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Holkan Smokem time - Emperor epic game.

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Strategy & Tips' started by Gumbolt, Feb 23, 2009.

  1. Gumbolt

    Gumbolt Phoenix Rising

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    Our great leader!!



    The UB for happiness and bliss



    The fantastic Holkan!!



    A start that should give many options.



    I know this is financial but hopefully it will be a challenge to some of you. I think the start may even offer the chance to grab a religion. So maybe a Ap or Un win/ space victory. Now please play this carefully and dont rush it. :mischief:

    The main settings are.

    Emperor
    Epic speed
    Standard map size - (too many laptops dying from large maps so downsized for this exercise)
    Pangea
     

    Attached Files:

  2. pi-r8

    pi-r8 Luddite

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    So, are you planning on rushing someone with Holkans, or will you just see how things develop?
     
  3. Ai Shizuka

    Ai Shizuka King

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    Played a few turns:

    Spoiler :

    Not sure if I want to play this one. Squeezed between JC and Sury, plus Shaka somewhere, without copper or horses. Maybe early IW is the way to go here; shouldn't be too slow with financial gold. I don't think holkans are enough to cut it vs all the jerks on this map.

     
  4. Gumbolt

    Gumbolt Phoenix Rising

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    No plan!! Not even started playing it yet. You will just have to play the map a bit and see how it goes.
     
  5. Gumbolt

    Gumbolt Phoenix Rising

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    Spoiler :
    You dont need copper for Holkans. The Holkans are also great archer fog busters. I am sure there must be some iron/copper/horse on map somewhere.

    I do think you need to scout a bit on this map. Plus you are playing a financial leader on a river. Once you have Alphabet most Ai will trade IW.

    Why give the player too many advantages?

     
  6. michmbk

    michmbk Emperor

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    Is this in response to the "Holk Smash" thread? I'm not sure if I can play another game for a few days. My whole body is in pain from craning my neck over the computer about 20 hours this weekend playing the two genghis games and the zara game, as well as offline OCC I tried (and failed at).

    I need an ergonomically designed setup for marathon civ sessions.
     
  7. Gumbolt

    Gumbolt Phoenix Rising

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    Yep. You got me.

    Yeah i know what you mean about playing civ too much. I am sooo tired today.
     
  8. michmbk

    michmbk Emperor

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    The killer was the wife was out of town. So after the kids were in bed, I had nothing to do, and had to stay at home. So...civ from 7:30 until about 1 AM 3 straight nights. at least the short hour or two sessions I usually get keep me from getting sore.

    Still, I've never tried a holk rush - don't think I've even played with Pacal, so maybe I'll at least try the first 50-75 turns and see how it progresses. If an early rush is feasible (haven't seen the spoilers yet), might be fun to try to see how a holk smash works.
     
  9. Gumbolt

    Gumbolt Phoenix Rising

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    Thats my boy. I will try this map tomorrow.
     
  10. Glare Seethe

    Glare Seethe Prince

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    I gave it a go but I played really badly so I'm not sure I'll continue.

    Spoiler :

    First off, I knew I should've moved 1W but stupidly opted to trust the map generator and missed out on the cows. Barely any food in the capital and few forests to chop. I also messed up the first worker turns, forgetting I could farm the FP and went to mine the gold waiting for AH to come in. Cost me in growth.

    Eventually I rushed Sury with holkans but they're kind of unimpressive as rush units. Their odds are not so good versus archers, even when promoted to CR. Still, he's dead and I've got his two cities, but I'm squeezed in pretty badly, Julius's right next door and has iron and I'm absolutely swarmed with pillaging barbs from the southern tundra (all my holkans are up north having just taken Sury's second and last city).

    I did manage to settle another city between Mutal and Yasodharapura and I've got another settler in Mutal waiting for the barbs to suicide against my archers so he can go out and settle... somewhere. Not sure where, my scouting warrior died really quickly. I guess in the tundra somewhere. That would make five cities which is okay.

    I haven't played Pangea in a long time, though, I forgot how quickly you get boxed in.
     
  11. Monsterzuma

    Monsterzuma the sly one

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    Nice. I'll play it. I'm definitely not Holkan rushing though. :lol: I'm way too much addicted to rerolls as it is.
     
  12. TheMeInTeam

    TheMeInTeam Top Logic

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    I'm in. The smoke grenades in gears 2 are unbearable. Shooters as a genre is largely dead. The new genre is "grenadier". Until that issue is fixed, I return here EVEN MORE to play more civ, because at least civ has some quality to it.
     
