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Ground military units explained

Discussion in 'Strategy Section' started by tu_79, Apr 9, 2016.

  1. tu_79

    tu_79 Deity

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    In CPP, units are very similar to BNW, but more coherent. As a rule, a unit upgrades to something that does the same thing, has the same relative cost, but works better. In every branch, there is at least one new unit every two ages (no more waiting forever for pikemen).


    Explorers

    You may think explorers are only worth for first turns, and that cavalry is better to explore mid-game. Now explorers also upgrade to more powerful explorer units. They are capable to stand one hit or two from any unit of its time, so they are worth for exploring any time. Even late game, they upgrade into paratroopers.
    Explorers gain experience just by discovering new tiles, so if you can keep them alive, they'll make great paratroopers. Their promotions grant faster movement on different terrains, better defence and faster healing, and they may even ignore zone of control. Late game, they may be not so good for recon (mounted units are better), but for infiltration and last blows.

    Basic melee

    They are your spearmen, pikemen, so forth. They are cheap, basically cannon fodder, but they stand against mounted and armored units. Their promotions are fine even after gunpowder, so it's worth to keep them alive. The very first unit, the warrior, is gifted against barbarians.


    Basic ranged

    They are archers, musketmen, so forth. They attack at 2 tiles range with direct fire (targets obscured by terrain), even with gunpowder upgrades. They cannot take cities and starting from machine gun they get a penalty against cities. Their shots are weak and they are fragile, but provide good support if behind melee units.


    Expert melee

    They are swordmen and upgrades. They only exist until gunpowder, when they upgrade into basic melee. Iron is required. They are stronger units that can stand against city shoots and even take cities alone. They offer good cover for ranged units.


    Siege

    These machines are the best to break down city defences. Early siege units don't require anything, have a 2 direct fire range and need to spend 1 movement to set up. They start with Cover I promotion. Starting from cannons they require iron. Starting from artillery they have range 3 and indirect fire.


    Mounted melee

    These are horsemen, lancers and tanks. They are fast, strong, can move after attack, but aren't so good taking cities. They require horses, and petrol later on. They excel at killing ranged units and raiding.


    Skirmishers

    They are mounted archers, cavalry and helicopters. They are fast and can move after attack. They have a range 1 attack, so they are good for hit and run tactics, and are easier to keep alive. Like mounted melee, they require horses, and petrol later.
     
  2. tompliss

    tompliss Warlord

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    Has it changed in the latest beta ?
    Siege units don't have indirect fire until Artillery (Atomic age), iirc.
     
  3. Strigvir

    Strigvir Emperor

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    He implied pre-Artillery units are garbage and Artillery is available in the Industrial era.
     
  4. Senteliks

    Senteliks Warlord

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    Not really, unless you are complete idiot. Weaker ? Yeah sure, you need to be more cautious and involve more effort in making them worthwhile.

    FYI, you are not helping.Your comments are straight forward insulting or useless, so try to be a bit more elaborate or at least give explanation to your "statements".
     
  5. tompliss

    tompliss Warlord

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    Senteliks, could you please calm down ? there is no need to calm each other idiots, or saying that what they're saying is useless.
    You can disagree, but stay courteous.
     
  6. tu_79

    tu_79 Deity

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    To be fair, siege units were changing in betas, sometimes they have direct fire, sometimes indirect, so I wasn't sure how to address this.

    In 3-9 stable release, cities are so weak that you can take them even without siege units. This has changed in betas and now sieges are welcomed to take cities. Even a couple of catapults can make a difference. They don't require iron any more, so it's viable to field them.
     
  7. Strigvir

    Strigvir Emperor

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    So you blame me writing something "insulting" or "useless", yet at the same time call me an idiot and not write in-depth why are they so awesome.
    Good job, idiot.
     
