Greece kills me on the inside

Circlet the Zen

Chieftain
Joined
Jun 23, 2012
Messages
47
Upon going to war with Greece:

:c5citystate: The following City-States have declared war on you! :c5citystate:
Kathmandu
Manila
Singapore
Brussels
Bucharest
Almaty
Belgrade
Budapest
Venice
Sydney
Stockholm
Dublin
Oslo
Genoa
Lhasa
Monaco
Hanoi
Sidon
Tyre
Cape Town
Helinski​



me: :|
 
lucky for you city states never do anything when they dow....
slo
 
Upon going to war with Greece:

:c5citystate: The following City-States have declared war on you! :c5citystate:
Kathmandu
Manila
Singapore
Brussels
Bucharest
Almaty
Belgrade
Budapest
Venice
Sydney
Stockholm
Dublin
Oslo
Genoa
Lhasa
Monaco
Hanoi
Sidon
Tyre
Cape Town
Helinski​



me: :|

Good excuse to conquer some of the more troublesome citystates on your border.
I want to punish those citystates for allying with greece so when he declares, I eat up his allies. I think the more wars you drag your allies in, the harder it is to ally with them.
 
I'm playing as Korea and I had this happen. On a large map with 3 main land masses (2 in a position similar to the old and new world creating 2 big oceans, one off on its own) Athens was positioned such that it had complete control over a small channel which served as the only way out of the smaller 'Atlantic' ocean (bordered by Germany, Greece and the Romans) and into the Pacific where everyone else was. That channel was also the only truely viable point for embarking an army unless I wanted them to spend half a dozen turns at sea, so after I took all the German cities bordering the Atlantic (forming a land route all the way to my side of the channel) I had no choice but to take Athens if I didn't want to be at Greeces mercy for access to the outside world.

I didn't care much about all those CS being at war with me from a military standpoint (I still had my 2 CS allies protecting me from any land approach and providing me with lots of oil) but it did cost me most of my empire's happyness - on big maps you can get 'Friends' status through quests even if you aren't trying, so you end up with bonuses that add up to a lot.
 
Hmm, your avatar is very fitting, Circlet :D. That's why when against Greece I try my bst to steal any CSs away from them :)
 
Greece in Gods and Kings is seriously broken and needs to be fixed. Every game I have them in they end up as allies with nearly all city-states and they never lose them. They're worse than Austria.
 
Greece in Gods and Kings is seriously broken and needs to be fixed. Every game I have them in they end up as allies with nearly all city-states and they never lose them. They're worse than Austria.

It's easy to see how too. In large games with lots of city states, once you meet most of them, pretty much anything you do will gain you favor with someone. Recently acquired Truffles? Valetta likes you. Just built the Hagia Sophia? That's exactly what Vatican City wanted. Clearing a barb camp? Heck that can gain you favor with sometimes up to 3 CS's at a time. Combine that with the fact that Greeces UA is -50% influence depletion and it takes them a long time to negate any positive strides they've made. Not to mention the fact that Alex loves throwing money at the CS's too, and dear god if he goes patronage...
 
Greece in Gods and Kings is seriously broken and needs to be fixed. Every game I have them in they end up as allies with nearly all city-states and they never lose them. They're worse than Austria.

In my 2 games (playing on large with 14 civs and 28 CSs) Greece had 19 and 21 CSs following it respectively.

In my current game Greece is 4th?, but has 19 of the 26 existing CSs (I have 6 and #2 France has 1). Not saying it is necessarily broken, but they REALLY dominate the CS.
 
I'm playing as Korea and I had this happen. On a large map with 3 main land masses (2 in a position similar to the old and new world creating 2 big oceans, one off on its own).

What map script were you using? That sounds like the kind of map I've been trying to play on.
 
How did you turn off religion small fish and circlet the zen the majority of those city-states aren't in game unless you don't have GaK and all the vanilla patches.
 
How did you turn off religion small fish and circlet the zen the majority of those city-states aren't in game unless you don't have GaK and all the vanilla patches.

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My last game with a major war, I had an enemy ally with a city-state that was in the back of my territory. Had all my units in the frontlines so even the rushed purchases I made back there didn't save one city - it got capped and razed.

They're decent military allies, but only really if they are an extension of or contained by your own borders. Pretty good at drawing the fire of enemy forces, and generally have equal or slightly better tech
 
I watched two city states go to war with each other once. Neither was allied to a major power at war with anyone, but one just kept sending its units into the other's territory, at which point they'd get smacked by city defenses and limp back home to heal & do it all over again.

It was actually quite entertaining. :)
 
It's easy to see how too. In large games with lots of city states, once you meet most of them, pretty much anything you do will gain you favor with someone. Recently acquired Truffles? Valetta likes you. Just built the Hagia Sophia? That's exactly what Vatican City wanted. Clearing a barb camp? Heck that can gain you favor with sometimes up to 3 CS's at a time. Combine that with the fact that Greeces UA is -50% influence depletion and it takes them a long time to negate any positive strides they've made. Not to mention the fact that Alex loves throwing money at the CS's too, and dear god if he goes patronage...

In my 2 games (playing on large with 14 civs and 28 CSs) Greece had 19 and 21 CSs following it respectively.

In my current game Greece is 4th?, but has 19 of the 26 existing CSs (I have 6 and #2 France has 1). Not saying it is necessarily broken, but they REALLY dominate the CS.

Exactly. It did not take us long at all to realize how unbalanced Greece is now with some of the changes to city-states. It's almost impossible to overtake their alliance with city-states. Religion adds to it too since if Alex is the same religion as one of his city-state allies, his influence decreases even slower. I don't see how game testers or programmers didn't notice the problem with Greece now since we all figured it out pretty fast here. It may not be "broken," but it's definitely imbalanced and should (and I imagine will) be tweaked in an upcoming patch.
 
I don't see how game testers or programmers didn't notice the problem with Greece now since we all figured it out pretty fast here. It may not be "broken," but it's definitely imbalanced and should (and I imagine will) be tweaked in an upcoming patch.

There are other imbalanced things in the game, much more so then Greece UA.
Examples are Keshiks, Austria UA, Battering Ram and Camel Archer. Greece is probably much better now because of the boost of City State quests and the like.
City states suck IMO. Who cares about how many city states hate you when you are the first in tech and have the mightiest army? Assuming you are good ofc.:)
 
There are other imbalanced things in the game, much more so then Greece UA.
Examples are Keshiks, Austria UA, Battering Ram and Camel Archer. Greece is probably much better now because of the boost of City State quests and the like.
City states suck IMO. Who cares about how many city states hate you when you are the first in tech and have the mightiest army? Assuming you are good ofc.:)

Keshiks, the Battering Ram, and Camel Archer are just fine how they are. I'm not even sure the Austria UA needs changing.

City states make a huge difference on higher difficulty levels. If you're having such an easy time being first in tech and having the mightiest army, you need to up the difficulty level. It's not so easy to be first in tech and have the mightiest army on the higher difficulty levels, and the gifts from city-states could make a huge difference. When one AI player is getting those bonuses over you, it makes the game imbalanced. It's not broken, but it definitely needs balancing.
 
Why aren't you seeing constant coups swapping them? I just won a diplo victory and the amount of work required is incredible to keep your city-states in line, not because of decay but because there's a coup every few turns.
 
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