Great Leaders
- Thread starter BretP
- Start date
cgannon64
BOB DYLAN'S ROCKIN OUT!
Military Great Leaders can't rush wonders anymore; only Scientific Great Leaders can.
They made this change to discourage attacking barbs/other civs to fish for GLs.
They made this change to discourage attacking barbs/other civs to fish for GLs.
sealman
Hater of Babylonians
Military Great Leaders can't rush wonders anymore; only Scientific Great Leaders can.
NO!!! Say it ain't so! Maybe it will be okay once I pick up the game and give it a try.
They made this change to discourage attacking barbs/other civs to fish for GLs.
But you were never able to get GL from barbs. As for other civs, I never used this as a reason to crush them.
NO!!! Say it ain't so! Maybe it will be okay once I pick up the game and give it a try.They made this change to discourage attacking barbs/other civs to fish for GLs.
But you were never able to get GL from barbs. As for other civs, I never used this as a reason to crush them.
Bamspeedy
CheeseBob
No, you couldn't get GL from barbs, but people would 'train' their units up to elite status by fighting barbs and then have a bunch of elites to use against the AI to get leaders.
The bigger problem is that it was the ONLY way for many people to win on the higher levels. That is a game-balancing problem if 'fishing' for great leaders is the only strategy they know how to win by. Basically, with leaders rushing wonders, the game was too military oriented (have to warmonger to win). There should be options for the peaceful player to compete. Warmongering is still the better option (just capture the wonders), but it certainly has been toned down a bit to help even the playing field. And the whole point of the higher levels is that you should have to learn how to win WITHOUT getting wonders (at least not the early ones). It's alot harder to be the first to a tech on deity, than it is to get a leader on deity.
The bigger problem is that it was the ONLY way for many people to win on the higher levels. That is a game-balancing problem if 'fishing' for great leaders is the only strategy they know how to win by. Basically, with leaders rushing wonders, the game was too military oriented (have to warmonger to win). There should be options for the peaceful player to compete. Warmongering is still the better option (just capture the wonders), but it certainly has been toned down a bit to help even the playing field. And the whole point of the higher levels is that you should have to learn how to win WITHOUT getting wonders (at least not the early ones). It's alot harder to be the first to a tech on deity, than it is to get a leader on deity.
It's alot harder to be the first to a tech on deity, than it is to get a leader on deity.
Yes, ridicuolously harder. I think on diety you just have to forget about those scientific leaders, concceding on the tech race, and just dominating your opponents militarily. I dont think racing for 1st to tech on diety is a good strategy (might only work in an isolated situation).
Yes, ridicuolously harder. I think on diety you just have to forget about those scientific leaders, concceding on the tech race, and just dominating your opponents militarily. I dont think racing for 1st to tech on diety is a good strategy (might only work in an isolated situation).
isolated situation? I play a peaceful strategy on diety and I cannot fathom winning when starting isolated. By the time I was upgrading to pikemen the rest of the world would be looking at riflemen. If I don't start where I can get contact from at least 2, preferably 3 civs, I restart.
Bamspeedy
CheeseBob
Jasenn,
But if the AI are isolated from each other.....
But if the AI are isolated from each other.....
Al Zan
King
no!!!!!!!!!! are you jokeing!
Balastulin
Lord of the Sea
Yeah, well I'm a bit peeved with the whole leader thing at the moment. I've just been playing a game and had no less than 54 Elite victories and STILL no leader! Can anyone beat that (hmmm, this probably shouldn't be on this thread?)
Djarum Kretek
Warlord
I don't have Conquest yet, but I read somewhere that the Military Great Leaders can still rush small wonders like Forbiden Palace, Wall Street, stuff like that. But not the Pyramids.
That is correct; Military Great Leaders can rush small wonders or create armies, and (presumably) are still available only one at a time. Scientific Great Leaders can rush everything including great wonders, or can be used to provide an era of scientific discovery, which provides +25% science research for 20 turns. It's kind of like a mini-golden age, with similar pop-up windows telling you when it starts and stops. You can have multiple SGLs at once, as well, which opens up a whole new way of being able to quickly rush new wonders, if you're lucky enough to end up with them.
Overall it's a wonderful change, imo, since it balances out the peaceful part of the game, as opposed to the warmongering side. The increased power of armies helps the Military Great Leader still be something very much worth getting, as well. Not incidentally, this also increases the power of the Scientific trait, of course, since having that provides a greater chance (5% vs 3%) of getting a SGL.
Masquerouge
Deity
I completely agree. I think this change is one of the best feature of C3C. Peaceful/scientific players are "rewarded", but warmongers are not really hindered, since armies are pumped up. I think everybody should be happy with the change, but of course peaceful players (such as me) are the happiest ! yeepee yeepee yeepee yeepee yah !
I guess it's time to leave the good ol'egyptians and go back to these wonderfull babylonians
Mîtiu Ioan
Deity
Couple of months ago I proposed something like this on a sugestion forum - to be created somekind of GL ...
Sounds like a nice modification IMHO ...
Regards
All i realy need from great leaders are:1)To rush the small wonder -Forbiten Palace-and 2)To create the first Army.The importance of the Forbbiten palace is major.Without it you just cant follow the others(7-8 cities without corruption is the base for a strong civ).So as sooner as i built it the better it is.As far as the first army...well..who doesn't need it!!!So i am glad i hear that G.l continue to rush Small Wonders,for the Great ones we'll just have to be faster!
Louis XXIV
Le Roi Soleil
Remember, Armies are now super powerful, so it is worth getting a MGL to build an army.
They have +1 move, pillage without move loss, blitz, radar, and an extra 1/6 attack (1/4 after Mil. Acad.)
They have +1 move, pillage without move loss, blitz, radar, and an extra 1/6 attack (1/4 after Mil. Acad.)
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