  8. tompliss

    tompliss Warlord

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    Anyway, siege units haven't changed in the 4/5 beta, so indirect fire begins at artillery, and it can change everything when a city is well placed ;)
    (please edit the OP :p )
     
  9. tu_79

    tu_79 Deity

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    Done. Thanks!
     
  10. Senteliks

    Senteliks Warlord

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    Edit: Never mind

    It will always, amuse me how people interpreter something wrote on internet by someone. In any case, I stand besides that what he says is "non-informative" (since apparently "useless" is rude way to put it) and wasn't even directly related to previous question above his post.

    Also I didn't imply that he is "idiot", or anyone specifically . As tu_79 it was impersonal but people usually don't know how to read between lines or interpret something with too much seriousness or emotions, completely missing point or twisting it's meaning.
     
  11. tu_79

    tu_79 Deity

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    About the controversy, I wasn't implying that catapults are useless. It was just a mistake. I remember to have seen catapults with indirect fire, but can't remember when. It may change from version to version, so perhaps I shouldn't be so specific.

    And I think 'unless you are a complete idiot', was meant to be impersonal. Meaning 'anybody who is not a complete idiot can benefit from siege units'. But maybe it's just me who don't want to see offence.
     
  12. Strigvir

    Strigvir Emperor

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    You did. "Not really, unless you are complete idiot." is implicative of complete idiotism as it can get.
    More like the forum rules don't alow anything non-100% passive-aggressive, so that's why you try to come up with excuses.
    And fyi cheesing AI with catapults doesn't mean you play "smart". Pre-artillery siege units really feel like poor man archers, the only incentive to use them is damage multipliers, not some unique combat role.
     
  13. Senteliks

    Senteliks Warlord

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    I won't even bother to replay before this point

    What now ? This is where I lost you. Unless you somehow amass bunch of swordsman units and somehow manage to position bunch of archers out of harms way with line of sight towards target city, good luck with taking any city beyond 9+ score without early siege units,you will likely cheese AI to "death", or draw a stalemate . More I read what you write , less credible you sound.
     
  14. leif erikson

    leif erikson Game of the Month Fanatic Administrator Supporter GOTM Staff

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    Moderator Action: Please cease the personal attacks. Stick to the subject of the thread, discuss the subject and its issues. Once you start talking about each other it is trolling/flaming.

    If you feel you are being trolled, report the post and do NOT answer it. Answering only makes it worse and develops the personal insults.

    Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889
     
  15. tu_79

    tu_79 Deity

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    We can disagree, but I am happier with two catapults if I am going for a capital conquest. Archers do minimal damage and there are so few sweet spots from where to shoot the city, that every turn matters.
    Moreover, if we could easily conquer any city without siege units, then the unit is not well balanced, and Gazebo or any other modder will change it until siege units matter again.
     
  16. hokath

    hokath King

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    On topic, Archers have been made significantly weaker (in CBP vs BNW) and this is important for people to know. Siege units are stronger in raw RCS and, among other things, get a free Cover promotion that you might want to mention.
     
  17. tu_79

    tu_79 Deity

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    I am unsure about anti-air units. Are they an upgrade for any of the other or is it its own branch? And could anyone explain their peculiarities?
     
  18. Senteliks

    Senteliks Warlord

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    Anti-air, last time I got them, are only really good at taking down Air units and can be used to wear down infantry units, if you are in desperate need but other than that, they are not really useful. I can't remember from which branch they upgrade, although they are not separate branch, unless something changed from last time I played full game, which is highly possible. Most of the time I build only few of them, because air intercepts are always better alternative if you can afford them.

    There is one other use and that would be as bait, because they are cheap,mobile, can deal damage and hold ground for awhile, allowing you to maneuver or deploy your main force.
     
  19. tu_79

    tu_79 Deity

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    Well, I have produced some anti-air units for garrison, they've got good strength, but I haven't used them in combat. I don't let other civs to attack me with planes.
    Don't know why I think they cannot attack other than planes. If that is the case, even being a ground unit, maybe it's worth mentioning in a air units post.
     

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