HOF Civ5 Update Discussion

[Denniz]

The Civilization V Hall of Fame has been updated. 35 games were accepted since the previous update.

Congratulations to Dines for the highest Firaxis score of the update with a Deity, Domination, Marathon, Standard, Great Plains Plus, Mongolia (Genghis Khan) [BNW] game for 6493 points.

JWideman was the most active player during this update, submitting 8 games.

Only 4 players were brave enough to take on Deity this update:
blatc - 1280 AD, Turn 188, 5424 points, Deity, Science, Standard, Standard, Great Plains, Poland (Casimir III) [BNW]
Dines - 1050 BC, Turn 245, 4281 points, Deity, Domination, Marathon, Standard, Pangaea, Songhai (Askia) [BNW]
Dines - 1220 BC, Turn 228, 6493 points, Deity, Domination, Marathon, Standard, Great Plains Plus, Mongolia (Genghis Khan) [BNW]
Dines - 340 BC, Turn 316, 2547 points, Deity, Domination, Marathon, Huge, Pangaea, Arabia (Harun al-Rashid) [BNW]
Dines - 715 AD, Turn 443, 782 points, Deity, Domination, Marathon, Huge, Large Islands, England (Elizabeth) [BNW]
johncparr - 2270 BC, Turn 123, 3975 points, Deity, Domination, Marathon, Duel, Great Plains Plus, Mongolia (Genghis Khan) [BNW]
R.G.A.M. - Jan 1944 AD, Turn 539, 1305 points, Deity, Science, Epic, Standard, Terra, Denmark (Harald) [BNW]

Gauntlet Results:
G-Minor CXXXIX - Domination, King, Standard, Small Continents, Standard, Greece (Alexander)
1st vadalaz - 250 BC T-105
2nd zlither - 1250 AD T-185
3rd walkyc - 1750 AD T-260

** New Gauntlets Starting **
G-Minor CXXXX - Diplomacy, Prince, Standard, Inland Sea, Epic, Morocco (Ahmad al-Mansur)

 

[Denniz]

A number of players earned Gold Medals this update:

Fastest Finish (Date):
vadalaz - 1140 AD, Turn 174, 5002 points, Chieftain, Diplomacy, Standard, Standard, Terra, Shoshone (Pocatello) [BNW]
vadalaz - 80 BC, Turn 168, 2313 points, Prince, Domination, Epic, Standard, Continents, Carthage (Dido) [BNW]
vadalaz - 1180 AD, Turn 178, 5351 points, Prince, Diplomacy, Standard, Standard, Great Plains Plus, Persia (Darius I) [BNW]
zenmaster - 225 AD, Turn 124, 2608 points, Prince, Culture, Standard, Standard, Small Continents, Persia (Darius I) [BNW]
vadalaz - 300 BC, Turn 103, 2645 points, Warlord, Culture, Standard, Standard, Tiny Islands, Venice (Enrico Dandolo) [BNW]
zenmaster - 40 AD, Turn 76, 3030 points, Warlord, Domination, Quick, Standard, Fractal, Mongolia (Genghis Khan) [BNW]

Score:
zenmaster - 2608 points, 225 AD, Turn 124, Prince, Culture, Standard, Standard, Small Continents, Persia (Darius I) [BNW]

 

[Denniz]

Veni Vidi Vici News
The following players have joined the ranks of those completing all the VVV categories. Congratulations!

namib
PujolsFan

 

[zenmaster]

Congratulations to namib and PujolsFan for completing the Veni Vidi Vici!

A serious undertaking and a tremendous accomplishment. Kudos!

 

[Dines]

I´m still struggling with my transition from marathon to standard speed.
There were only a few epic deity domination landmap records to beat, and they were not so hard.

But standard speed is a whole other story.

I first tried one of my favorite civs, germany (love free units)
I came close once, with an honor attempt, just one turn short, but i cant beat the record.
So i decided to take a closer look at all the records to try and learn from them.

