Here in murica we speak English! Anything else is offensive!

[Formaldehyde]

Isn't that the definition of advertising? The only other option is to convince people who already use their products to continue to use them.

No, not at all.

The purpose of these ads is to retain their market share while trying to win over some who drink other brands. A large segment of their market share are people from other countries who drank their products or similar ones long before immigrating to the US.

It's like the Maserati car ads during the Super Bowl while even being a sponsor. If you are adamantly opposed to owning a car in the first place or are only interested in cheap utilitarian transportation, there is really no reason for Maserati to create an ad directed at you. They would be wasting their money trying to get you to purchase an item that you will not even consider.

Again, I'm not sure what is ignorant or hateful about expecting people in a melting pot to melt.

Not saying that there are not some ignorant and hateful people that hold to this belief, but it's not ignorant or hateful to expect someone who moves into a different culture to, at least partly, assimilate into that culture.

That seems like a huge assumption on your part that they refuse to assimilate. That this is the reason they continue to occasionally speak a language which they are far more familiar while around those who speak the same language.

Do you have any reputable source which claims this refusal is occurring outside of a handful of cases?

I also think you missed the entire point of the commercial. Coke wasn't claiming that people shouldn't naturally assimilate as they now do. They were pointing out that this country continues to receive people from other countries with open arms despite the massive protestations from the usual xenophobic suspects. That it is part of our cultural heritage to do so.

 

[TrafficJam]

How many native American languages are you fluent in?

Zero, but of course I was born in a time when the dominant language of America was English.

Way to dodge the question, btw.

That seems like a huge assumption on your part that they refuse to assimilate. That this is the reason they continue to occasionally speak a language which they are far more familiar while around those who speak the same language.

Do you have any reputable source which claims this refusal is occurring outside of a handful of cases?

I also think you missed the entire point of the commercial. Coke wasn't claiming that people shouldn't naturally assimilate as they now do. They were pointing out that this country continues to receive people from other countries with open arms despite the massive protestations from the usual xenophobic suspects. That it is part of our cultural heritage to do so. That it would be totally unreasonable to demand they now only speak English.

Did you miss the part where I said "at least partly," or where I essentially said "by all means, keep your language and culture, but adopt ours as well"?

 

[BenitoChavez]

No, not at all.

The purpose of these ads is to retain their market share while trying to win over some who drink other brands. A large segment of their market share are people from other countries who drank their products or similar ones long before immigrating to the US.

It's like the Maserati car ads during the Super Bowl while even being a sponsor. If you are adamantly opposed to owning a car in the first place or are only interested in cheap utilitarian transportation, there is really no reason for Maserati to create an ad directed at you. They would be wasting their money trying to get you to purchase an item that you will not even consider.

Ah, I glossed over the fact that you were making a distinction between people who outright hate a product and those who simple don't use it (but may not hate it). My bad.

No one (or at least I am not) is asking them to give up their language and culture. Keep it, by all means. But recognize that 300 million Americans aren't going to learn Spanish or Italian or whatever just because you've moved here, so you really should make an effort to learn how to communicate with all of us, not just those that happen to speak the language you already know.

Do you really think that a significant number of immigrants don't partially assimilate to American culture? If they didn't know basic english they wouldn't be able to function in America at all.

 

[Kyriakos]

Ah, I glossed over the fact that you were making a distinction between people who outright hate a product and those who simple don't use it (but may not hate it). My bad.


Do you really think that a significant number of immigrants don't partially assimilate to American culture? If they didn't know basic english they wouldn't be able to function in America at all.

Depends on what you mean by "basic english". Sure, they will pick up the few words they need to work, that is to be expected and every person in that state would actively try to manage it as soon as possible. But it has to be doubted that the vast majority of illegal immigrants can speak english in the level of (let's say) an elementary* english school certificate. Obviously if you are illegal and poor you won't be able to have lessons in the language, so you cannot realistically speak it either, unless you already knew how to speak it.

*By this i refer to the name of the english certificate for foreign speakers, usually taken in the end of elementary school. Following levels are "Lower" and "Proficiency". Afaik one needs the Proficiency level to be admitted to most foreign schools.

