HOF III October Update

[Tone]

The Civilization III Hall of Fame has been updated. 19 games were accepted since the previous update.

Perhaps the most notable entry is Lord Emsworth's record smashing 150AD 100K game. An absolutely stunning display! It has been the topic of much discussion between the HOF staff members and it looks likely that we may need to amend our rules to avoid every game becoming awash with 'free' money.

Congratulations to Ozymandias for the highest Firaxis score of the update with a Tiny Monarch Conquest game for 18374 points.

Ozymandias was the most active player during this update, submitting 5 games.

Three players were brave enough to take on Sid this update. AutomatedTeller submitted a 1760 AD Large Sid Cultural 20k game for 8342 points. Chamnix submitted a 1760 AD Large Sid Cultural 20k game for 4973 points. Niklas submitted a 1828 AD Large Sid Cultural 20k game for 5417 points.

A number of players gained number one positions:

AutomatedTeller with a 1760 AD Large Sid Cultural 20k game for 8342 points.

AutomatedTeller with a 1495 AD Huge Deity Cultural 100k game for 13857 points.

AutomatedTeller with a 50 AD Standard Demigod Conquest game for 13268 points.

Tone with a 1390 AD Large Warlord Cultural 20k game for 2377 points.

AutomatedTeller with a 1275 AD Huge Chieftain Cultural 20k game for 1533 points.
Lord Emsworth with a 150 AD Large Chieftain Cultural 100k game for 2652 points.
​

Congratulations to Moonsinger for rising from 2nd to 1st, to AutomatedTeller for rising from 13th to 10th and to WillowBrook for rising from 31st to 30th in the Quartermasters competition.
Commiserations to Chamnix for falling from 1st to 2nd, to Marsden for falling from 10th to 11th, to a space oddity for falling from 11th to 12th, to Denniz for falling from 12th to 13th and to superslug for falling from 30th to 31st in the Quartermasters competition.

A number of players are working towards the Quartermaster, gaining awards as follows:
Machiavelli : Moonsinger rose from 4th to 3rd, AutomatedTeller rose from 15th to 6th, EMan rose from 16th to 15th, Scratcher rose from 17th to 16th, FadeAwayNot rose from 23rd to 22nd, Mad2rix rose from 30th to 29th, BlackBetsy rose from 32nd to 31st, SideshowBob rose from 34th to 32nd and Baalzebul rose from 39th to 37th.
Pentathlon : AutomatedTeller rose from 7th to 3rd, Svar rose from 12th to 11th, killercane rose from 13th to 12th, Lord Emsworth rose from 15th to 14th, Dianthus rose from 20th to 19th and zerksees rose from 21st to 20th.
Octathlon : AutomatedTeller rose from 6th to 3rd, EMan rose from 12th to 11th, osi rose from 13th to 12th, Scratcher rose from 28th to 27th and Baalzebul rose from 41st to 40th.

 

[Lord Emsworth]

It has been the topic of much discussion between the HOF staff members and it looks likely that we may need to amend our rules to avoid every game becoming awash with 'free' money.

Opps, I really didn't want to *break* the rules.

 

[AutomatedTeller]

Hey - you'll have a rule named after you!!!

 

[Tone]

Opps, I really didn't want to *break* the rules.

I don't think you broke the rules as they stand. More like found a hole in the rules that we'd like to fix.

 

[Marsden]

Yes, there's been quite a discusion going on since you kindly explained your method.

 

[Ozymandias]

Um, are there 2 members called "Ozymandias"? I've never entered a HOF competition.

Best,

Oz

 

[Lord Emsworth]

Yes, there's been quite a discusion going on since you kindly explained your method.

Only after that? Wasn't there something that struck you as odd about the 380BC win with the Russians that I submitted before that?

 

[Ozymandius]

Um, are there 2 members called "Ozymandias"? I've never entered a HOF competition.

Best,

Oz

I am Ozymandias "King of Kings" who once upon a time spelled his name wrong based on the wrong poem but I'm Ozymandias when I post my games.

Ozymandius
by: Percy Bysshe Shelley

I met a traveler from an antique land
Who said: "Two vast and trunkless legs of stone
Stand in the desert... Near them, on the sand,
Half sunk a shattered visage lies, whose frown,
And wrinkled lip, and sneer of cold command,
Tell that its sculptor well those passions read
Which yet survive, stamped on these lifeless things,
The hand that mocked them and the heart that fed;
And on the pedestal these words appear:
My name is Ozymandius, King of Kings,
Look on my works, ye Mighty, and despair!
Nothing beside remains. Round the decay
Of that colossal wreck, boundless and bare
The lone and level sands stretch far away.

http://www.internal.org/view_poem.phtml?poemID=292

 

[Ozymandias]

Not that this is a competition in any way, but every rendition I've seen (just Google the "-ias" version) has it spelled that way (e.g., http://www.online-literature.com/shelley_percy/672/)

Best,

The-Other-Oz

 

[Ozymandius]

Not that this is a competition in any way, but every rendition I've seen (just Google the "-ias" version) has it spelled that way (e.g., http://www.online-literature.com/shelley_percy/672/)

Best,

The-Other-Oz

I just quoted the only guy that got an "F" in spelling.