Excluding attilla, there are 9 deity, domination, pangea, standard, standard records to beat.
The first observation, is that all of these records has a start with mining luxuries. 6 of them with plenty of salt. But i guess we all knew that that is the best start to get.
6 of the records are hold by Moriarte. So i gave him a closer look.
In june 2013, Moriarte posted a deity domination liberty guide.
he then sets 5 of his 6 records using a tradition strategy.
And then, in late 2014, when the tradition tree was nerfed, it seems like he stopped playing....

But of course, the fastest win is Vadalaz´ 425 byzantium win. And that was a liberty strategy.
So that required a closer look. And that was extremely helpfull.
Vadalaz, do you mind if i reveal some of your secrets to the world ?

 

[vadalaz]

I don't mind at all, go ahead. I'm curious to know what your observations are, maybe I can chime in if I have anything to add as well.

 

[Dines]

Well actually, since my last post, i searched the forums for old posts from you, and you have actually described your tactics very openly.

The first thing that surprised me when i opened the 1/3 of the game turn 40 savefile, was that you had 1000 gold. With no friendly AIs.
But taking a look at diplomacy deals, i figured it out. Frequent wardeclarations and trading lump sums of gold for lux in peace treatys.
Now i havent yet taken a look at Cromagnus or Acken´s tactics, but i wouldnt be surprised if im the only one not using this tactic yet....
I should probably have paid more attention to this forum earlier, instead of spending all those hours in marathon games.....

And of course i have tried to use it now. With limited succes.
I guess that in your 425 ad record, you also had the luck of many enemys actually having 240+gold to trade in peace treatys.
Unless there is a trick to make sure this happens ?

The other thing that surprised me was to see the overwhelming use of instant heal and hardly any promoted units.
It does make a lot of sense though, as promotions are more of a long term strategy.
But it will be a lot harder for me to get used to this strategy, as it is the opposite of what i have used in my marathon games...

 

[vadalaz]

Yeah, getting maximum value out of peace deals requires a bit of luck. AIs tend to spend their gold early and there's no way to stop them. That said, you can wait a bit if they don't have enough yet, who knows if they get a deal with someone else or tribute a CS or get wonder fail gold.

Instant heal is extremely powerful, especially since HOF allows promotion saving. Often I don't upgrade my units at all and just stack XP. If my ranged units hit 100 xp I'll upgrade up to Range or Logistics, otherwise just keep the XP stack in case I need an emergency heal.

 

[Dines]

One thing is if they have any money, but first you have to make them accept the peace treaty.
In the game im playing now, sweden had the money, but wouldnt buy my lux in a peace treaty.
What determines if a civ is willing to do make peace ?
I have been looking at AI traits, but there is no direct mentioning of peace offering.
Military strength comparison would be an obvious factor, but in your game, you made mongolia accept peace in turn 26, but i doubt you were militarily superior.
In turn 41, he is the military leader, and your are 6th.
Maybe city count is more important ?
Or is it like tribute from city states, you need units in their proximity ?

 

[vadalaz]

City count does matter. If you have any expos and you're much weaker than the AI in army score, they'll ask for a city in a peace deal. When you only have your capital they'll usually offer white peace, which is what you need to trade with them. They won't give you the full 240 if they don't like you (e.g. when they roll a high warmonger hate score), so you might have to settle for less. Sometimes peace isn't an option at all, usually with the likes of Attila and Shaka.

Something you can do is to cycle your luxuries/strategics/gpt through peace deals like this:

Turn 0: declare war on AI #1
Turn 6: sell lux to AI #1 (war lasts a minimum of 5 turns on all speeds, peace a minimum of 10 on Standard)
Turn 11: declare war on AI #2
Turn 17: declare war on AI #1 to break the deal and get your lux back, sell it to AI #2

You can get a lot of gold very quickly. On Deity it's probably better to have at least one or two friends early on though.