 

[Hygro]

The idea of actually advertising a product is pretty much dead. They try to sell you a lifestyle now. They want you to feel uplifted about buying the product, or jealous of other people who have one.

When's the last time you saw someone on an alcohol commercial actually drink? At least in the US, they never show it. The bottle will go to their lips and then it cuts. Otherwise, it's straight partying.

TLP?

I certainly think people take this too far, but on the other hand I don't really get why people get upset (dare I say, intolerant) at people who think English should be spoken in this country. Isn't the purpose of a melting pot to melt dissimilar substances into one homogenous substance? I don't think we should be asking people to give up their culture or language, and we should certainly celebrate the diversity that we have in this country, but I don't think it's asking too much for people who jump into a melting pot to actually melt.

Because that's not what a melting pot metaphor is. A melting pot doesn't filter away differences, it fuses them. This means that in true melting pot logic, if Coca-Cola deems correctly that there's more money in advertising that song in many languages, that reflects the composition of a melted pot that is very much in favor of promoting the trappings of multiculturalism.

And therefore anyone demanding the end to that practice is against being part of the melting pot.

But it has to be doubted that the vast majority of illegal immigrants can speak english in the level of (let's say) an elementary* english school certificate.

It doesn't. Maybe upon arrival, but certainly not after a few years.

 

[aelf]

I'd say it was far more effective at galvanizing the section of the populace that gets rock hard to the idea of being able to masturbate offense at and self-righteousness over the "ignorant and hateful." Granted, it's still an advertising coup.

You missed the post before the one right above yours.

Or is this just your usual expression of disdain for people with progressive sentiments?

 

[Farm Boy]

And you missed the part where I paid point to that objection, while noting it was the minority of people concerned with this advert. Which certainly does appear to be the case.

Haven't seen you a ton. How ya been?

 

[Hygro]

You missed the post before the one right above yours.

Or is this just your usual expression of disdain for people with progressive sentiments?

It's true though, anyone paying attention knows thats where the money is these days, and Coca-Cola is hip to that.

 

[naterator]

Again, I'm not sure what is ignorant or hateful about expecting people in a melting pot to melt.

Not saying that there are not some ignorant and hateful people that hold to this belief, but it's not ignorant or hateful to expect someone who moves into a different culture to, at least partly, assimilate into that culture.

If you expect them to melt into you, you have to be willing to melt back. When carbon is melted into iron, the carbon doesn't become iron, it changes the iron.

People who are actually upset over this don't want a melting pot, where they can make delicious mixtures of cheeses; they want to beat immigrants over the head with a philosopher's stone until foreigners are transmuted into Americans.

 

[Formaldehyde]

Did you miss the part where I said "at least partly," or where I essentially said "by all means, keep your language and culture, but adopt ours as well"?

Did you miss the part where I asked you to provide information from a reputable source that this is some sort of real occurrence on a fairly large scale, instead of an apparent fantasy based on perhaps a handful of isolated cases?

 

[Kyriakos]

It is racist that in Bayswater (area of zone1 London) there are no signs for the roads in Greek, given that most of the businesses and students there are Greek anyway. England is a racist country like that. Merica is just more of the same. When will people learn that if you have foreign communities in part of your country, that part is now foreign?

 

[BenitoChavez]

Depends on what you mean by "basic english". Sure, they will pick up the few words they need to work, that is to be expected and every person in that state would actively try to manage it as soon as possible. But it has to be doubted that the vast majority of illegal immigrants can speak english in the level of (let's say) an elementary* english school certificate. Obviously if you are illegal and poor you won't be able to have lessons in the language, so you cannot realistically speak it either, unless you already knew how to speak it.

*By this i refer to the name of the english certificate for foreign speakers, usually taken in the end of elementary school. Following levels are "Lower" and "Proficiency". Afaik one needs the Proficiency level to be admitted to most foreign schools.

Ok, but illegal immigrants are illegal....which means they aren't supposed to be in the country. Why would you expect them to assimilate if they are just going to be deported?

