General News Regarding China & Hong Kong

[H4run]

Western obsession of creating fake news, conquering countries on the basis of those news and then saying “oops, the intel was wrong but we had a good time, didn’t we?” is also an open secret. You spend millions on broadcasting your bullfeathers over the world using Asian influencers? We will broadcast whatever strengthens our interest in return using white influencers. Don’t pretend to be an innocent sheep. The “obsession” is mutual, grounded in strengthening respective economies.

Am I not known around here, to be against and vocally resent Western occupation, intervention, and propaganda? Whoever read me, know me, and they know where I'm standing on this, you educate the wrong poster, my stance in the face of oppression is clear, I'm not someone who okay with Xin's oppression but not ok with Paul's oppression.

And I never, ever! will excuse the oppression, rape, torture, and suffering of the Uyghur, because America or any other random nation did a lesser or equal crime!

You guys should stop being double standard on this, aren't you guys are too smart for not seeing this simple fact?

You cannot make Jesus out of Western injustice, which makes it retribute and wash away all of the filth that the CCP does to its own peoples.

I gave up on Fero on this, but I believe you will listen.

 

[Moriarte]

And I never, ever! will excuse the oppression, rape, torture, and suffering of the Uyghur, because America or any other random nation did a lesser or equal crime!

Heeey, freedom fighter, how many times have YOU been to Xinjiang? 0. Therefore, neither you, nor I, know with 100% certainty what the hell is going on out there. You just watched a couple documentaries made by propaganda machine of one side (yes, there are many propaganda machines) and run around with it’s findings, like it’s Gospel of John. Maybe, when the vices of CCP hate will release you, we can talk about economics of the process and political interests of various groups intertwined in the region. A while ago Ferocitus posted a news piece here about Xinjiang cotton industries. Rather interesting! And it is an important basis of understanding of how we arrived to present day. Joining the choir of unpaid CCP condemners doesn’t interest me, but thanks for invitation.

 

[Gorbles]

Oh cool, literal revisionism of genocide in real time.

Eagerly awaiting how well Moriarte's going to take any future disagreement whereby I can just claim that because we're not omniscient all-seers, we don't actually know what happened so we shouldn't criticise anything, ever.

 

[aelf]

Many white people don't give a rats ass when yellow or brown people kill each other. As long as they're not involved, it's all good. Like Eddie Izzard once said, "Ah, help yourselves... We've been trying to kill you for ages."

They love their Treaty of Assphalia.

 

[Zardnaar]

Many white people don't give a rats ass when yellow or brown people kill each other. As long as they're not involved, it's all good. Like Eddie Izzard once said, "Ah, help yourselves... We've been trying to kill you for ages."

They love their Treaty of Assphalia.

Lose lose. Do something get criticised no nothing get criticised.

Invading China isn't an option.

 

[aelf]

Every f-ing decision in politics is lose-lose. Grow up.

The least you can do is not pooh pooh allegations of genocide or claim that countries' sovereignty means they can do whatever they want inside their borders.

 

[Moriarte]

Oh cool, literal revisionism of genocide in real time.

Eagerly awaiting how well Moriarte's going to take any future disagreement whereby I can just claim that because we're not omniscient all-seers, we don't actually know what happened so we shouldn't criticise anything, ever.

Cute. But no one is stopping you from criticising. It helps to admit to yourself though, once in while, that your information may be incomplete. Otherwise you’re a fanatic and will be treated as such.

 

[Ferocitus]

Again, the reason no cases have been won is that the evidence doesn't stack up.
After being caught lying and manufacturing evidence, nobody trusts either side.
So, wave your pitchforks and call for blood, but it hasn't worked yet.

If guards commit crimes and atrocities they should face court and punishment if guilty. For employees
of the State, those punishments are often greater than for citizens, just as, say, larceny as an employee
attracts heavier penalties than for simple theft.

If accusers and witnesses are caught lying, what punishment do you think they should get?
If their lies would have convicted someone for life, should they get the same punishment as guards who
actually commit crimes and deserve a very harsh punishment?

 

[Ferocitus]

Cute. But no one is stopping you from criticising. It helps to admit to yourself though, once in while, that your information may be incomplete. Otherwise you’re a fanatic and will be treated as such.

Not just a fanatic, but a torch and pitchfork wielding mob.

 

[Ferocitus]

Lose lose. Do something get criticised no nothing get criticised.

Invading China isn't an option.

