Greece

[Arkaeyn]

So I've played several games as the Greeks, and I'm thinking they're a little bit too easy to win with. Their UHV is pretty well achievable if marble and bronze are near their first two cities. Add stone, and they're a wonder machine. Even if they don't succeed in hitting the Wonder goal by turn 124, the sheer amount of wonders and Great People they can churn out makes them a cultural monster.

If they manage to found/control a religion, which can happen pretty easily by getting Buddhism if India doesn't spawn, Confucianism if China doesn't, Judaism by flipping Jerusalem, or most likely, Christianity by popping the Oracle/Theology, their culture and stability get fired up. The Colossus and Great Lighthouse can help churn out merchants, so money isn't really problem.

The only really dangerous things are bad spawns by the Romans or Carthaginians flipping an important city, or overexpansion destroying stability.

So what can be done about the Greeks? I think they spawn at an odd time - early enough to get a great jumpstart on the other classical civs, and with WAY more tech (especially Metal Casing) than the ancient civs have when they appear. Their 150% GP rate also can be a little much. I build the Colossus and end up with two Great Merchants without really paying too much attention.

 

[ledat]

I think this post reinforces my decision to only place huge sized maps. If all the civs spawn every time, much of the problem will go away. Not only will the other civs reliably found religions, but many of them will provide some (albeit weak) competition for the early wonders. China, for example, will almost always build the Hanging Gardens if the player-civ doesn't.

Some civs in RAND are nearly impossible to win with, UHV or otherwise. Is it really such a problem that Greece (and the Netherlands and Portugal) are comparatively easy?

Having said that, though, sometimes I've noticed that AI Greece is a veritable superpower. This happens in a minority of my games, perhaps 15 percent, but there have been times I have spawned as the Dutch and been *behind* in tech, thanks to the Greeks. This situation is not the norm, however.

 

[Fierabras]

EDIT: double post

 

[Fierabras]

If you find it too easy to win playing Greece, it's very likely your competition is doing badly, India in particular when boxed in by jungle (which will be fixed in a next version).

Apart from that, the UHV for Greece doesn't depend heavily on the map and resources and therefore is relatively easier than the other UHV's

 

[Arkaeyn]

I think this post reinforces my decision to only place huge sized maps. If all the civs spawn every time, much of the problem will go away. Not only will the other civs reliably found religions, but many of them will provide some (albeit weak) competition for the early wonders. China, for example, will almost always build the Hanging Gardens if the player-civ doesn't.

Some civs in RAND are nearly impossible to win with, UHV or otherwise. Is it really such a problem that Greece (and the Netherlands and Portugal) are comparatively easy?

Huge sized maps aren't an option for all of us. Too much loading time.

And I don't think it's a terrible thing to have some civs not show up all the time. India in particular - they're pretty much guaranteed to found Buddhism and Hinduism anytime they show up, so when they don't and the religions are spread out a bit more, the game gets more interesting.

The UHV victoy I just won had all the ancient civs, and all the classical civs except Persia. The main thing was that I started next to marble, sent my settler south to found a city next to bronze, and flipped Jerusalem with its stone. Pretty smooth after that.

I've noticed that if Greece gets the Great Wall, they can end up as a massive superpower.