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How Do You Deal With Non-Stop War??

Discussion in 'Civ5 - Strategy & Tips' started by docbud, Apr 9, 2013.

  1. Matthew.

    Matthew. Chieftain

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    Alexander is known to not sign peace easily, even in his favor. I'd say take advantage of long wars to rack up the experience points. A couple of double-cover meat shields and a handful of double-attack Xbows and you should be able to roll across his entire empire. The key, of course, is you can't lose any units :D

    Keep melee on fortify unless you must absolutely move or attack with them. They make better obstacles and decoys than an offensive force. 40% for fortify and healing 20 hp per turn (in your borders); as long as you are on equal tech, the AI will have a difficult time breaking through.
     
  2. Browd

    Browd Dilettante Administrator

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    If you go to Military Overview, it shows how many units (military and civilian, including workers, settlers, GPs, missionaries, etc.) your empire can support. The only variables are number of cities and population; tile acquisition is not relevant.

    The attached screenie shows a little 2-city empire that can support 12 units in total; subtracting 5 military and civilian units leaves 7 available to be built. If this empire had had 13 units at that time, it would be 1 over the limit and would incur a 10% production penalty in all cities. If 3 over the limit, 30% penalty, etc.

    (And, before you ask, I have no idea what happens if you are more than 10 units over the limit.)
     

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  3. The Pilgrim

    The Pilgrim Chieftain

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    Low production start - building wonders.
    Aggressive neighbor nearby - building wonders.
    No exploration, no expansion...

    We've been there in your previous threads, haven't we? Same problems, same symptoms.
     
  4. azzaman333

    azzaman333 meh

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    Just kill him.
     
  5. docbud

    docbud Chieftain

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    Hey gang

    Thanks for the tips and advice.

    Yeah--I was worried about the extra cost by going over the max number of troops.

    @JINYX: I had thought about expanding up north, but when I got into the never-ending war, I thought it would be best to concentrate on the war.

    @The Pilgrim: Yes--it was a lousy area so far as production, but I figured I’d take a chance. At the time, I was only working on the Great Library. Other than that, I started off with a scout, monument, granary, archer, etc. Then bought more archers. So far as exploration, the only real place was northwest. Alexander already had his area staked out and was hostile from the moment we met. I didn’t want to be sending scouts through his area.

    Anyway, I’ve stated a new game with Boudicca, and am not building any wonders. And I’ve got a decent start and a few cities up and running.
     
  6. Maxym

    Maxym Chieftain

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    This is in general in case of drawn out war not just you, to deal with it you need .......(drum rolL).......... WIN IT, or at least appear to be winning it to AI. If you have scouted properly you might have discovered Alexs neighbor and got him to join in. He might have gotten Alexs army low enough to get peace. But peace is not a point, you need him out.

    When he attacks early you need to kill his army faster then he can make it, then go for offense, you build wonders :rolleyes:

    Make scout your opening build, ALWAYS, once you have it you hopefully will scout with it. (unless on archipelago) than scout or your warrior could have stolen Alexs settler going to settle that city next to you. If Alex is ur neighbor just take his settler workers whenever u can and sell him some lux before you DOW him.

    And I repeat, do not build Wonders.
     
  7. docbud

    docbud Chieftain

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    I am going to make it a rule for myself to forget about early wonders :)
     
  8. Merenptah

    Merenptah Chieftain

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    Why not replay and try to get a handle on this. I think it's worth more in terms of improving your gameplay than playing a different strategy/approach on a different map. What I mean is that you may think that you have improved, when in fact the map/neighbour just make it easier for you.

    Honestly, I would just start again from turn zero. Is this Large Island map ... Small continents? First step is to dominate the landmass you are on; take his capital and all his cities except for the tiniest one out there (so you don't get a diplo penalty for wiping out a civ).
     
  9. Maxym

    Maxym Chieftain

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    Yes that is a very good idea, I was thinking along the same lines. And if there are only two of you on this continent, you can wipe him out as long as you do it before you meet anyone else, or before he meets someone.
     
  10. docbud

    docbud Chieftain

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    ^^ I do have a few saves I think. The earliest I think is 1AD.

    You two are probably right--I should retry it.

    I believe it's small continents.
     
  11. S.O.T MAHak

    S.O.T MAHak Chieftain

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    Don't be afraid of using your city as part of your frontline, just let some of his unit attack your city, they'll lose a fair share of HP's and in your turn you finish them off.

    Remember to pick up the medic I and II promotion this will heal you wounded units in no time.

    I had a somewhat similar experience in an immortal game, China attacked my capital city(i've just send a settler away to found my second city out of harms way), defended by 2 archers, 1 warrior and 1 spearman. He attacked with a 12+ force including 3 catapults. Luckily his only melee units was 4 warriors, just when my capital HP was reduce to zero I used my last unit to kill off his last melee unit, leaving him with only ranged units, which just stayed there and got picked off one by one. Soon newly produced units and reinforcements from my second city turned the tide of the war and I exacted my revenge on his cities. :D

    P.S. Try to noticed how much EXP. his units get, there is nothing more frustrating then focusing on one unit only to have it use the annoying "instantly heal 50 HPS" promotion.
     