Of course.
That's why the US and its stooges have been waging proxy wars in that region for decades.
How has that worked out?

 

[Gorbles]

Cute. But no one is stopping you from criticising. It helps to admit to yourself though, once in while, that your information may be incomplete. Otherwise you’re a fanatic and will be treated as such.

There's a difference between "your data is incomplete" and "your data is a fabrication". Even with incomplete data, the available data points to atrocities committed against the Uyghur. If you want to make a different claim, evidence it. Otherwise you're a fanatic and will be treated as such.

Cute, as you say

 

[Zardnaar]

There's a difference between "your data is incomplete" and "your data is a fabrication". Even with incomplete data, the available data points to atrocities committed against the Uyghur. If you want to make a different claim, evidence it. Otherwise you're a fanatic and will be treated as such.

Cute, as you say

Well that and China has blocked travel to the region. It's like they have something to hide just saying.

 

[H4run]

Heeey, freedom fighter

I don't like the tone. I know you know zero crap about activism let alone freedom fighters, but don't assume everybody you meet is like you, we never drag that word around, so just drop it, not everybody is a kid like you.

You just watched a couple documentaries made by propaganda machine of one side

Again, don't assume everyone is as far from this subject as you, we are people from different corners of the world with different experience here, and you don't know crap about me or how far I am able to reach the suffering of the victim.

And you don't need to know that too, Mr. Potato.

 

[Ferocitus]

Well that and China has blocked travel to the region. It's like they have something to hide just saying.

Did they block you from going? Or are you just regurgitating crap again?
Google:
Can foreigners visit Xinjiang?
Do I need a special visa or permit for Xinjiang?

Simple answer, no. The Xinjiang Autonomous Region is not like Tibet, where foreigners need a permit to enter.

 

[Moriarte]

There's a difference between "your data is incomplete" and "your data is a fabrication". Even with incomplete data, the available data points to atrocities committed against the Uyghur. If you want to make a different claim, evidence it. Otherwise you're a fanatic and will be treated as such.

Cute, as you say

Yep, I am the coolest fanatic of them all - a civfanatic! As for the claims, sure, if you feel the need to educate the world with evidence of Uighur genocide, start Uighur genocide thread and keep us posted with your side of the story. This is Hong Kong thread.

 

[Gorbles]

Yep, I am the coolest fanatic of them all - a civfanatic! As for the claims, sure, if you feel the need to educate the world with evidence of Uighur genocide, start Uighur genocide thread and keep us posted with your side of the story. This is Hong Kong thread.

You made the claim about a "propaganda machine", you back it up. Don't go all backseat moderator because somebody tried to hold you to the standard you're imposing on others in your attempts to undercut atrocities perpetrated by the Chinese government

Which, funnily enough, makes it very relevant to a thread about Hong Kong.

 

[amadeus]

I'm just going to opine that I always find these people suspect because as a general rule they defend really almost anything done in the name of anti-imperialism and the only criticisms they offer are ones within the spectrum of state-approved dissent ("we could do more to protect the environment!")

Whereas in the Western world, I'm allowed to not only have my own opinions but also the opportunity to change governments I don't like.

 

[Moriarte]

I don't like the tone.

Perhaps you're not tempered enough to take part in this conversation if perceived "tones" put you off. Too bad.

You made the claim about a "propaganda machine", you back it up. Don't go all backseat moderator because somebody tried to hold you to the standard you're imposing on others in your attempts to undercut atrocities perpetrated by the Chinese government

Which, funnily enough, makes it very relevant to a thread about Hong Kong.

Actually, I made a point about two propaganda machines, Chinese and Western (although there are many more). What do you want me to prove - that each notable player controls mass communication technologies and likes propagating economically advantageous opinions within own sphere of influence? Well, if you don't get it yet I guess we'll have to wait until that happens.

 

[Ferocitus]

HK is doing very well in the life expectancy race.

 

[Gorbles]

Actually, I made a point about two propaganda machines, Chinese and Western (although there are many more). What do you want me to prove - that each notable player controls mass communication technologies and likes propagating economically advantageous opinions within own sphere of influence? Well, if you don't get it yet I guess we'll have to wait until that happens.

You specified "a propaganda machine of one side", so come on, let's have the details then. Stop retreating to vague generics to defend you blowing up at someone because of their "CCP hate", all because you want to pretend the ongoing treatment of the Uyghurs is fictional. Actually make an argument that doesn't revolve around calling people names, if you're able