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Gotta remember to always disable Cultural Victory...

Discussion in 'Civ5 - General Discussions' started by BlakeTheDrake, Aug 19, 2014.

  1. BlakeTheDrake

    BlakeTheDrake Chieftain

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    The BNW version of Cultural Victory is much more interesting, deep, and creative than the old one, that's true... but unless I'm specifically planning to AIM for Cultural Victory, I always disable it. Unless I forget, which I did in my latest game, which then nicely illustrated WHY I always disable it.

    I was playing as Gustavus Adolphus, and going full conquest. I basically started fighting as soon as I'd invented the trebuchet, and then never really STOPPED - just took breaks to rest, resupply, and do a little R&D between conquering civs. None of that 'surgical strike against capitals' bull this time - I would CONQUER THE WORLD! And I was doing it, too. Took full advantage of the period where my UU's dominated, bringing out fast-moving Hakkapelita to harry my foes, and building as many Caroleans as I could afford - after all, their valuable 'March' upgrade would endure when they were upgraded to more advanced forms, and infantry never really stopped being useful.

    As the Atomic Era rolled around, I finished yet another conquest, and now only one target remained - The Ottomans, who still dominated a solid quarter of the world, mostly thanks to taking a rather aggressive stance against city-states. Their armies were immense, but I had a slight edge in technology, and I'd cleverly sapped their strength by gifting advanced military units (mostly the 0-XP ones I received from my militaristic City-State allies) to their targets, forcing them to expend significant resources in their conquests. And now it was time for the final war for dominion! Two great armies were ready to catch the well-prepared Ottomans in a pincer-attack, and two great fleets - including well-stocked Carriers - were ready to swoop in on their seaside properties. Each Carrier also came with an Atomic Bomb - tech the Ottomans didn't have, and which I hoped would come as an unpleasant surprise to them. Finally, proving the value of military intelligence, my submarine scouts had managed to locate the bulk of the Ottoman Navy - clustered just out of sight of one of my main production-centers. They were clearly no fools, and had their own counterattack planned. But now, I had a wolfpack of submarines ready to deal with their strikeforce before it could move...

    War was declared, and the first shots were fired! Well-prepared forces charged into the breach while pre-placed artillery began to shell the enemy cities. Naval forces leapt into action, and fully half the Ottoman strikeforce fell to my submarines before they even knew what hit them. Everything seemed to be going according to plan, and while my front-line soldiers would soak up some nasty damage from the Great Fortresses the Ottomans had scattered across the main frontier, I was confident that I'd be able to take at least two of their cities by the second turn of the war. But they still had a lot of land, and a lot of cities. There remained plenty of opportunities for them to spring surprises on me, and I was still looking for a worthy target for my Atomic Bombs...

    *NEXT TURN*

    "You have achieved victory through the awesome power of your culture...":confused:

    ...you see where I'm coming from? It's easy to lose track of your cultural influence if you aren't directly monitoring it, and once your Tourism surpasses the enemy's cultural output, you can't STOP it from happening. Worse, everything you do to increase cultural growth - and thus your acquisition of cultural policies and ideological tenets - also tends to boost your Tourism. And of course, if you're going for 'full' conquest and thus whittling down the number of competitors, it becomes even easier to wind up with an unintended cultural victory, and a serious case of Conquest-blueballs. :(:(
     
  2. Mutineer

    Mutineer Chieftain

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    It just saved you time of moping them up. I am sure you can see you already won this game, so unless you have masochist tendencies of wasting time, move on new game! :)
     
  3. reddishrecue

    reddishrecue Chieftain

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    You can disable cultural victory to prevent sudden surprise cultural victories that ai likes to do particularly when civilization remain undiscovered. Disabling cultural victories will remove surprise cultural victories that ais like to do particularly when you don't keep an eye on the cultural and tourism screen.
     
  4. BlakeTheDrake

    BlakeTheDrake Chieftain

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    Well, sure, I would've almost certainly won regardless... but sometimes 'how' is as important as 'what'. Having my intentions subverted and a grand battle short-circuited annoys me. The battle is the FUN part, you know? This way, it feels less like a victory and more like being denied the entertainment of destroying them unit by unit, city by city...

    ...I think my tendencies run more towards sadistic than masochistic, really. :shifty:

    (And also, I'm still working on the Panzer 'Shafernator' General achievement, and was hoping to spawn another one or two great generals from that war. Ah well.)
     
  5. shaglio

    shaglio The Prince of Dorkness

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    You could always click "One more turn . . ." and keep playing past your victory, unless you wanted the game to specifically show up in your Hall of Fame as a Domination Victory.
     
  6. Sharples

    Sharples Chieftain

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    You're not alone, Madjinn got a similar win. :)


    Link to video.