 

[Hygro]

Even though many (most?) unlicensed immigrants do "assimilate"

 

[aelf]

Sure, it's all a farce since Coke just wants to sell soda (and sure, the suits will say with a straight face that it's a "win-win" or "a socially-conscious redefined business model" - and God forbid anyone who works for them would dare to question this unshakeable belief), but there's nothing wrong with people expressing outrage at things they ought to be outraged about. It's a healthy sign, and people who crap on that are either just trying to be edgy or hold the opposite views.

Haven't seen you a ton.

Aren't you glad?

It is racist that in Bayswater (area of zone1 London) there are no signs for the roads in Greek, given that most of the businesses and students there are Greek anyway. England is a racist country like that. Merica is just more of the same. When will people learn that if you have foreign communities in part of your country, that part is now foreign?

Have you campaigned for this, or are you just sitting at your keyboard all day bashing away and pretending everyone is beneath you, as you are wont to do?

 

[Hygro]

Because that's not what a melting pot metaphor is. A melting pot doesn't filter away differences, it fuses them. This means that in true melting pot logic, if Coca-Cola deems correctly that there's more money in advertising that song in many languages, that reflects the composition of a melted pot that is very much in favor of promoting the trappings of multiculturalism.

And therefore anyone demanding the end to that practice is against being part of the melting pot.

If you expect them to melt into you, you have to be willing to melt back. When carbon is melted into iron, the carbon doesn't become iron, it changes the iron.

People who are actually upset over this don't want a melting pot, where they can make delicious mixtures of cheeses; they want to beat immigrants over the head with a philosopher's stone until foreigners are transmuted into Americans.

you wrote that so much better.

 

[Farm Boy]

Aren't you glad?

Nah! You seem aight Mr. Aelf. Perhaps a bit more tightly wound than I know what do to with, but then it wouldn't do to get bored, now would it?

 

[JollyRoger]

Zero, but of course I was born in a time when the dominant language of America was English.

Way to dodge the question, btw.

So your excuse for not assimillating is you come from many generations that have refused to assimilate?

As to dodging questions, you admit you were putting words in my mouth, so I deemed it too strawish to address.

 

[TrafficJam]

If you expect them to melt into you, you have to be willing to melt back. When carbon is melted into iron, the carbon doesn't become iron, it changes the iron.

That's a valid point. Hadn't really thought of it that way. But you'd at least admit that the smaller substance will change more than the bigger one, wouldn't you?

Did you miss the part where I asked you to provide information from a reputable source that this is some sort of real occurrence on a fairly large scale, instead of an apparent fantasy based on perhaps a handful of isolated cases?

No, I didn't miss it, but I never really claimed it was happening on a large scale anyway, so I'm not sure why you're pressing the issue except to try to make some kind of point about me being an intolerant jerk with no data to back me up.

Look, I don't have a problem with immigrants. It doesn't bother me that they choose to speak in their native tongue when they are in groups where that tongue is dominant. I wasn't bothered by the commercial. My whole hope in getting involved in this thread was to point out that there's room for improvement on both sides of the issue here: the assimilation crowd is maybe needs to think a little more about naterator's point above about both sides needing to melt, and the diversity crowd might be a little better off if they understood that sometimes they come off sounding like they're saying, "I can't tolerate how intolerant you are."

 

[JollyRoger]

I do not see mocking intolerance as necessarily being intolerant of intolerance.

If it is intolerance, then the intolerant should be happy that I am assimilating to their ways.

 

[Hygro]

This ad really is everything wrong with mainstream America. Super Bowl ads show you what people want to see. Indeed Farm Boy is correct, the outrage, the umbrage, that is the desired response. Xenophobes, racists, they have no more political power. That outrage triggers the counter-outrage. The counter outrage is the mainstream identity affirmation. That's the "aspirational lifestyle" that Antilogic mentions that Coke is selling. Gen Xers (but really Baby Boomers and the most facebook-activist of our gen) falling for it every time. Why? They want to. Because they all secretly want to be Mad Max survivalists.

This isn't actually about multiculturalism or pro-The World. It's about feeling good for "not being xenophobic", "not being racist" but supporting economic policies that result in race discrimination and national security policies that make olive and brown skinned people humiliated every time they travel by air.

The only good thing that can come out of this is I can work on Wall St and none of y'all are going to pitchfork and torch me.