holy hell that Ukraine stuff

[Estebonrober]

To conservatives, it is. Your post was, as usual, focused on conservatives. And pretentiously describing them and/or their thinking inaccurately (also as usual). There's nothing more important to be had from this than bringing a dark process to light. 'Democracy dies in darkness,' lul
...It would be nice if we could inch towards an actual policy objective with this impeachment by sticking it to the swamp. And it is feasible and legal for the trial to go in that direction and transform into an examination of the process, because this is Congress, not a court. You guys were pretty emphatic about that point when Schiff was burrowed underground holding his meetings. Sixth Amendment didn't apply.

Let me rephrase that for you. It’s not part of this impeachment trial at all. Like it’s a separate topic. It’s one I’d be happy to have explored. It’s one that the GOP doesn’t want explored, they are just pantomiming Trump for now. So bringing it into this trial to muddy everything is a great talking point that will never happen. Seriously looking into the actual problem will never even be considered by the GOP.

 

[IglooDame]

Ummm... The impeachment proceedings weren't a trial. They were (effectively) a grand jury, unsurprisingly producing an indictment (or an impeachment, if you will). The Senate has the trial, with 100 jurors and Chief Justice Roberts presiding, with the House of Representatives producing the prosecution and the White House producing the defense. It saddens me how few people grok this, and it's why Senate Majority Leader McConnell's "we're going to work with the White House on this" felt so unethical; can you imagine a jury's foreman planning deliberations with the defense attorney prior to a trial?

 

[Tristan_C]

Let me rephrase that for you. It’s not part of this impeachment trial at all. Like it’s a separate topic. It’s one I’d be happy to have explored. It’s one that the GOP doesn’t want explored, they are just pantomiming Trump for now. So bringing it into this trial to muddy everything is a great talking point that will never happen. Seriously looking into the actual problem will never even be considered by the GOP.

Again, this is Congress, not a court. Examining the players and process is part of the trial, and it is relevant, and it is not a separate topic... if the senate says so. The House could declare that Trump broke the law by a show of hands regardless of any logical considerations, and likewise, the Senate has its own plenary powers.

Trump— and the people with the MAGA hats— definitely want the House Committees and the alphabet soup, which is to say the actual problem, given an anal probe over this and punished severely in November. I am sure you are right that the GOP establishment in DC has no interest in the actual problem. But I think it would be more accurate to say that since there are a lot of never-Trumpers in the GOP establishment, their evident disinterest is because the actual problem offers no vector against Trump.

The Senate has the trial, with 100 jurors and Chief Justice Roberts presiding, with the House of Representatives producing the prosecution and the White House producing the defense.

The House and Senate being composed of elected reps, it's a political process from beginning to end. It got this far because it has full support from the left. It will fail because it has no support from the right.

 

[Estebonrober]

Again, this is Congress, not a court. Examining the players and process is part of the trial, and it is relevant, and it is not a separate topic... if the senate says so. The House could declare that Trump broke the law by a show of hands regardless of any logical considerations, and likewise, the Senate has its own plenary powers.

Trump— and the people with the MAGA hats— definitely want the House Committees and the alphabet soup, which is to say the actual problem, given an anal probe over this and punished severely in November. I am sure you are right that the GOP establishment in DC has no interest in the actual problem. But I think it would be more accurate to say that since there are a lot of never-Trumpers in the GOP establishment, their evident disinterest is because the actual problem offers no vector against Trump.

The House and Senate being composed of elected reps, it's a political process from beginning to end. It got this far because it has full support from the left. It will fail because it has no support from the right.

except for the pure right like Justin Amash who actually retains his moral convictions.

 

[hobbsyoyo]

Lev Parnas has requested that Bill Barr be removed from the investigation into him due to conflict of interest. Lev says it is clear that Barr has a political agenda tied into the investigation as evidenced by Barr's attempts to hold up House subpoenas. The House subpoena Parnas to have him testify, but it appears that Barr sat on documents during the discovery process which kept Parnas from having any evidence to testify with.

McConnell announced the rules they're going to vote on. They are cramming 24 hours of arguments into 2 days that start at 1pm each day. This compresses the schedule, making it harder to call witnesses and examine evidence and also shifts everything into the off-prime time hours to lower visibility. He says he has the votes to pass his rules.

 

[Broken_Erika]

I'm waiting for this to happen

Bible on which U.S. senators swear impartiality for Trump’s impeachment trial bursts into flames
WASHINGTON, D.C. – The floor of the U.S. Senate had to be briefly evacuated today when the Christian Bible that was being used to swear in the hundred senators who will be jurors in the impeachment trial of President Donald Trump exploded into a mass of flaming debris.

“You could feel that it was starting to get a little hot when the Democrats swore that they’d be able to treat the allegations against President Trump with impartiality, but when the Republicans began swearing they’d consider only the Constitution and the law, the amount of smoke coming from the Bible made it very difficult to breathe,” said Bryce Langdon, now eyebrowless senate page.

