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Help winning at Deity Level by using military force

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Strategy & Tips' started by Blanchflower, Mar 10, 2009.

  1. Blanchflower

    Blanchflower Chieftain

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    I hope someone can help me here. I am playing on Deity Level, tiny map, using the Persians and the Japanese is my nemesis. How to win by military might at this level??? Every time, I attack the Japanese, I seem to be outnumbered!! Is it possible to win at this level by using military force? I always seem to be behind the tech race and the Japanese are creating archers and horsemen very very very fast!!! Is it possible??

    I am playing on a tiny map because I want to win as soon as possible. I can win at Demi-God level with ease but Deity Level seems to be too much for me! I shudder to think what awaits me at Sid Level!! I am playing C3C.

    Thanks!!!!

    :):)
     
  2. Calis

    Calis on time

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    On Deity you cannot outnumber the AI usually.

    As Deity is a little bit above my comfort level, too, I try to get the Statue of Zeus for additional forces. But this requires ivory of course.

    Another important thing is to use artillery (cats, trebs, ...), thus, you can minimize your losses while defeating the opponent.

    And try to find a choke point on the map where you fight your opponents.

    And by the way: With archers and horsemen you are really lucky. What about swords, or even Samurai?
     
  3. Blanchflower

    Blanchflower Chieftain

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    Yes, I have been "lucky" in a way that the AI never produce Samurais at all! Even if they produce them, the number is limited because by that time, I have given up hope on beating the AI. But is it humanly possible to win by military conquest???

    :)
     
  4. Calis

    Calis on time

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    Yes!

    ;)

    As I said. A good mix of offensive military units (in your case Immortals) and cats can do the job. Bring at least around 15 cats for the beginning. I'd ignore defensive units as spears have an equal defense as Immortals, but are useless offensively.
     
  5. ThinkTank

    ThinkTank RL Addict

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    I never played on a tiny map, but is it correct that the Japanase are your only opponent? That in fact makes it harder since you are now the only force that must deal with the large number of units that a deity AI has due to the deity production bonus. With more AIs on the map, you have another option, let the AIs may fight amongst each other, killing the large numbers before you come in and finish the job.
     
  6. TheOverseer714

    TheOverseer714 Overseer

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    Just from what I've seen on this forum, I know that the AI gets such a huge bonus at Deity and Sid that they can and do build single-turn Archers and such. The AI goes nuts with this and builds units to the point of having dozens or even hundreds of units per city. You have to trick the AI into pulling their units out of the cities to take said cities. Force them to use boats to invade your lands, if their massives SoDs get in your back yard, you are toast. Two good people to help you on here might be vmxa or Chamnix, they both routinely play the highest levels. I'm not sure if I admire them or pity them for being brave enough to do that. Actually, I think it's both:D
     
  7. Lord Emsworth

    Lord Emsworth Chieftain

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    Upgrades. Make sure you somehow aquire Iron Working, but otherwise don't research anything at all. Instead stow up all the cash to upgrade Warriors to Swords. Being Military is probably about as good as, if not better than, having Immortals.
     
  8. I. Larkin

    I. Larkin Chieftain

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    At my experiense 1 opponent at the same (small) landmass is the most difficult setup at Deity level. Only if AI starts at tundra and you with few Cattles like at GR-25 may help. No Iron on AI lant is also big plus.
    But at "equal start" sooner or later land to settle will run out, AI will overproduced MUs and declare no matter what.
    Warriors->Swords gambit may help, but then normally overseas AI's run away at this scheme.
    Always, at any specific situation human may find somethnig, but there is no universal solution yet.
     
  9. ville-v

    ville-v Chieftain

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    Actually, I tested this recently by giving the AI small islands and cost factor of 1 (and no extra free unit support). Since I was in debug mode, I witnessed how the AI settled land before I had my third city, and started building troops like no tomorrow. They were running with far negative income, but cities were spitting troops faster than they disbanded. The time they discovered map making, they had 100-150 spearmen per city and were unable to build galleys, so they never found each other :lol:

    Conquest would have been impossible before marines, though, and if there had been two AIs per island, they would have zoomed past everybody in tech and commerce because of endless wars, and the winner would have built huge navy and conquered everything.
     
  10. Blanchflower

    Blanchflower Chieftain

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    Thanks for the reply mate! So, does this mean that I have to choose a bigger land mass? Or increase the number of AIs in the game?

    :):)
     
  11. eldar

    eldar ChiefTank

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    Which of course leads back to this game.
     
  12. I. Larkin

    I. Larkin Chieftain

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    Sort of. With 3-4 AI on big starting land mass there is a big room for Diplomacy and MAs. You may make AIs fight vs each other and participate effectively.

    On island alone start also playable, as AI never use suicide Galleys.
    1 Opponent also doable, but need special trics like "AI's settlers blockade", effective land control, ets.
    The more land you have for this the better. I recon that at this start Large map simpler then Standart (in general) but I did not try small one yet.
     
  13. zerksees

    zerksees in remission

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    A single deity AI is a pain but can be beaten. I like the concept of going after the cities. You will have a hard time with this until you get an army to hide your attack force under.

    Since I have never played a one on one like that I can't say the best way to go about it, but I would think a good settler factory and land grab is top priority. The AI will get ahead in tech but the lightning spped they get from trading won't be there. Once the land grab is over get your defenses together and get to war.

    Since the AI can outproduce you, it is important to watch the ratio of units you take vs units you lose. I think the AI gets like a 60% discount (spearman costs 8 shields not 20). For 100 shields you can build 5 archers or spears, the AI can build 12.5. This means you will need to wipe out almost three of theirs for every one of your that is lost. Really 4 to 1 is probably safer so you can slip some other improvements in between.

    How do you do this? Well you have to maximize opportunities. The AI should never get to attack you immortals. Put a spearman on top to defend since he is cheaper. Always travel in stacks with some archers in there. As you know archers can strike first on an enemy attacker, taking off a hitpoint - this helps tip the odds. Get your units on a mountain, hill or in a forest. Get fortified up there when you know they are coming. Find natural ways to force attackers into grassland before attacking them. Use the combat calculator and figure out if you are better off attacking or defending. If you can configure your border so they have to approach your walled city on a hill from grasslands, you have an advantage. You are going to face big stacks outside your city walls, don't panic, and don't worry about clearing the last one in the stack. If your troops sit outside the wall, they will get picked off on the IBT (you could keep a horsemen or other 2 move unit for this). Of course you also want artillery since it fires when they attack and when you attack.

    You will probably want to be in war most of the time to keep them from getting a big surge in units. If you can overcome the initial surge then the rest is manageable. If the wars start before they get all their roads up then it will keep them from getting that giant surge where you get completely overrun.

    I played a succession game at deity where we got down to us (India) and the AI (Persia). It was a little late in the game when this happened since there were many AI at the start. Persia really was running away with it. They had almost 50 cities and we had 5 IIRC. You can read the whole SG story its in the civ index link in my sig - or at this link: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=153707, you could read it all or start around page 13
     
  14. AutomatedTeller

    AutomatedTeller Frequent poster

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    that's really it - build a ton of cats (10-20), force the AI into the flatlands, redline them and then kill them.

    When you declare on them, DON'T ATTACK - wait. You'll get a huge stack or two coming into your land. Make sure front line cities are defended and leave second line cities undefended, then bombard the stacks as they go and start killing units. Get an army, fill it with immortals and use it to cover your cats.
     

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