Discussion in 'Civ3 - Hall of Fame Discussion' started by templar_x, Feb 3, 2010.
thread for writeups of my HOF attempts
recently i had a look on the HOF charts and found that some dates, especially on higher levels, are kind of waiting for improvement. as i have never played a HOF game before, i decided i should start with a setting i did quite ok with in the last XOTMs... Deity Conquest on a standard size map. i guessed that pangaea was quite the only way to go for a fast finish.
well, my first game happened to be quite ok. no uber start, just what i got within a few normal rolls. no early leaders, but quite a few in the late game (and i lost all but one army in the finish ) no good tech deals, so i stayed a barbarian conquering the world, a few unnecessary filps, staying in despo all game. so lots of room for a much better date, i´d say. but already this one - given i got all the rules straight and did not mess up a major parameter - will shift the date-to-beat by a couple of 100 years. :wink:
i have an eye on the one or other HOF chart, but have to be picky as i need fast finishes due to lack of time. first i´ll wait to learn whether i got my first submission straight. but stay alert and watch out, your #1s may be in true danger after that.
Who did you play as? Who did you have as opponents? I'd guess 80%, but heat level, temeprature, and age? What offensive units did you use and what did you face? When did you finish? A river at the start? A cow?
In a game like this when you stand ready to eliminate tribe A you can sign a military alliance with tribe B against tribe A with tribe B's techs and your gpt. As long as you eliminate tribe A then, you won't suffer a reputation hit and get all those techs for free.
If you didn't know, once the staff has had time to check your game you can tell if they accepted it or not by checking "my submissions". You don't have to wait until the update at the middle of the month. Good to see around here templar_x!
Played as Celts, sure with a cow and river in the start. I got such a situation after just 3 or 4 rolls and went with it.
80% yes, otherwise everything standard but 5 mio years. got lots of jungle which slowed me down. and you always have to look out for that island settled.
In a game like this, i could not care less about my reputation (honorable playing only in my XOTMs -most of them ).
as the Celts, IW is the only tech i really need, and at some time i´d extort MM to hunt down the island towns.
actually two civs made it into the MA, so there were a few pikes defending cities in the end. losses were very high, but my GS forces already were too overwhelming at this stage and so conquest only was maybe delayed by 1-2 turns.
thx for the hint, but the save is yet unchecked.
ps: btw, i finished 210bc. that is, if i remember correctly.
Yea, that's pretty good. My domination game finished about then. Engineering might help. With the Celts it surprises me you didn't play on a dry map.
normal or dry, i honestly don´t think it matters much. still could hamper the AI even a bit more.
funny thing is, after playing quite a bit on Sid level lately, Deity appears like a walk in the park in comparison so i did not pay too much attention to such details. i am much of a "everything random" player anyway to keep the suspense up.
yes, i know your domination date was around that time. a short story i would not have told if you had not mentioned it:
i just fooled around with a first "try" (just started a game to see how the Celts played, i haven´t used them in ages). Reached domination about 10 turns earlier than your game. so far so good - i had a look on the HOF charts just to see whether that would make the top 10... you can imagine my suprise? but only one minute later, now imagine the not so pleasant surprise when i found that i accidentally had chosen only 3 opponents while i think 4 are required on a standard map
Yep, it's 4 opponents on a standard map. It's 2-3-4-6-8.
my game got accepted, so i can refer to myself as someone who can count to four from now on...
Do you think you'll play for all different types of victory conditions, or will you just play for conquest and domination?
i have no idea yet. it took me one year until i found the time for a single hof submission. from there, i´d say, i´ll surely try another one. but there are no plans for a systematic playing of all different victory conditions, or difficulty levels. i am generally more interested in high levels, though.
due to my general lack of time, i will hardly ever try for a spaceship game. and a good 20k result for the hof appears to be mostly based on getting the right map as well as sgls and mgls at the right time, as your hof thread suggests. this requires time to find those (less so to actually play, i think), so is pretty much out, too.
no need to mention that i never milked a game to the end since c3c is out, right?
leaves domination and conquest for now, and maybe one day i´ll try my hands on a 100k. but i am open to recommendations.
20k games really don't take all too long to play in my opinion. The game I discussed talks about going for an excellent 20k finish more-or-less. I think that if you have a good start... say at least 24 or 25 shields in Republic... on Demi-God or Deity it's not too difficult to get a good finish around 1600 AD without too much, if any, SGL or MGL fortune. Or maybe I've just played so many now and have a decent idea of what to do (though I haven't settled on a build order pattern really), that I feel that way. I basically go with a max on Writing going for the Republic slingshot as a Seafaring tribe, against weak research opponents, capital going curragh-settler-worker, adjust as needed, second city produces warriors as MPs and workers to develop the capital ASAP, add in workers, and micromanage the capital until it hits size 12, with a tendency to use food squares pre-size 7 and then production squares post size 7, adding in workers to get it to size 12. Anyways, if you set MapFinder for a river/cow start on an 80% archipelago, warm, wet, 3 billion map for a few hours it usually will spit out a few of these on a standard map. I've found good small map starts also, but I've considered lake starts also. On top of this, if you have a good stack of hills and maybe some bonus grassland you can get away with wheat only starts instead.
