this city so i won't lost the accumulated shields and If the barbs continue heading east next turn as expected my plan will be to re-home my dip and allow them to capture 03... and the following turn i will bribe the city which will contain an archer and explorer (which will morph to a diplomat) back for a net profit of approximately 43 gold. The math is as follows. Costs to bribe back my city is 26 gold plus a dip valued at 75 gold, plus 2 lost shields valued at 4 gold, plus one tax and one science (one gold value each) = a total cost of 107 gold. After bribing the city back at this overall cost of 107 gold, the Japanese end up with 2 units valued at a total of 150 gold so the net profit here is 43 gold as opposed to a net loss of 50 gold which is what it would have cost to pay them tribute to avoid having the city sacked. So it's actually preferential for the barbs to capture the city. Capital reaches size two and surprisingly the city revolts.
    2250: Republic > Bronze. Taxes to 80%. Barbs do step next to Japanese city 03. 03 Dip completes, abandons the city, re-homes and stands by. New barb i will attain will partner with my initial archer to open the risky hut at 14/22. Horse opens mountain hut at 15/5 and a none horse emerges.

    2250 status: Republic, 8 cities, 0 settlers, 3 horse, 1 Dip, 1 archer, 39 Gold. Income: 32 gold, 8 beakers, 20 shields. 187,000 land area.
    Between turns: Barbs capture 03. I didn't have enough gold for them to offer me a choice.
    2200: Dip bribes city back for 26 gold. Since city is now in revolt which i hadn't accounted for, the added cost is 5 trade and one shield of lost income a total value of 7g... So the total net cost of this endeavor was actually 114 gold and total net profit was 36. /// Timing is such that both Japanese archers will be able to surround the 14/22 hut at the same time in two turns and the dip will be extra well supported in opening the hut with the archers ready to attack as necessary the same turn. More than likely the outcome will not be barbs, but if it turns out to be so, the Japanese will be prepared.
    2200 status: 8 cities, 0 settlers, 3 horse, 2 archer, 1 dip, 8 gold.
    2150: I remember that i am still at war with the French and approach them. They offer cease fire and i decline but senate overrules me. They offer peace and i decline, they offer 50 gold for peace and i accept. Then i offer to trade tech and they offer Bronze which fulfills my hopes. I am shocked to find that they have 6 techs: bronze, cer, horse, myst, warrior code and wheel. Of all the choices i want and aquire only Bronze at this time. Seek to trade techs with Chinese and they offer ceremonial which i decline because i feel it's unlikely that they will have currency or even pottery as a secondary priority. Approached Egypt for tech trades. They offered Map Making which i decided to accept and as well to look at their list which contained nothing else. Gifted them to worshipful and traded maps with them. Their exploration is not all that i had hoped, but it's better than nothing. Back to the French who were fed up and wouldn't talk. Back to the Chinese, gifted them to worshipful and traded maps which uncovers a moderately decent bit of land : ). Various rushes to 20 and 30 of 40. Gold spent down to 9.
    2100: Bronze > Currency. Taxes still at 80% for now with 20% Science. Income: 24 gold, 7 Sci. Approach French, gift them to worshipful and trade maps and theirs is fairly substantial. With archers in place, dip is primed to open the hut next turn. Horse opens a different hut: supported legion. 2nd horse opens another hut: 50 gold.
    2050: After a good wait since the last settler was completed, (450 years/9 turns) 2 settlers emerge this turn. Dip opens the risky nearby hut and a supported legion emerges which is the 2nd one for 08 and which renders the city unhappy. Will not invest the lux just for that one size one city so we will see unrest there as it works its way 2 turns to size two where an elvis can restore the peace. The new legion will reach a city in which to re-home in 4 turns.
    2000: Another settler emerges.

    2000 Status: Republic, 8 cities, 3 settler, 3 horse, 2 legion, 2 archer, 1 dip. 96 gold, 213,000 sq mi. 8 techs plus 40% of the beakers towards currency.
     
