Great Starting Position

Discussion in 'Civ5 - Strategy & Tips' started by Nabob57, Nov 7, 2010.

  1. Nabob57

    Nabob57 Chieftain

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    One of the difficulties, I know that some may argue the only real difficulty, of a deity game is the randomness of available resources for your starting position.

    Since I am not above restarting a game when I see that I am starting in a suboptimal area, I am soliciting input for what factors you consider when scouting an initial starting position for the various wins. Consider generic maps, not specialty maps like mesopotamia that has a LOT of desert for you to get stuck with.

    What makes for a great (vs good) starting position for a culture win? diplo? escape to outer space? warmongerer?
     
  2. Grinnenstadt

    Grinnenstadt Chieftain

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    Hills, hills and more hills. Being able to get 3 different luxresources in capital is nice too. I always love seeing marble especially and I usually prefer seeing metal luxresources like gold and silver rather than resources that require calender. I tend to research mining very early on the way to bronze, masonry and iron. I always try to explore a little bit though I know it's probably a bad idea, just so I can min/max the starting location. Some people settle on rivers, but I'd rather settle away from the river in order to work that tile early on.
     
  3. gareththegeek

    gareththegeek Chieftain

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    Its hard to say from the initial starting position since you can't tell if there are maritime cses nearby. If you can get the maritime food bonus then hills are more powerful for example. Can't go wrong with plenty of plains river tiles though :D
     
  4. Jaycob

    Jaycob Chieftain

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    I agree that certain factors are way more important than the tiles around your capital. I like to spend my first 500g on a cultural CS so I can get to meritocracy asap and explode. Maritime civs are obviously very useful. Even military CS are useful to poach a worker... the only CS combinations that suck are several military civs, (if you poach more than one worker, it seems you risk permanent war with some CS) a huge cluster of cultural CS (one is enough to get to meritocracy).... I would say the bare minimum for a decent starting hex is 2x 2/0/1 tiles and a 0/2/0 hill. Plains > grassland. Mining resources > calendar resources. Availability of horses is important as well.
    In Civ IV, it was all about the starting fat cross. In Civ5, it is all about your starting area. Tiles are weaker, so resources and land are more important. Anything that lets you continue to expand is crucial.
     
  5. alpaca

    alpaca King of Ungulates

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    Most important are probably access to luxuries, hills and a good mix of useful city states. Having a good capital position will help, too.
     
  6. EasyGoin

    EasyGoin Chieftain

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    My best games seem to depend on luxury availability. Hills are nice, marble is wonderful, rivers make me happy, but when I scout, if I find 2 more diverse luxury resources within about 12 hexes of my capital, I consider that a good start.

    And nearby CSs. Maritime + Cultural within a reasonable distance are excellent.
     
  7. alpaca

    alpaca King of Ungulates

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    I think city states are even more crucial, to be honest. In the extreme case, if you don't have a single maritime CS, your game will be a lot worse than usual (which makes the "no CS" option quite interesting and different to play). Of course, I have most experience with city-spam games where happiness from luxuries is only your expansion buffer rather than your primary source.
     
  8. RedRover57

    RedRover57 Emperor

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    I'm finding that if you really want to see the importance of starting position try a One City Challenge game on Pangaea at greater than Emperor difficulty. You need early access to luxuries (for trading), resources (iron, horses, or preferably both within your city radius), nearby maritime and cultural CS that are close enough to defend them from crazy AI and a good defensible location that is not dead center of the continent surrounded by hostiles.
     
  9. Nabob57

    Nabob57 Chieftain

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    Thanks all. I was thinking that what you get for a start position might reflect on the type of win. I guess it isnt that crucial for the type of win.

    I know hill tiles are for production and I make sure there are at least a couple in the first radius.

    Answers have me thinking.. I have tried the OCC at prince and most of the problems I have had were problems with luxuries. I never seem to have what anyone wants, or is willing to pay for. Can't get enough coin to make friends with the CS's. Then when I hit the iron, nine times out of ten its nowhere near my capital, so the aggressive civs who arent on top of me from the beginning are marching in with longswords and crossbows. The only thing that saves me is the AI is so terrible with tactics. But eventually I get overwhelmed by superior weapons because my one city can't hope to fund research. Maybe I should play on a small map with 28 CS? ha ha ha.
     

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