    Watch it from 26:36

    Moderator Action: Youtube link repaired
     
  7. Mutineer

    Mutineer Chieftain

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    video doe snot exist
     
  8. joncnunn

    joncnunn Senior Java Wizard Moderator

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    Disabling any form of victory really hurts some of the AIs. (The ones whose flavors are designed around getting the form of victory being disabled)

    If going after Domination victory, simply targeting the AIs in the lead towards cultural victory would have been enough to avoid losing.
     
  9. Acken

    Acken Chieftain

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    You shouldn't make works of art unless you're going for a cultural victory.

    I have a hard time believing that with no work of art and no tourism generators, you'd get a culture victory. Unless for some reason you spent a ton of time waiting after having conquered someone else's works of art.

    What you describe literally never happened to me.

    Like for example:
    I have no idea what you're talking about. Tourism tenent increase tourism. Don't pick them if you don't want a tourism victory ?! The only tenet increasing culture doesn't increase tourism.

    He wins diplo not culture. And is somehow surprised that when 16 votes are required for a win, his 16 votes give him the win ??
     
  10. reddishrecue

    reddishrecue Chieftain

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    I get what you're saying and the hall of fame shows off whether the completed game was a victory or defeat. You have to be careful here because the hall of fame can show off that the ai defeated you.
     
  11. BlakeTheDrake

    BlakeTheDrake Chieftain

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    I made works of art because they boost culture - having some artwork to move around makes it easier to boost the border-growth of recently-founded cities, among other things. Taking advantage of bonus multipliers from Wonders and Museums also speeds overall cultural growth, giving me more Ideological Tenets faster, which is always a good thing. And, hey, what ELSE am I gonna use Great Musicians for?

    And when the International Games Great Project was launched, I used my large number of cities and high production to become the main contributor - for the free Tenet and to deny it to the competition. Plus, hey, bonus City State friendship, always nice. But at the same time, I got doubled Tourism for, what, 20 turns?

    Finally, I built a number of Airports when they became available for the convenient air-transport of units, particularly from my capital to the front-line. And bang, 50% of those cities' SIGNIFICANT cultural production got turned into Tourism.

    ...granted, I probably could've avoided that victory if I'd deliberately left someone more culturally-inclined for last instead of the Ottomans, but I was mainly thinking in military-strategical terms when I picked my targets. I'd literally forgotten that Cultural Victory wasn't disabled.
     
  12. MrDumpstertrash

    MrDumpstertrash Chieftain

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    Who cares? Unless you're playing Deity just move up a level and you'll probably not accidentally win culture. Turning of the VC takes so much out of the game dude
     
  13. brasaelal

    brasaelal Chieftain

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    Is there any negative effect on AI performance if you disable some types of victory conditions?
     
  14. Browd

    Browd Dilettante Administrator

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    He forgot he had liberated another civ that was therefore required to vote for him.
     
  15. joncnunn

    joncnunn Senior Java Wizard Moderator

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    As above, the AI flavors would cause them to try to get victory conditions that don't exist. Most noticeably is AI Greece would still try to win Diplomatic victory even if its disabled.
     
  16. bhavv

    bhavv Glorious World Dictator

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    Culture win is far too easy in BNW, it usually just happens way before I get a chance to win by science, and also the same with Diplo win (just buy all city states, loads of delegates + win).

    Its like why even bother having science victory in the game anymore?
     
  17. shaglio

    shaglio The Prince of Dorkness

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    That's not such a good idea. Even if you're not seeking a CV, you still want to generate some Tourism so that, later on, you won't be overwhelmed by Ideological pressure. Tourism works defensively as well as it does offensively.

    Sure there are other ways to generate Tourism, but Great Works are the easiest. You can still get Tourism from the Eiffel Tower, and convert it from some culture sources with Hotels, Airports, the National Visitor's Center, and the Internet. But aside from Airports, why would you build any of those unless you're trying for a CV?
     
  18. joncnunn

    joncnunn Senior Java Wizard Moderator

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    On standard map size, it's indeed the case the science victory is the slowest of the three peaceful victory conditions.
     
  19. DarkestOnion

    DarkestOnion Chieftain

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    You lost me at 'As the Atomic Era rolled around...' If you were going for a Domination Victory how did your game even reach the Atomic Era? From your description it sounds like you were playing down from your normal difficulty level, and that you were just toying with the AI with the full knowledge that you had already won the game really.
     
  20. Acken

    Acken Chieftain

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    I'll disagree heavily with that. The best defense against tourism is culture. Win the world fair, bulb writer/artists. Getting through rationalism fast is just a better use of these great persons.

    Your weak +8/+10 tourism just doesn't matter enough to influence deity AI.
     

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