  14. WildPony

    WildPony Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2004
    Messages:
    192
    Location:
    Southern California, USA
    1950: Built 09 grass/river city with access to bull, 25/22. Complete settler. Complete 2nd road.
    1900: Complete 2 settlers and 3rd road. Hut: 50 gold. 9 cities, 4 settlers, Gold spent down to 30.
    1850: 2 more settlers complete along with 4th road. 9 cities, 6 settlers.
    1800: Another settler completes. First irrigation (wheat accessible by two cities).
    1750: Fish tribe in the deep East and in the plains, 46/22. 4 settlers have been en route towards whales 5-7 steps away. 10 cities, 7 settlers.
    1700: After walking 5+ steps, settler builds grass/whale city 11 @ 22/36
    1650: 5 step walk results in grass/whale 12 @ 16/18... a whale which to my sheepish embarrassment i hadn't noticed that it is already being utilized by 08 so it was not worth walk.
    1650 Status: 12 cities, 5 settlers, 76 gold.
    1600: Currency > Trade. Shifting to a focus on Pyramids including the escalation of science to 80%. Completion of a settler. 6 steps walked to build city 13 @ grass/whale 9/39. 5 steps walked to build grass/silk city 14 @ 8/36 with a hidden ocean special that is hopefully a whale. A near future boat there will uncover it relatively soon and perform continued valuable exploration southward along my west coast. 2nd irrigation completes on the 5th turn of work after 4 turns of walking along ricers and roads storing work along the way.
    1600 status: 14 cities, 5 settlers, 122 gold. 2 irrigation, 4 roads.
    1550: Next settler completes. Build city 15 at river end 28/20 with access to the irrigated grass/shield that was completed last turn and also a bull (or tatonka if you prefer). This is the 8th and final city built on the 2 starting rivers. 6 turns of walking to build grass/whale 16 @ 6/26. Beakers for Trade complete in 1 turn but with limited shield progress and funds, completion of 4 caravans will need some time, maybe about 4 or 5 additional turns from now.
    1550 status: 16 cities, 3 settlers. 135 gold.
    1500: Trade > (pottery not offered so i choose) Ceremonial hoping to trade the Chinese for it and get another chance at pottery. Chinese would not trade in uncooperative, so i gifted them a tech and then traded them for Cer.

    1500 status: Republic, 16 cities, 3 settlers, 1 boat, 3 horse, 1 dip, 2 legion, 2 archers.

    1450: (Cer) > Pottery. Barb pirates land nearby. First size two revolt in Republic and a few other cities are going to size 2 next turn. Would use elvis for one or two unhappy size two cities, but 30% lux works best for the overall well being of the civ at this point. Tax 70% / Lux 30%. Walk several steps and build grass/whale 17 @ 6/16.
    1400: Build 18 on Wheat with grass/shield/road access, 20/18. Barb Archer stacked with an explorer move towards city 13 and are 2 steps away. Spend about 54 gold to rush and re-home a dip to be able to bribe back the city about to be captured by these barbs. Hut 50 gold and this gold replenishes what i needed to rush my final 2 caravans for Pyramids which will emerge in 1300. Treasury is now at 29 gold. Have slowed food growth in five size one cities over the past few turns with forests so these cities will perfectly time the filling of their their food storage for 1300 and gain 15 extra food towards 30 in the following turn which greatly hastens the size 3 celebrations they will enjoy. As well the Japanese will prioritize the fastest possible HG since several size two cities will be needing it for crowd control so we can go back to 0% lux before cities begin to reach size 3 at which point we will increase lux to celebrate. Science at 0% for now to aid in the financing of 4 caravans for HG before turning up the science to complete pottery. Can complete it in 2 turns any time i am ready. and i will do my best to time it perfectly with 4 caravans being ready to fill the 200 shields. Depending upon available squares, will explore the possibly of going to 40% lux in 1300 in anticipation of 5 additional cities reaching size 2 the following turn.
    1400 status: 18 cities, 2 settlers, 2 caravans and 2 more to emerge next turn.
    1350: City 13 sacked by barbs and bribed back for 26 gold and an expended diplomat. Gain back a dip and also an archer in the transaction. 4 caras fill 200 shields for Pyramids.
    1300: Pyramids emerges. 18 cities, 2 settlers.
    Pre-1250: Bad news first (very bad): barb boat appears out of the black and sinks my boat carrying a dip and horse exploring the overseas coastline. Now the good news, Egypt invites me to gape with awe over their invention of pottery. Gift Egypt a tech then trade them for Pottery. Rushing 4 caras along the way for Hanging Gardens which will emerge in the year 1000 bc. 25 gold left over. 18 cities. All units include 2 settlers, 1 dip, 2 horse, 2 legion, 3 archers.
    1200: Pottery > no tech as yet with 0% science. Utilizing every gold resource possible to complete 4 caras.
    1150: walk 4 steps to build a legion-accompanied grass/whale city 19 @ 31/15 4 steps from Shanghai. Keeping a dip near a single barb archer in case i have to bribe it, but hoping to utilize the gold elsewhere. 1150 Status: 19 cities, 1 settler, 0 caras.
    1100: 3 caras and 4th is rushed in wonder city to 50 shields. 1 settler emerges as well. Forced against my will to bribe a barb archer. Treasury: 28 gold. 19 cities, 2 settlers, 3 caras.
    1050: 4th cara emerges and 200 shields are filled for HG. First city reaches size 3 and many more are 1, 2 and 3 turns away. Finally meet the Russians, trade for Warrior and iron, gift them to worshipful and trade maps which reveals a nice piece of the puzzle. Tech trade for mysticism from the Chinese. Trade for Horse and Wheel from the French. 17 techs now including everything available from all other civs. With various factors to weigh, optimal trades at this point will be able to yield about 230. Phil/poly/mono are next. Treasury: 38 gold.
    1000: Hanging Gardens emerges. 4 cities @ size 3. Next turn will be 7 and the following turn 11. 50% Lux is expected to get 7 celebrations under way.