“Then Mitch McConnell reached his hand towards it and whomph, it went up like kindling.”

While the spontaneous combustion of Bibles and other holy books is a fairly common occurrence in all branches of the U.S. government, this one was specially made of a space-age, non-combustible material in an effort to ensure it would survive today’s impeachment swearing in.

“The government has been using Bibles lined with asbestos since Andrew Jackson was sworn in to office. But I’ve never seen a flame-******ant Bible go up like that. I estimate that Bible reached almost 2000 degrees centigrade, a temperature that would melt titanium,” said Dr. Henry Lee, a material scientist at Georgetown University. “This Bible should’ve been able to survive re-entry into Earth’s atmosphere with nothing more than a slight singe, but it just wasn’t robust enough to survive U.S. politics.”

Chief Supreme Court Justice John Roberts, who’d been administering the swearing in, escaped the conflagration with minor burns and an overwhelming sense of emptiness at the core of his being.

https://www.thebeaverton.com/2020/0...-trumps-impeachment-trial-bursts-into-flames/

 

[Sommerswerd]

Now that's funny

 

[Yeekim]

Now that's funny

I actually did laugh out loud.

 

[Berzerker]

at 25:53 she lets slip the whistleblowers 1st name

Here's the rub, Sean Misco and Eric Ciaramella were CIA/NSC people assigned to Trump's WH. They were moved back to their respective agencies for allegedly leaking. One of their replacements was Sean's good friend Lt Col Vindman, the guy who was in on the July 25th call and who told some people, like the whistleblower, about the call to Zelensky. The day after the July 25 call Adam Schiff hired the whistleblower's good buddy Sean Misco. Schiff claims he doesn't know the whistleblower but he hired his buddy Misco soon after the call.

 

[Old Hippy]

Here's the rub, Sean Misco and Eric Ciaramella were CIA/NSC people assigned to Trump's WH. They were moved back to their respective agencies for allegedly leaking. One of their replacements was Sean's good friend Lt Col Vindman, the guy who was in on the July 25th call and who told some people, like the whistleblower, about the call to Zelensky. The day after the July 25 call Adam Schiff hired the whistleblower's good buddy Sean Misco. Schiff claims he doesn't know the whistleblower but he hired his buddy Misco soon after the call.

Don't forget the other 'buddy' Lt Col Vindman's twin brother ...he's the leaker responsible for clearing Boltens book of any classified material and don't forget that way back under Sessions there were 27 investigations underway to find were the leaks from the WH administratuion were coming from

 

[Berzerker]

what I'd like to know is why we cant hear the whistleblower's name while Lt Col Vindman - the actual whistleblower - openly testified

that doesn't make any sense

 

[Old Hippy]

what I'd like to know is why we cant hear the whistleblower's name while Lt Col Vindman - the actual whistleblower - openly testified

that doesn't make any sense

Most likely because of ALL the links between ''the whistleblower's name '' and Biden, Schiff, Obama's WH, the old Ukraninian government, the Obama State Department and Burisma

 

[Berzerker]

Thats true, we put a lot of effort into pulling Ukraine away from Russia and Trump was a threat to that policy. These guys were heavily invested in a policy Trump ran against, I just dont understand why Vindman needed to tell someone else when he was the whistleblower. Wasn't he a more credible whistleblower than the other guy? He was actually on the call and he didn't have the partisan baggage of the whistleblower.

 

[Old Hippy]

I just dont understand why Vindman needed to tell someone else when he was the whistleblower. Wasn't he a more credible whistleblower than the other guy? He was actually on the call and he didn't have the partisan baggage of the whistleblower.

Just a guess but with the '' other guy '' there was a slime chance that he (Vindman) would still be in a inner WH position like his twin brother

 

[rah]

what I'd like to know is why we cant hear the whistleblower's name while Lt Col Vindman - the actual whistleblower - openly testified

that doesn't make any sense

It could be simply that one wanted whistleblower protection. as is their right, and the other didn't.

 

[Estebonrober]

Thats true, we put a lot of effort into pulling Ukraine away from Russia and Trump was a threat to that policy. These guys were heavily invested in a policy Trump ran against, I just dont understand why Vindman needed to tell someone else when he was the whistleblower. Wasn't he a more credible whistleblower than the other guy? He was actually on the call and he didn't have the partisan baggage of the whistleblower.

lets ignore the fact of why Trump was a threat to this policy. What was being a threat to this policy doing for Trump who only understands the transactional world. It’s so cute because while you are so quick to assign malignant intent to anyone at all who tries to stymy The efforts of this kleptocratic mad man. You never see a man who has spent his entire life bribing, gaming the system, avoiding his responsibilities, and working with criminals worldwide of malignancy. He’s your wonder boy. A magical mythical figure of pure and divine intent. It’s hilarious if it wasn’t so damn prevalent in American society writ large.