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Greece Struggles to Return Migrants Under EU-Turkey Deal

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by FriendlyFire, May 19, 2016.

  1. FriendlyFire

    FriendlyFire Codex WMDicanious

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    Plan B is to make Greece Island(s) into a giant refugee camp.
    Because Greece proccessing 100 people per month and letting 98 of them stay in Greece is not going to work out. Even with Germany promising 700 Mil Euromonies for Greece to house and feed Refugees because of the overcrowding and escalating violence.

    The Good news is less people coming now that EU has closed the gates.
    For Greece though I expect that it will be home to hundreds of thousands of refugees for a long time to come.


     
  2. luiz

    luiz Trendy Revolutionary

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    Who would say that electing far-left bozos would lead to economic and social ruination?

    Everybody.
     
  3. Arwon

    Arwon

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    So that's another way of saying they're genuine refugees and subject to convention protections hey?
     
  4. Arwon

    Arwon

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    Cos it seems to me that if you have people in your country and they're genuine recognised refugees, and you still have a half-way decent legal system, then attempting to return people with recognised rights to their country of origin is going to present very serious problems.

    The Australian government has needed to create extrajudicial island prison camps and rule that it's not in its own migration zone, just to get around our legal system's requirements around refugees having due process. You guys have a long way to go trashing your own legal norms before you get to that point. You're probably not ready to even deliberately torture people to dissuade others from attempting the journey, much less tolerate the occasional acts of self-immolation.

    And there's still the matter of the ECHR and various bills of rights to consider, which have no analogue in Australia.
     
  5. west india man

    west india man Immortal

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    The British government intentionally let refugees drown in the Mediterranean to dissuade others
     
  6. luiz

    luiz Trendy Revolutionary

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    No. The whole problem is that the Greek bozo-government refuses to acknowledge Turkey as a safe country, which it obviously is, so they're not enforcing an EU treaty they're supposed to be enforcing.

    These people are for the most part entering Greece from a safe country, Turkey, not directly escaping from Syria.

    Additionally, the patience of pretty much every European government has run out. Even Merkel has radically backtracked on her open doors madness. To say nothing of Austria or Slovenia. So either Greece plays ball or they'll become one huge refugee camp. But as the debt negotiation shows, Tsipras and his clowns are OK with ruining Greece.
     
  7. Flying Pig

    Flying Pig Utrinque Paratus

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    As a point of fact, they do the opposite of that.
     
  8. west india man

    west india man Immortal

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    What was the whole debacle around Mare Nostrum, then?
     
  9. FriendlyFire

    FriendlyFire Codex WMDicanious

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    Convention protections ? Yes
    Choosing which country in the EU they want to be resettled ? No

     
  10. Algeroth

    Algeroth 8 and 1/2

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    Mainly Paradox choosing wrong expansion model for EU IV, having no idea how to develop it further resulting in throwing everything they can on the wall and seeing what will stick, and their notoriously ...underwhelming QA.

    It wasn't great, but I wouldn't call it a debacle, tbh.
     
  11. Oruc

    Oruc Reactionary

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    It's like I'm really in Revleft
    :goodjob:
     
  12. christos200

    christos200 Never tell me the odds

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    I agree 100% percent with the above post. Tsipras is indeed a clown who ruins Greece.

    It is because of his leftist open borders policy which he followed in 2015 that we have this problem. Tsipras shut down the camps set up by the previous right wing government to jail illegal migrants and allowed them to enter unopposed Greece. Now, thankfully, this policy is being reversed but the damage has been done.

    Of course Greece cannot accept thousands of refugees when it cannot feed its own people. It has to adopt a more harsh anti-immigrant policy and protect its borders.

    Unfortunately this flow of immigrants may increase the % of Golden Dawn in the next elections but this is something which the left would have caused due to its open borders policies.

    But thankfully polls also show that the conservative party New Democracy is polling high so sooner or later they will come into power and protect Greek borders and stop illegal migration.
     
  13. warpus

    warpus In pork I trust

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    Why? Are they incompetent, are there logistical issues, funding issues, or what?
     
  14. NovaKart

    NovaKart شێری گەورە

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    I heard they had sent migrants back but I think the numbers were low. So many people lie that it makes it difficult to find out whose claims are admissible and when you have people refusing to go to safe but less desirable countries it does seem like their motivation is at least in a large part economic. Anyway I think it's quite likely the whole deal will collapse because both the EU and Erdoğan are refusing to back down over the Turkey's terrorism law and visa liberalization while Turkey becomes a dictatorship.
     
  15. Oerdin

    Oerdin Deity

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    Most of them are not genuine refugees and that is why you almost exclusively see working age males. They are just economic migrants shopping for the best welfare handouts.
     
  16. Ajidica

    Ajidica High Quality Person

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  17. NovaKart

    NovaKart شێری گەورە

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    Back in 2015 most of the migrants were single men but this has changed in 2016. However when you look at how attempts have been made to settle some migrants in less desirable countries in Europe and this was met with flat refusal it does seem like the primary motivation in going to Europe isn't necessarily to escape conflict.
     
  18. Oerdin

    Oerdin Deity

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    89% of migrants have been men without their families. Genuine refugees who are fleeing for their lives bring their whole families so they will not be killed. We pretty much just see working aged males and that sort of migration is called economic migration.

    The fact that they walk through half a dozen safe nations heading directly for the ones with the most generous welfare benefits does indeed mean they are welfare benefits shopping.
     
  19. Ajidica

    Ajidica High Quality Person

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    First off, it isn't 89% of men without families.
    UNHRC puts the data for current migrants at around 45% males and Eurostat puts the 2013 data at around 50% males. It wasn't immediately apparent whether the data tracked if they were arriving with or without families but even assuming every single male recorded by the UNHRC/Eurostat were unmarried men, you are still over by about 40%.
    http://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statis...s_by_sex,_2013_(%_of_all_immigrants)_YB15.png
    http://data.unhcr.org/mediterranean/regional.php

    Additionally, as the situation in Eritrea makes clear, working age men are likely one of the groups most likely to be seeking refugee status due to the Eritrean government treating mandatory military service as, in the words of UN investigators "slavery like practices".
    http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-33446423

    Care to prove that they are going to Germany or Sweden because of welfare benefits?
     
  20. Oerdin

    Oerdin Deity

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    http://www.thepoliticalinsider.com/heres-one-fact-dismantles-syrian-refugee-myth/

    Even the UN puts the figure at 72% being male.

    As for why we know they are seeking the biggest welfare payouts as soon as a country cuts the amount of welfare these economic migrants can get applications drop like a rock where as those countries which keep offering generous welfare benefits see applications surge. The respond almost perfectly to how much welfare is on offer.
     

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