  12. docbud

    docbud Chieftain

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    You're right--I should let my city do a lot of the bombarding. I've been using my cannons as well.

    For the promotions, I've given my ranged units (crossbowmen, cannons) the cover promotion, and the melee units (musketmen) the medic promotion. Since I have a barracks, all new units I buy I get a promotion (so those are the ones I've been using).

    I'll probably go back to the 1AD save, and go from there. Unfortunately, it's right in the middle of war, but maybe I can push back the attack and get a temporary peace. Then get as many units as possible and go on the offensive against his city of Argos.

    I ended up quitting last night because Alex citadel-bombed my territory and took almost my entire western area (including both of my citadels which were outside my city).
     
  13. RX2000

    RX2000 Chieftain

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    I would have quit that game.
     
  14. Lokos451

    Lokos451 Chieftain

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    That game is totally winnable, and you should figure out how to do it for one simple reason...if you can't beat an admittedly tough opponent early, Alexander, on your current difficulty, you'll never figure how to move up!

    Here's my advice. Rethink what you qualify as a good city. There's two you could have grabbed, and they're not ideal...but they'd quickly pay off their hammer costs with new units produced, and bombards dealt. Basically, if you have a lux and four or five tiles, it's worth it. More is better, but you are after all in a bad spot. Tabarnak wrote a really excellent article about the tradition 4-city start strat on these forums, and I highly advise you read it. If you read between the lines, it gives a lot of useful tips for how to make things go along faster for your start, even if you're not doing tradition the way he's laying it out. A lot of this is about scouting relentlessly(an ocean city for a trireme is a HUGE deal), selling aggressively, getting workers out at pace, and settling on resources for the first city or two. You'd be surpised how much they add up to result in more cities moar faster.

    Second large point, which you seemed to get. Wonders are generally a mistake. Sometimes I do pyramids if I have a prod-heavy start, as it's cheaper than hammering two workers out. Even this can be hugely risky though. Save them for when your empire is established, defended, or your local warmongering jerk is safely puppeted and feeding you resources.

    You mentioned also having trouble keeping ahead of his unit production. Focus on missile units, and pulling the enemy into your city bombard, having more cities to bombard with and build said archers, and you'll find this less of a problem. But this problem will only intensify with difficulty level, so get used to those carpets of units. hehe. Timing of your push can be everything, and learning when is right is a painful process. You'll get there if you keep at it though.

    Last but not least...if you're next to a hardcore and tough monger...say Alex, or often Washington or Wu, the mongols, etc....really consider taking at least a portion of honor. There is no better policy for per city happiness if you take the right side, and few that will save you as much money. Top of tradition, followed by honor up to garrisons, then legalism to exploit the free ampitheatres. It's conservative, it's versatile against/for mongers. It makes your culture huge, and healing easier. Might work for you.

    Good luck and have fun, hope to see you posting a victory screen on this painful start someday!
     
  15. Novalia

    Novalia Chieftain

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    More ranged units less melee. When he attacks next time let him get closer. Let him bang his melee against your walls (build or buy walls). Then pick them off with your safely positioned ranged units. The AI is stupid on every level.

    When he begins to retreat, mop up the wounded. Take a city.
     
  16. docbud

    docbud Chieftain

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    Lolos451: I will be giving it another shot tonight when I get home. Hopefully I have earlier saves towards the beginning.

    I had finished Tradition completely, and had Honor almost completed (only had the last one at bottom right left).

    @Novalia: I’ve got walls, castle, and barracks for upgrades.

    I thought that with those (and my two citadels), I’d be able to stop the onslaught. But it’s hard when he moves so many troops through like that.

    If I go to an earlier save, should I try for the Great Wall again? It didn’t seem too helpful in the game I lost.
     
  17. Greslin

    Greslin Chieftain

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    Just looking at the screenshots, the consistent themes I'm seeing are a lot of wasted maneuver space to the east and a lot of gold in the treasury.

    I'm a big fan of the GW, even against Greece, especially if you have a tech advantage. The key is to draw them in, not fight them at the borders, gang up on specific units to take them out of play and throw a really good range unit into the city for defense. Some pillages are inevitable, but even outnumbered you should chew Alex up. I'd also be spending some of that gold on easily moved range units (i.e., crossbows and knights).
     
  18. dopingman

    dopingman Chieftain

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    If you didn't start a new game, then the initial auto save is still present. When you have found it, load it up as a file attachment and I will give this game a shot :)
     
  19. docbud

    docbud Chieftain

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    @Greslin: Yeah, there is wasted space to the east. Since I’ve been at war, I was hesitant to build a second city there. The gold had been steadily dwindling as I was cash-buying troops.

    @dopingman: I did start a new game, but I’ll see what I have for saves. I may have some very early ones as I tend to save every four or five turns. Then I grab the early ones and throw them in the trash. But hopefully I didn’t empty my trash!
     
  20. dopingman

    dopingman Chieftain

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    Investing cash in a settler is an investment, you will get back what you've spent eventually.

    Just load up the earliest save you got :)
     

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