How about peace for a change

[FionnMcCumhall]

lets just build our infrastructure this term. We are closing in on a period where it is harder to build improvemnts for our cities, and we need improvemnts like factories, universities and such. Id love to be able to reaserch on our own. Id love to make enough money with our 46 cities so we can 'steal a tech or two with our diplomats'. Instead of constantly being at war with one nation after another we try to maintain our contry from within. We can becomes a force to be reckoned with.

Also we have yet to have our golden age yet. alot of civs have. Why you ask. 2 reasons. no building of wonders and no concentration on infrastructure. Unless we want to wait for our UU to have a golden age then we should be trying for one now. that extra boost would help with production so we can build up for a great and glorisu war with the next civ that jerks our chain.

The time to stop warmongering is now. We need a time of growth and building so we can wage a better war, a more profitable war. we have expanded enough. as i think more than 50-60 cities is too much to manage even for one person.

End of rant, chime in if you disagree or agree

 

[Chieftess]

That's what I've been saying. We need to build our infrastructure. The Industrial Age is right around the corner.

 

[Falcon02]

to be honest, I agree, we need war yes... but we need to build infastructure now, war later.

 

[Cyc]

If you remember me from DG1, I was the Culture-driven, domestic builder who concentrated on growth. I understand completely what you're saying. And I agree. I have been pushing for irrigation of our Tiles and where I can, I stick in a Granary or Aqueduct for one of our Fanatikan cities.

If you've read my plan in the "war preparation" thread, you would realize that the plan was designed to only use 28% of our cities and these cities, for the most part, are already pretty well off on the development end. This plan leaves 72% of our cities free to build and develop in any manner they choose. That's a lot of cities. Plus we take care of the Defense of those cities, plus build our offensive forces. That's a pretty good deal. As our smaller cities catch up with our larger ones, we can switch out those with unit builders so they can put in an Aqueduct or Cathedral. We need to bring those smaller cities up and we need to build our Military. We will be attacked so we might as will figure out which way we'd like to go now.

 

[FionnMcCumhall]

i dont want wars or even talk of them, i just want to see peace and peacetime building, improvements, and maybe 10% devoted to making defensive ONLY units

 

[eyrei]

Originally posted by FionnMcCumhall
i dont want wars or even talk of them, i just want to see peace and peacetime building, improvements, and maybe 10% devoted to making defensive ONLY units

I really don't think this is a good idea yet. We need more territory, particularly that territory owned by the Russians and Americans that is close to our capital and FP. Once this is ours, then we switch to democracy and concentrate on building. We will of course need one more war to trigger our golden age, but that is a good distance away.

 

[Immortal]

Yes Cyc, I believe you were instrumental in the creation of the anti-war group from around the end of the DOmino War. I would also support avoidance of war. Though not to the same extent Fionn is.

 

[Cyc]

I agree with eyrei here. Emperor level is one which you can't "opt out" of the endless wars because you want to build. We really should get that extra territory and we do need a strong offensive line to keep others off our back.

 

[FionnMcCumhall]

Originally posted by eyrei


I really don't think this is a good idea yet. We need more territory, particularly that territory owned by the Russians and Americans that is close to our capital and FP. Once this is ours, then we switch to democracy and concentrate on building. We will of course need one more war to trigger our golden age, but that is a good distance away.

We dont need a war to get our GA. well get it soon enough when we get panzers and go to war then, assuming we have the necessary resources. The more time we wait ti build our infrastructure the more time it takes later to build. We have been putting it off til later each term, Its time to do it and never do it. We got enough territory anyways. according to powerbar trainer which i used to get the number of cities we got most civs beat by 15 cities. We could maybe use 4 more so we have an even 50 but thats it. Stop warmongering for awhile. My god we've spilled enough blood, Lets focus internally for awhile

growth = lower production costs
no growth = higher production costs

i vote for growth now how about you?

 

[Cyc]

Hey, Immortal! Long time, no see. Welcome back.

 

[eyrei]

Originally posted by FionnMcCumhall


We dont need a war to get our GA. well get it soon enough when we get panzers and go to war then, assuming we have the necessary resources. The more time we wait ti build our infrastructure the more time it takes later to build. We have been putting it off til later each term, Its time to do it and never do it. We got enough territory anyways. according to powerbar trainer which i used to get the number of cities we got most civs beat by 15 cities. We could maybe use 4 more so we have an even 50 but thats it. Stop warmongering for awhile. My god we've spilled enough blood, Lets focus internally for awhile

growth = lower production costs
no growth = higher production costs

i vote for growth now how about you?

I think you misunderstood my post to some extent. We seem to both agree that we will use Panzers to start our GA. What you said about resources is interesting...what better way to make sure we have oil and rubber than to conquer more territory.

Also, the cities we should conquer are ones that will be very productive.

I vote for more production and commerce! How about you?

 

[FionnMcCumhall]

not like we cant trade for those resources. so i still say no to warring for a while, whats so wrong with staying peaceful for a change? and we will get more production and commerce if we concentrate on our own cities instead of taking them from others. If we took a city with jugle surrounding it it wont be any use to use. if we need rubber and oil and we must take it then we take it but not til we discover the techs that require it to show on the map
so no war, lets concentrate on internal instead of external

 

[eyrei]

Having to trade for oil or rubber is almost the equivalent of a death sentence in the late game. I do not want to be in that position.

There is nothing wrong with building up our cities. However, we still need to accomplish a few things militarily before we focus our resources domestically.

 

[Cyc]

So, Fionn, you don't see the growth and development potential in my "PLAN A"? I'm suggesting less than 30% of our cities build military units. That leaves a lot of our cities to build infrastructure and Cultural improvements.

 

[Immortal]

Fionn, if we decide in advance which cities to target for the strike, we would benefit from them once they recovered from the transition. I think our nation, as large as it is, could do both, expand and build infrastructure. All we would have to do is decide which cities need to do what.

 

[Immortal]

Glad to be back Cyc, good to see you are still around. Hello again Eyrei, doing well I trust?

 

[FionnMcCumhall]

look iuf no one supports this then im not even doing my job as domestic advisor. Im suposed to take care of the country and my report tells me otherwise. We should be looking internally. Rubber, and oil are 40 turns away at least depending on the tech rate for the AI, and we can always trade for the techs but we shouldnt be going to war
we have had a war each term and have said each term oh well wait til later to build up our cities. Are we going to keep saying Just one more war? until its too late and it hurts us. No thanks i think the time is to work internally then keep going to war. You guys dont have to take care of the 40+ cities we got. the Domestic department and the governors do

 

[Immortal]

Hey Fionn, don't get discouraged, only pathetic people like me who stay here past 1am (mountain) time have posted. Wait until morning and see who posts in support of your motion (and I assure you, there will be). Chieftess and Falc have already stood up in support of you, I have yet to make a decision, as both yours and Eyrei's have merit.

 

[Plexus]

Peace at this time would be nice (I am the cultural minister) but I'm not really sure we should sit by and watch our enemies grow even stronger.

 

[Shaitan]

Warmongering is where it's at. Polls and discussion have consistantly shown that our goals are war and domination.

Yes, we definitely need more workers. No doubts there. We could use more infrastructure too, but that can be accomplished at the same time as warmongering. Slower yes but just as effective in the long run.