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Great Mistake Information from @CivWikia

Discussion in 'CivBE - General Discussions' started by Eisenhart, Sep 28, 2014.

  1. Eisenhart

    Eisenhart Warlord

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    Taken from tweets made by @CivWikia who probably got it during a panel:

    Designers of ‪#BeyondEarth‬ planned that The Great Mistake began with a weak nuclear explosion in a Chinese city.

    China retaliates against ‪#Iran‬ with nuclear weapons. #BeyondEarth ‪#TheGreatMistake‬

    #BeyondEarth begins a number of generations after the '‪#GreatMistake‬', by which time full knowledge of the event has receded into myth.

    Humanitarian crisis follows. 1/3rd of world's population live in a nuked nation. #BeyondEarth #TheGreatMistake

    Greenhouse effect is accelerated by an order of magnitude. Biggest losers are coastal China, coastal India and the Americas. #BeyondEarth

    India and Pakistan find a common way. Australia is doing great. Sub-Saharan Africa unites. #BeyondEarth #TheGreatMistake

    VideoEtTaco's map is now shown by the designers, turns out to be pretty accurate compared to what they had planned. #BeyondEarth

    African Union wouldn't include that much of North Africa, Brazilia too ambitious too. Franco-Iberia should include more EU. #BeyondEarth


    (Updated)

    Governments become increasingly isolationist and turn inward to resolve devastation.

    It is not until four generations pass that humans begin to look elsewhere for Earth-like habitats.

    Again: this is all hypothetical, and -- as Miller and McDonough stressed multiple times -- ABSOLUTELY NOT CANON - @CivWikia
     
  2. Karl0413

    Karl0413 Prince

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    Considering the Great Mistake is supposed to take place in the near future and China and Iran are allies currently...yeah; I am having difficulty imaging that taking place in the near term.
     
  3. gunnergoz

    gunnergoz Cat Herder

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    Hey, Russia and Ukraine were wrapped in the loving bonds of Slavic friendship and harmony until this year. Anything is possible once people start squabbling over what really matters: resources, room and rhetoric.
     
  4. Browd

    Browd Dilettante Administrator

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    It's supposed to take place in the next 50 years. Alliances can change considerably in 50 years.
     
  5. Karl0413

    Karl0413 Prince

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    Point taken.
     
  6. KrikkitTwo

    KrikkitTwo Immortal

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    50 years in the future.
    Either country may undergo regime change Or normal diplomatic realignment
    Or the whole thing was a false flag by the PLA who was tired of diplomacy

    Also, some of those things may merely have happened at the same time.
    (And the US was congratulating the Taliban for cutting opium production in the early 90s...events can change fast)

    Also I think we are looking at one aspect of the Great Mistake. (Ie the version taught in PAC schools...I'm guessing SF and ARC texts talk more about the cyber war that wiped out the www)
     
  7. Camikaze

    Camikaze Administrator Administrator

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    The most important point to note, and which Will & David stressed, is that the content of the Great Mistake doesn't actually matter. It provided them with an internal guide in designing the game, but it is not definitive lore. After all, you control the destiny of your own faction, and are not tied to previous 'real' events.

    I think it's fair to criticise the explanation of the back-story, though, seeing as they decided to make it public - whilst we don't have to be wedded to a particular story, there is a particular story which we don't have to be wedded to.
     
  8. m15a

    m15a Emperor

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    I guess it's sort of like director commentary on a movie DVD. Personally, I wouldn't really consider it canon* - if nothing else, simply because it's more interesting to me if the backstory is kind of vague. And, assuming it's not spelled out in the game, it was intentionally left vague. But it is kind of cool that thought that went into a logical narrative that led to the state of the world.

    * I tried to come up with a cannon/canon pun but couldn't think of one. :)
     
  9. Eisenhart

    Eisenhart Warlord

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    (Updated)

    Governments become increasingly isolationist and turn inward to resolve devastation.

    It is not until four generations pass that humans begin to look elsewhere for Earth-like habitats.

    Again: this is all hypothetical, and -- as Miller and McDonough stressed multiple times -- ABSOLUTELY NOT CANON - @CivWikia
     
  10. Eisenhart

    Eisenhart Warlord

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    I think what is fascinating is that by its very nature, the Great Mistake is no longer definable or traceable.

