How does forest growth work?

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Strategy & Tips' started by reflec, Jun 16, 2020.

  1. reflec

    reflec Chieftain

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    I'm wondering if it's possible to force forests to grow certain tiles/if it's worth it to leave unimproved tiles near your capital so that forests may grow there. Or is that just not worth it?
     
  2. AcaMetis

    AcaMetis Emperor

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    Forcing forest growth isn't possible without mods, and leaving forests/unimproved tiles around to chance regrowth isn't worth it. Once you have Bronze Working you're better off chopping all your forests into settlers, more workers, infrastructure, units if you're going to rush someone early, or whatever will else speed up your empire's growth.

    Some exceptions apply, but in general, deforest your empire early and completely.
     
  3. FlyinJohnnyL

    FlyinJohnnyL You need more workers....

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    The only time this works that doesn't hamper you much is when you have cities that are right up next to forested tundra, or something like that. Then you aren't in a hurry to develop that tundra, and maybe you'll get forest growth in your BFC if it's next to the forested tundra. Otherwise, forests are there to CHOP CHOP CHOP.
     
  4. Qactus

    Qactus Romani ite domum

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    The chance for an unimproved tile to receive a forest spread is 0.1% per turn for each forest adjacent to it N, E, S or W. Diagonally adjacent forests have no effect. The probabilities are added up, so if there are forests in all four directions the chance per turn is 0.4%.
    The chance is halved if there's a road on the tile that would receive the spread.

    Chopping forests is of course better than keeping them around. That said, it is still useful to keep in mind the regrowth mechanics in order to determine which forest to chop first:
    Chop the forests that have the most desirable underlying terrain first (e.g. riverside grassland). Then chop those that give you the largest regrowth chance.
     
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  5. pi-r8

    pi-r8 Luddite

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    IMO the chance is so low that it's not even worth thinking about. Just develop your tiles in whatever way is most efficient. It's not worth leaving a useful tile bare just for a (at best) 0.4% chance. You'd have to wait, on average, 250 turns just for ONE forest growth there!
     
  6. 6K Man

    6K Man Bureaucrat

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    I don't know the mechanics of forest growth, but I know jungle grows preferentially on Pig and Gems tiles, and the chance for spread is doubled if you don't know Iron Working.







    :crazyeye:
     
  7. elmurcis

    elmurcis Emperor

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    One time when I really *wait* for forest (up to some point... on Marathon it makes more sense I guess?) is when capital has 2 Deer tiles but only one forested and 2nd not. Almost like small victory when Forest finally grows over Deer and can improve camp and get that sweet +1 Health (forever) :D
    Outside of that - chopping in chess-table formation also can give couple extra forests here and there. Rarely can chop 3 times same forest before finally clearing area.
     
  8. Max Duke

    Max Duke Chieftain

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    I'm anti-chop. I find no reasons to hurry the production so much, as I already go bankrupt with a large kindgom developed with a few chops. And I face also pollution.
    I spare the chopping for Wonders or as a reserve production.
    I usually like to hurry Printing Press, so Replaceable Parts (which makes Windmill and Watermill worthy) then Steam Power and Railroad (early Machine Guns), so I must have many forests (and I will have around some Woodsman2 Machine Guns). A forest on plains and river + Levee gives you 5 hammers and 1 gold. +1 health x3 forests.
    One day you'll wish a Factory and you shall have some Health margin to make it.
    I really don't like the total-chop strategy, I'd say it's wrong.
     
  9. Max Duke

    Max Duke Chieftain

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    I play Marathon games lately, leaving many many forests, and I can tell that they do regrow. I've completed late Wonders with chopping aid. And have enough health for Factories + gas + coal.
    You also might like a healthy city for Ironworks. And a town with the greatest number of forests for National Park.

     
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2020
  10. sampsa

    sampsa Ghost

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    @Max Duke when you learn how to chop aggressively, the level of your play will skyrocket. I'm assuming you are playing way below deity.
     
  11. Windsor

    Windsor Flawless

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    If you chop instead of improving core tiles then you actually do chop too aggressively, but other than that chopping is the way to go. I don't really see that as up for debate anymore. If expansion cripples the economy then the problem is almost certainly somewhere else than the chopping. IronWorks and National Park are so far down the tech tree that I don't give them a thought at all when I chop.

    Even in K-mod where Lumbermills come with Guilds I chop everything before I even unlock them.
     
  12. Max Duke

    Max Duke Chieftain

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    Of course with Deity you can't have large dimension cities, so you can chop.
    That's not funny to me, since the AI doesnt change its own ability with Deity, you only get penalties of health and happiness.
    Now I play marathon in large maps at monarch level.
    By the way Im not a noob, I used to play multiplayer 20yrs ago with the top players in those great 4v4 inland sea and have won many games :) .
     
  13. sampsa

    sampsa Ghost

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    Not sure what you mean with dimension, but you can have a lot of big cities even on deity.
    It's not supposed to be fun (or funny) really, just challenging. Also, there are no :health: or :) -penalties on deity.
    Well, whatever rocks your boat world. But if you come here telling people that
    you should expect some responses. You received a pretty nice one.
     
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2020
  14. Nogbadthebad

    Nogbadthebad Chieftain

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    I am intrigued- what is the advantage of a woody2 machine gun?
     
  15. Max Duke

    Max Duke Chieftain

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    To protect my precious lumbermills and deers... 18 +50% tile defense +45% defence in forest +50% vs gunpowder units; eventually fortified +25%, eventually with a fort in forest... Until the advent of Marines it's a super defensive unit, with double move in forest, it doesnt need to be fortified either.
    I escort my big-stacks that will possibly walk by forests or hills, for which I have guerrilla machine guns. (I'm in 1800AD and the AI has left many forests in its land).
     
  16. sampsa

    sampsa Ghost

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    Woody2 MG:s to protect the precious lumbermills and deers... This is King Younk -tier stuff.
     
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  17. Nogbadthebad

    Nogbadthebad Chieftain

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    That sounds good, but do you not find the AI tends to just pillage all the other improvements instead tho? Also how do you pay for the unit upgrades without tanking the economy?
     
  18. lymond

    lymond Rise Up! (Phoenix Style!) Moderator Hall of Fame Staff

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    sampsa made me :rotfl:

    MP an SP are very very different Mr. Duke....when it comes to SP gameplay it's quite possible that you are still a noob and from just about everything you've mentioned so far that does appear to be the case.

    That can be remedied here. :)
     
  19. Max Duke

    Max Duke Chieftain

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    You can kill oncoming cavalry or tanks from fortified field and recover in them: if you stay fortified only in city you can defend only the terrain close to the city. AI small stacks will ignore your fortified units usually. It's the same thing when dfending from barbarians, I keep fortified guerrilla archers on hills and woodsmen in forests, repeated in a later age vs AI.
     
  20. Max Duke

    Max Duke Chieftain

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    - My challenge is to win with this strategy. It's like a different difficulty level. To win with a different style.
    Keeping forests if possible. Then you're really fine from Replacement Parts (that you shall rush) up to the modern era, but you have to sacrifice some chopping boost.

    - Regrowth happens, so in the end of the game I've chopped more than the choppers, also having the chance to chop for late Wonders.
     

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