    1000 Status: Republic, Pyramids, HG, 19 cities, 2 settlers, 1 boat, 2 dips, 2 horse, 2 legion, 4 archers. 62 shields, 390 sq. mi. Treasury: 94 gold. 8 roads, 2 irrigation.
     
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2019
  15. WildPony

    WildPony Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2004
    Messages:
    192
    Location:
    Southern California, USA
    975: 6 of 7 anticipated celebrations begin. The 7th which is a distant city with a lot of corruption requires 80% lux. For now the Japanese are adjusting Lux to 60 which should have 10 of 11 size 3s and 2s stepping into 3s celebrating next turn. Will be sending 2 demanded silks and a demanded wine soon. Memphis demands Hides and i anticipate presenting her with some caravans in a short while. Really need a lot of roads to optimize celebration growth and will be building some settlers in various cities size 4+ cities.
    950: Boat transported settler builds grass/river city 20 at a beautiful 4 special site, 6/8. Nicest city yet. Lux to 80%, 10 of 11 size 3 or 4 cities are celebrating. 950 status: 20 cities, 2 settlers, 1 Trade caravan (Silk). 6 size 4 cities. Treasury: 40 gold.
    925: 2 more trade caravans and a settler completed. Now have 3 each and 20 cities. Treasury: 57 gold.
    900: 20 cities, 5 Settlers, 4 trade caras, 2 each: boats, dips, horse, legion. 4 archers. 95 tons. 2 size 6s, 5 size 5s, 3 size 4s. 10 roads, 2 irrigation.
    875: Unchanged: 20 cities, 5 settlers and 4 trade caras. 38 Gold, 101 tons. 2 million population. 1 size 7, 1 size 6, 7 size 5, 2 size 4.
    850: 20 cities, 7 settlers, 5 trade caravans.
    825: One scientist hoping to ideally begin Philo chooses.... > Poly among those offered as the 2nd best tech of choice towards Mono. Build 21 grass/river with bird and silk @ 9/7. 3 settlers and 1 trade caravan complete. 21 cities, 9 settlers, 6 trade caras. Treasury: 11 gold.
    800: 21 cities, 10 settlers, 6 trade caras, 17 roads, 2 irrig.
    775: Hut: Seafaring. Optimal trades will now yield about 250. Build Grass, 2 fish city 22 @ 49/23.
    775: French announce that they discovered Poly. Will seek to trade that with them... not happening... will need to make war with them to reset their civ 2 gold attitude. Hut: nomad. build grass city 23 with access to a pheasant and fish @ 2/7. Status: 23 cities, 14 set, 8 trade caras.
    750: First trade of game. 9 turn walk to self-trade silk yields a surprisingly low trade value of only 54.
    725: 23 cities, 15 settlers, 8 trade caravans. 28 roads, 2 irrigation, 117 tons, 102 treasury.
    700: Fairly nearby demanded wine trade to Beijing yields 150 for Japan's 2nd trade. Mediocre plain city 24 @ 25/37 built due to an ill planned near starvation emergency that the Japanese waited too long to address and which at this point could not be resolved any other way. To soften the blow, at least it accesses a grass/river/shield square as well as a whale that is already in use. City 25 built on a plain @ 36/2 and accesses fish and fur. Doing my best to make war with France so i can take advantage of the first turn of reconciliation to trade them for poly, but in Republic the worst i can do is insist they withdraw their troops from my territory of which there are none. They are not interested in trading my seafaring for their poly with an "uncooperative" disposition and i do not have the extra tech to gift them which would allow me to trade them for it. Beakers for Poly are currently at about 225 out of 380.
    700 status: 25 cities, 14 settlers, 7 trade caravans. 29 roads, 2 irrigation. Treasury: 142 gold
    675: Build grass cities 26, 27, 28. Status: 28 cities, 13 settlers, 7 trade caravans. Treasury: 145 gold.
    650: Demanded self traded silk yields 84. 28 cities, 14 settlers, 6 trade caravans. Treasury: 42 gold
     
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2019

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