  13. michmbk

    michmbk Emperor

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    Gears of War 2? I still haven't even gotten around to buying that yet, as civ keeps me from playing too much fallout 3 - have to finish the DLC from that before any more purchases.

    As active as this forum is right now, it's tough to play anything else.
     
  14. Lansky

    Lansky King

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    Glad you put that smiley face there. I'll be honest if I can't rush then my chances to win plummet.
     
  15. Ai Shizuka

    Ai Shizuka King

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    Played to 10 AD circa:

    Spoiler :

    We have horses after all. Warrior died early and I didn't see them. JC got praetorians in the 2000s, so rushing him is probably the best move.

     
  16. michmbk

    michmbk Emperor

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    HOLK SMASH! Well, sort of. I played about 100 or so turns, but that's all I can do after marathon civving this weekend. Not sure if I'll pick it up again, even though I was able to moderately successful rush.

    Spoiler :

    Okay, first off, JC's production was a joke. Seriously.

    I wanted to rush since I’ve never played pacal and I wanted to see if Holkans were really worth anything for an early rush. They're not. It worked ok, but give me keshiks, war chariots, praets, quechuas, vultures all ahead of them as better early rush units. Yes, you can get them out faster, but you need a barracks. You don't with regular axes. I like to rush with either axes or chariots by about turn 100 or so. I still didn't get the holkan rush accomplished until about the same time - turn 97 after I built a barracks. This start probably wasn't great for rushing either. Mutal is a crappy city really.

    I wasn’t settling on a FP with financial, and I wasn’t wasting a turn and wasn’t giving up the gold either. So settled 1SW. Missed the cow – that sucks, but picked up some more FP – good cottage material. BW to get holkans out as fast as possible. Met JC, Shaka and Sury lightning quick. Sury's scout was going to beat me to a hut, so I figured i'm screwing around...killed his scout and got the hut - 80 or so gold. I'm still being a mean and nasty civ after the genghis weekend.

    JC is super close – praets come later, so he was the target. On a hill – ridiculous. But he had to die on principle. What I want to know is how did he get 3 cities up, have another settler roaming with an archer, have 3 archers in Rome, 4 in Antium and 2 in Cumae. Plus 2 workers, one of which I stole. Oh, and he must have built a monument in Antium, since his borders are popped twice?!!?! And a granary was in Rome. All in 113 turns. I know he's IMP, but seriously.

    Anyway - rush:



    10 CR1 holkans vs 3 archers (one whipped). Lost 6 of them. Sent the other 4 along with two replacements down to Cumae, and lost 5 taking it from two archers. So I'm left with 3 cities and no military. 2 capitols, sure, and JC is probably now hopeless, but it's no better than if I had built my own settlers with chops, claimed land, and then built some barb buster units. There were 2-3 pretty good sites to claim with financial.

    My tech rate was insanely good though - flying through with the gold mine and cottaged FP. I've played 6 full games on emperor, and it's clear tech is not an issue on this level if I have FIN or ORG, but it's tough otherwise. So I guess from here I would just tech IW to see if I have iron, and if so, get some swords out to finish off JC before he gets praets. Then lay down cottages in Mutal, build more units to take the barb city north, and try to lay down 2-3 more cities over west of Rome or south of Mutal. Probably would be tough to do all that on pangaea with AI whipping out settlers. Right after the rush:



    I wouldn't call it a holk smash, more like a holk light punch on the shoulders.

    Maybe I'll go another round tomorrow.

     
  17. Babibo

    Babibo Immortal

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    Ha ha, I'm with you, my friend ! Father and civ addict ! You should consider the game of go as well. Pretty time consuming, and can be played at home while the kids have a little rest.
     
  18. assass1n

    assass1n Warlord

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    Finally you brought that map size down great I am going to play this one after I recover from that GK crash
     
  19. Tempesta13

    Tempesta13 Prince

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    I might give this a try - still need to finish the second Genghis game first though. Can someone that has met the AI's/seen most of the map already and doesn't mind going into worldbuilder post a normal speed 4000BC save? I'd appreciate it! :hatsoff:
     
  20. Gooblah

    Gooblah Heh...

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    Ai SHizuka:
    Spoiler :


    Spoiler :
    Antium was the Hindu Holy City.
     

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