    That makes it very open to interpretation and subjective, sans a few items.
     
  11. Eisenhart

    Eisenhart Warlord

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    (Update)

    China blames Iran and blasts Iran and Afghanistan with a nuke.

    Pakistan attacks China

    China nukes Pakistan and North Korea
     
  12. joncnunn

    joncnunn Senior Java Wizard Retired Moderator

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    The second does NOT follow from the first, a large number of nukes detonating would cause NUCLEAR WINTER, which is the opposite of global warming. (And actually nuclear winter would be a lot more deadly world wide even excluding the radiation affects)

    I also can't see any circumstance in which China would nuke next door North Korea, they could probably topple the current NK regime with Chinese special forces alone if they ever wanted a less noisy puppet.
     
  13. KrikkitTwo

    KrikkitTwo Immortal

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    I think the idea is that the global warming was happening At the same time... so after a decade or so of nuclear winter, global warming takes over rapidly.

    ie US forces open trade with Japan, Civil war breaks out.... one does not lead to the other, but they are happening at the same time.
     
  14. Browd

    Browd Dilettante Administrator

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    I should have been more precise. Dave and Will specifically referenced "tactical" nuke exchanges, so the nuclear winter effects that would be predicted from, e.g., a full-scale U.S./U.S.S.R. H-bomb exchange are not necessarily implied.

    That same site has an interesting article about the potential effects of a regional nuclear war involving as few as 100 Hiroshima-sized nukes, which is more consistent with what Will and Dave outlined.
     
  15. Westwall

    Westwall Emperor

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    Cool, thanks. I'm glad they're stressing this is just a rough idea more than anything. I think they have the right idea with leaving as much as possible to the player's imagination.
     
  16. Tomice

    Tomice Passionate Smart-Ass

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    Exactly! Personally, I prefer making those details up in my head over a half-bred canon background. And I'd be far more interested to know something about the inevitable DLC sponsors. Hope they have some nice central European sponsor out soon (my country is not represented yet).
     
  17. gunnergoz

    gunnergoz Cat Herder

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    I have a sense that BE's life cycle is going to be, at best a couple of DLC's and perhaps one expansion before we start hearing about the Next Great Thing which is either a n XCom variant or Civ 6. Good thing too, because BE will invite all sort of anguish about "my country is not represented" even more than Civ V and games before it. Why? In a more or less credible post GM world, many of the countries now in the real life world will be gone by then as nation states, replaced by roving bands of refugees (think Palestine/Gaza) or absorbed by their neighbors. I don't think Firaxis wants to tarry over this title too long and follow on product, as I say, may be limited. Just my opinion and I have no corner on the market for crystal balls. :D
     
  18. joncnunn

    joncnunn Senior Java Wizard Retired Moderator

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    Yes, but their article on a South Asia war actually lines up with what I was saying earlier. A full blown US - USSR exchange and we're all extinct.

    "Even 10 years out, there would be a persistent 0.5° C average surface cooling. In a matter of days, temperatures around the Earth would become colder than those experienced during the pre-industrial Little Ice Age (which occurred from approximately 1400 to 1850)."

    Now, I'm not sure if by "persistent 0.5° C average surface cooling" they mean the surface temperature is continuing to drop that much per year ten years out or if they mean the surface temperature with be that much lower ten years out than if the exchange doesn't happen.
    If it's the first, you'd need to do something to induce global warming to try to counter.
     
  19. KrikkitTwo

    KrikkitTwo Immortal

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    Its probably that much lower than exchange not happening (ie the adjustment people make is pretty low)

    The issue with a nuclear winter is it hits hard for a few years and then fades as the dust settles (literally)


    As for the whole diplomacy issue... China might be the one more hard hit by terrorists, if a petroleum-rich west pulls out of the Middle East and growing China goes in...and has more Uighur problems... they could be the ones targeted by Islamists.

    I think a China-Pakistan war is partially to indicate that the world has reshaped significantly even Before the Great Mistake..borders may not have moved but alliances have.
     
  20. 3of5

    3of5 Recycling Vats Technician

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    the great mistake simulation must run on the Civ4 engine, where pollution from fallout tiles actually counted towards global warming ;-) (if i remember correctly).
     

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