Ozy Too, but not The-Other-Oz except in HOF

 

[Tone]

Just for information there are a number of CFC members with similar names:

Ozymandias
Ozymandius
Ozymandous
Ozymandyus
Ozymand1as
Ozymand100

I'll leave it up to you guys to sort out who is the true king of kings. All I'm interested in is whether we've credited the correct person with the HOF entries listed, which we have.

 

[Ozymandius]

Ozymandias
Ozymandius
Ozymandous
Ozymandyus
Ozymand1as
Ozymand100

I am the one who has the entries as Ozymandias in HOF. Perhaps you can change the HOF spelling to Ozymandius to reflect my posts here.

 

[Marsden]

I am the one who has the entries as Ozymandias in HOF. Perhaps you can change the HOF spelling to Ozymandius to reflect my posts here.

Certainly, our Administrator will fix that for you ASAP.

While we require that you use your CFC forum name, this is a different system, so you will need to register for a password if you have not submitted to the Hall of Fame before.

Should you have any trouble or questions with this procedure please post here or PM superslug.

So that would be the proper thing to do.

 

[EMan]

Speaking of "fixing" things, what are "we" gonna do about Lord Emsworth's ingenious "AI Free Cash Gift" "exploit"?

I'm in the middle of an HOF game and would like guidance.

.......And, I'm sure Lord Emsworth would like to know if his high-ranking games will be allowed to stand!

Congrats to everyone who submitted games this period.

 

[Marsden]

No more free cash games will be accepted as it violates the spirit of the HoF rules, speaking of which will be updated to reflect this new "technique" So please do not repeat it. It will not be accepted.

 

[AutomatedTeller]

Can we define what this means? I can think of several different levels:

1) Will it be ok to, say, trade all my gpt for a lux, then trade a tech back for most of my gpt, then cut the trade route?
2) Do this with more than 1 civ at a time.
3) Do this multiple times with 1 resource with more than 1 civ.

One thing to worry about is that you could, conceivably, make a deal with gpt and resources for a free tech in an era change, then get back your gpt with your free tech. If something happened to break the trade route, that would have to be ok.

While I agree with the ruling... this is a great technique very inventive!!!

 

[EMan]

No more free cash games will be accepted as it violates the spirit of the HoF rules, speaking of which will be updated to reflect this new "technique" So please do not repeat it. It will not be accepted.

Does this mean that Lord Emsworth's games are accepted but future games will not be?

If this is the case, some points to consider:

1. It is unlikely that anyone can beat his Fast Finish without utilizing this "exploit", meaning that the Playing Field is not level and Lord Emsworth has an unfair advantage.

2. Because of setting this precedent, it encourages other players to submit games with a newly-found "exploit" and then announce it, causing a "Red Exploit" Rule to go into effect, possibly securing his #1 position for eternity.

3. The HOF Rules state:
"Use of Borderline exploits may result in your game being excluded. This section covers tactics and methods that can be both very legal and very illegal. Please read this section carefully before employing any of these techniques...The following list of exploits and cheats may be incomplete...".

This tells me that your game may be excluded if it is determined that a particular strategy, listed now or in the future, is ruled a "Red Exploit".

4. It is impractical to forsee all future exploits, thus you can only ban them retroactively to keep the same rules for everyone. (You cannot be expected to catch a player's new "exploit" when he submits a game, if nobody knows about it, except the player!)

5. The HOF must maintain its integrity.

Conclusion:
Seems to me you either:
1. Allow the strategy and thus Lord Emsworth's games would stand.
2. Disallow the strategy and remove all games that utilize it.

One of the great attributes of the HOF is that the Playing Field is level......Same Rules for everyone.

 

[Marsden]

Repeated from HoF FAQ Thread

This will be added to the offical HoF rules page as soon as possible, but until then:

Players should not create situations that deliberately put “free” money into the world economy, or any deal where the AI is making payments it can no longer afford, for example by setting up deals that are then cancelled by breaking a trade route i.e. the Emsworth Agreement, explained here .


Any situations that a player has doubts about should be referred to the HOF Staff by email or pm

No games using this method are acceptable, and any previously accepted using this will be excluded. We are sorry if this causes any disappointment or bad feeling, but it is an obvious loophole in the program.

There was some discussion in the general quick answers thread recently as to what is an exploit and what isn't. While I'm not going to give any definite definition here I will just say just because the AI doesn't do it doesn't make it an exploit. What makes something an exploit is when someone uses a technique that isn't in the scope of the "reality" of the game. Having money continue to come from a contract after conditions are changed that make it impossible to continue is exploiting the fact that the programers missed cancelling some of the deals that are impossible.