I think 1600 is a little early for a 20K game with no leaders, but you probably don't need much leader luck to get a top spot. I'm only submitting for fun (rather than trying for a top spot) - I don't use MapFinder (it doesn't run on my desktop) and I don't play a bunch of starts out to find one with an early SGL. Plus I'm not much of a war-monger, and the Heroic Epic usually comes after tanks for me. Still I have no trouble getting middle-of-the-table spots.
Go CKS submitting for fun! I don't know how many 20k Deity games I've abandonded, because I already have two spots on the table and can't submit anymore unless I have SGL lucky. You never know what might happen. I decided to try some demi-god games for fun, tried a two-wheat lake start with the Dutch, and ended up getting 2 ancient and 1 early medieval SGL, and a decently time MGL. Tabling some 20k notes to my page.
i just submitted a Deity domination game which should get a good # on the table, if it gets accepted. the settings were very similar to my recent conquest submittal, and i was not sure until quite late if this one was going conquest as well.
again no detailled writeup, but at least i have taken some notes. in case the game gets accepted, i will post here what i have, plus the saves if someone cares and pictures. my friend Buce had also asked for further information about my conquest game, and i promise i´ll scratch together and post what i have about this one then, too.
EDIT: it got accepted, so expect some more info to follow. it´s a 250bc standard deity domination game.
ok, let´s start with the the domination game.
i played the same settings as in the conquest game. Celts, pangaea, Korea Spain Vikes and English as opponents. i reached domination in 250bc.
i did not search for an exceptionally good start or used a start finder software. i just went with what a few rolls gave me. that seemed to be quite ok, with three cows in the 9 starting tiles. otherwise, nothing special, and i had no luxes forever.
i stayed with "normal" settings instead of arid. i think on Deity still arid does not pay off for a bc victory. it would be more likely that there will be size 1 towns that autoraze, at least i see that chance. for a Sid game i´d choose arid, though.
again i played with a dense core placement for fast development. i built only 4 rax total, so i built quite a few regulars. however, i am not convinced that that´s really smart.
i started the GA as soon as i had some gold and a few warriors around.
what was a good move, i think, was that for the last turns in stretched lands i switched to another government (misclicked and should have chosen Monarchy over Republic though). this was very helpful to rush things where pop was thin near the front. of course, this requires some possibilities for deals which i had in this game.
i got a total of 3 leaders, 1 on defense that was immediately lost, 1 on the last turn. i had roughly 25-30 e victories. i did not feel exceptionally lucky with my armies, and i even lost the one i had but when it did not matter too much any more.
more importantly, i captured ToA at the right time, and i believe i could not have finished that early otherwise. for another game, i think i might build the ToA myself (although this might rather be a Sid game).
core and minimap after victory
start of GA in 1225bc
for the conquest game, i cannot deliver any details from my memory any more. so i provide some saves, for anyone who might be interested.
I'm unable to d/l these, mate - something about invalid attachment.
sorry Buce, i must have been too tired already that night. the domination save seems fine from my office computer, i´ll fix the conquest saves later when i get home.
the download should work now.
no saves or pics yet until the game gets accepted. just a bit information on that game before i again forget everything (no, unlike XOTMs i don´t take many notes in HOF games).
SID on a standard pangaea with 80% water, arid-temperate-5 billion years, no barbs, normal aggressiveness
opponents are Byz, Korea, England and Portugal. i chose those for their weakness as well as for their overlapping starting techs. the tech pace was insane when i had not taken the starting techs into account.
this time i did not succeed to win with my first played start ;-).
once i was raped a couple of turns before i could upgrade my army, twice i could not get my hands on iron and abandoned the game. so this is about my 4th try.
start and REX:
with my 4th try i got a rather poor start, just 2 bonuses in the fat cross plus an additional one outside. i even had to move before settling. but there was some room to expand, with the Celts the possibilities to plant down a couple of towns is much more important than the lands you´ve got. and here i got a nice corner start and even get a whole first ring up plus 3 or 4 more towns in a 2nd ring. and iron was right next to my capital.
shortly after 1000bc i make the mass upgrade with all the money i have and start the attack. a couple of turns later, i get an MGL with my first e victory! lucky me. but it did not stay like that, after this one there is a long leader drought, getting a total of 5 MGLs with my 1st, 28th, 44th, 49th and 58th e victory. all built armies of course. early armies are key to a fast conquest in my eyes.
a bc victory is definitely possible, and may even have been possible in this game, but i lost my concentration a bit after eliminating 2 civs. i don´t think that techs or governments really play a big role in this game.
my game got accepted, so here are some pics:
actually it is 3950bc, my starting position was 1se of Entremont. one of the weaker HoF starts.
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