Litvin said:
PLEEEEASE! Calm down.
Every country has its own history.
Yes evry country has it's own history. But Belorusia is more a "modern country", and it's history starts with ocupations...
Litvin said:
If you do not forget Russian, would you please read the following info:
www.litvin.org
Oh crap, when I write a lot of facts - yopu point me to some site
Sorry - but i never knew russian
And can't read your languge...
I hope you know how different Rusian and Belarusian languages are?
Litvin said:
Just one FACT. ALL OFFICIAL DOCUMENTATION of GRAND DUCHY of LITHUANIA was in BELARUSIAN or Old Slavic language (which was the ground for modern Belarusian language). ALL. NONE was written in Lithuanian
Yes it was. And what this facts says?
It says only one thing: Lithuanians didn't have their own writings (actualy the first lithuanian book came only in XVI century). So if it was needed to write any document - we were using foreign writings (you can't use what you don't have). It's like in the first Civ series - when you occupate foregin city - you can take one of their advantage...
At that moment writing was taken.
The other fact that you didn't mentioned - that all that writing was used
only for chancellery purposes.
Also you didn't mentioned that some of those writings there made in Latin too
And you somehow forget, that a lot of writings under the united kingdom (Lithuania & Poland) there wrote in Polish (yes not all, some still in russian). So writing as alone thing is a very weak argument in this case.
Litvin said:
DO YOU THINK it is normal that so called "conquerors" spoke the language of people the "conquered"
Actualy what you wrote is also one sided thing
I'll just add what you forgot, or didn't wanet to see:
1. Even deep into now adays Belarusia there were lithuanian schools.
2. Even more deeper - Lithuanian Pastorates went to churches to speak preachments in Lithuanian - this gives a nice idea about lithuanian comunitys in russian land...
3. All Lithuanian rulers spoke Lithuanian
They just learned russian language as their first foreign - for very simple situation - all diplomatic acts in the east (non GDL territory) were made in russian, a lot of locative rulers - spoke in russian too (exeptions - only when such one was replaced by lithuanian one).
4. Other thing - that expansion to the east was often made in such a way: comes a lithuanian duke - and if local governor is smart enouth - he acknowledges his loyality to Lithuanian Duke
if he wan't to be independent - his castle gets burned and a new local governors is put by the duke, very often new local goverment is also local man - from a rival family of the former "ruler" (so a lot of local pop[ulation is happy - they don't feel opresed, and GDL duke is happy - a new ruler acknowledges him, pays taxes and so on).
If you would check Vytautas history you would find a lot of his raids into salvic (russian) lands to "put down" a local ruler who tries to be more independent.
also the other way to secure that there will be no indipendent thoughts was to marry daughter with locla ruler...
In some cases (actualy rarely) - the local region governor was changed by lithuanian one.
Litvin said:
Your contry was called ZHAMOITIA or ZHMUD'. Actually the capital of your country was in KOVNO (modern KAUNAS).
Oh... well if you don't know anything about Lithuania - you just could don't speak nonsenses. (now I am feeling, like any englishman would feel by listening of the Indian saying: "British Empire wasn't ruled by england, England was only part of it - and you know - your capital was somethere in Scotland...")
So:
1. First Lithuanian capital was Kreva, second Trakai, thrid (and the last) - Vilnius.
2. Kaunas never was called a capital of Lithuania, except during period of WWI end - WWII- begining. Even then it was called "Temporrary Capital" (Vilnius was ocupied by Polish troops - we were at very "cold war" situation with them).
3. Zemaitija is a region near there Baltic sea. For your knowledge - even Kaunas isn't in the region of Zemaitija. Kaunas is in the region of aukstaitija.
(so you are talking really a lot of crap - feel it?)
So please - don't be so light-headed.
Litvin said:
Unfortunately do not have time to translate the following source in English, but those people who speak and read Russian can find some useful info:
"Unfortunatly" - you even can't give me any answer to any my writen text one post before....
Litvin said:
RESULT: You have your civ, I have mine. Full stop. Bye
Result was allready said by one of your countries historians: "Sadly when we look back to the old times - we find Lithuanians allready there".
I see Broken Legion is doing well. So, good luck in making this civ. I am going to make Litva and Belarus for my mod later.
To be honest, this list looks like belarusian only.
)
since Mindaugas was a king,Vytautas almoust was a king, only later, when Lithuania and Poland was united it was called The Republic of Two Nations (RTN) or Abiejų Tautų Respublika (ATR). Republic,what is it now?Republic as well,sooo what does this mean?Same constitution with minor changes?Yes,THEN this is THE same country,smaller, has a president,not a king,though same constitution,same name,same spirit,same beliefs,what else are you looking for? Only after long wars with Moscow ATR was weakend and ocupied. Then Lithuania was known as independent country only after WWI,not long though. In 2009 we will celebrate the 1000 years of Lithuania's existance, so if it was NOT Lithuania,then why this date will be celebrated worldwide by all lithuanians? Maybe you should turn on the TV when all other nations will send congrats on this event...
