How Has the New Tech Tree Changed Your Warfare?

Discussion in 'Civ5 - General Discussions' started by Peacemongerer, Jun 30, 2012.

  1. Peacemongerer

    Peacemongerer Prince

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    With the expanded tech-tree, I'm noticing myself actualy using musketmen (I never did this in vanilla) and Great War bombers provide a nice stopgap between conventional warfare and modern bombers. This was something I really felt was lacking in Civ V... I often skipped entire eras of warfare just by cherry-picking the tech tree.

    The only gripe I have is that Battleships come kind of late and I don't really see fit to build them (I find an ironclad destroyer's ability to take coastal cities much more appealing). Gatling guns and machine guns were a nice imprvement, although having their promos go to waste with Mech Infantry just pushed the gripes we had about Crossbowmen further down the line.

    Any thoughts?
     
  2. Gali

    Gali Prince

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    Really you dont find a really powerful unit with the range and vision to ignore city defenses and an innate 33% bonus vs cities useful.

    I find mech infantry really awkwardly placed and dont get them often. That combined with more conveniently placed modern armor upgrades makes me value tanks more later on.
     
  3. nefloyd

    nefloyd King

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    I used carriers for the first time, really... carrying bombers to help soften up the shores for my invasion of Korea, and then transfer them into newly capped cities to continue inland.

    Inclusion of musketmen as a middle between swords and rifles is good.

    Now that units can take more hits, I find myself using hit-and-run tactics with horse-based units a lot more, since they can actually attack and survive a retaliation before they run off to heal. Also means I can use them to penetrate into enemy territory more and pillage resources; managed to do this to every horse and iron that Attila had one game, really shredded his forces that had me outnumbered at home.

    Crossbows going further as a ranged unit is cool, still seems like a huge jump going to gatling guns though (18->36), seems like there should be something interim in the renaissance (but what? no idea)
     
  4. Peacemongerer

    Peacemongerer Prince

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    Maybe keep the tree going by adding sniper units or something? Perhaps stopgap between crossbowmen and gatling guns would be to add some tech in the 2nd tier of the Industrial Era and put them there so the jump doesn't feel as big.

    I didn't notice the Battleships had an innate +33% vs. cities... I was just looking at combat strength. That may change my future plans a bit. :)
     
  5. Gali

    Gali Prince

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    They should add a mortar unit, really an infantry weapon really easy setup but not as powerful.
     
  6. Flaviusx

    Flaviusx Chieftain

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    I'm building more tanks, more siege weapons, more cavalry, more ships, and a lot less infantry of any kind. Infantry has been severely devalued in this expansion. You need two promotions to make it at all useful (to get cover) and opportunity costs are such that it's simply easier to build anything else which is fine with zero promotions. Fire and movement dominate this expansion -- slow melee units, not so much.

    Pikemen, swordsmen, longswords, all of it is just bleh, now. Too slow, too vulnerable to ranged fire.
     
  7. PreLynMax

    PreLynMax Your Lord and Master

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    With siege not requiring iron, I'm finding myself building less and less siege and more melee units. Now that 60:20:20 ratio is now an even 33:33:33 between siege, melee and ranged, and of course, I'm building lots more swordsmen/longswordsmen than before.
     
  8. Bandersnatching

    Bandersnatching Warlord

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    How does that make sense? Siege units are more available now, and better at what they're supposed to do, so you build less of them? If you are fighting more balanced enemy forces you would probably shift your own build choices to compensate, but your if>then is kind of strange. Freeing up iron makes swordsmen more available; I guess that you were building spears and cats before the expansion?
     
  9. Buccaneer

    Buccaneer Deity

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    Since I can't beeline towards Chivalry as fast anymore, having to make do with Swords/Longswords, Comp Bowmen and Catapults if I don't have an early UU. Had used those for defenses but not offensives very much before.
     
  10. PreLynMax

    PreLynMax Your Lord and Master

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    It's because of the iron requirement on siege weapons on vanilla. I would build less swords and more siege and more spears. Because siege got a lot better, I would USE less because I don't need as much, but now I have a better front because of the more balance, because I'm not building less siege, it's because I'm building more melee.
     
  11. nefloyd

    nefloyd King

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    If they're better at what they do, you can achieve the same effect you previously had by using less of them.

    When you had to split 2, 4, or 6 iron into your attacking force, you had to make some hard decisions about how many siege vs melee units you used. He's saying now he can load up on melee units, which can take a greater front line and mean you don't need as many siege behind them blasting away.
     
  12. Veneke

    Veneke King

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    I'm finding that I'm missing out on Destroyers until very near the end game, while my first modern naval unit is typically the Submarine. It feels wrong but is really cool at the same time. Great War bombers seem to be my new artillery as well, which is different to say the least.

    The Battleship does come kinda late but I've found that you can do without it if you have enough Ironclads/Privateers knocking around. The odds are pretty good that you'll survive the city's counter-attack after you hit it, which means that spamming naval melee on a city instead of properly bombarding it is a valid tactic.
     
  13. Zenstrive

    Zenstrive Ocean King

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    Actually using bomber to soften up cities and let destroyers take them over is fun :)

    Also, machine gun side by side with riflemen with artillery support is kinda cool.
     
  14. Barghaest

    Barghaest King

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    I'm using more Musketmen (did use quite a few pre-G&K but now I find myself using more since some of the early UUs transition into them).

    Also using more non-siege range units... and planes (aircraft was my favorite aspect of Civ V and now I can use em sooner!).

    I find myself making more use of caravels as well (previously I'd treat them like scouts since they took so long to upgrade and it didn't take much extra to push to upgrade my experienced triremes).
     
  15. Mustakrakish

    Mustakrakish In 'Node' We Trust

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    Dunno bout the tech tree, but naval changes made me actually build and use ships now, loving it. Also love how AI constantly uses "surround and slaughter" tactic. They surround a lone ship from 2 sides, effectively blocking it from escaping and hack and slash at it. Was stunned the first time AI did this to my super upgraded lone wolf destroyer.
     
  16. Barghaest

    Barghaest King

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    Yeah, Japan backstabbed me that way... surrounded my experienced trireme with 4 of his. Because he couldn't attack with two (they moved max) I managed to survive and since I was beside my coastal city I hid and bombarded the crap out of him with the city, a nearby catapult and the composite bowman garrison. Managed to sink two of his ships before he pulled back but had to rush-buy walls for the city to survive...

    By that time the rest of my navy (which had been annoying the Celts on the other side of the peninsula), swooped in for the rescue. Still, it was a pretty brutal game... England and the Celts kept tag teaming me... the first time the Celts did it they almost took a city and did wipe out half my experienced units. AI's gotten sneaky...
     
  17. StrideColossus

    StrideColossus Warlord

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    In vanilla I tended to 'toggle' between warmongering with contemporary/advanced units and turtling when they were getting outdated to beeline for the next upgrade(s). This is still a valid strategy, but with the changes to the tree and more units (esp the promotion line for archery units) now it seems you can also improve your military more organically and keep on warring if you choose too.

    Also agree with previous posters that the changes to naval warfare now mean it's much more fun to fight in the seas (in fact it's practically mandatory on some maps). Carthage with Messenger of the Gods pantheon paying for your army/navy FTW :king:
     
  18. Eagle Pursuit

    Eagle Pursuit Scir-Gerefa

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    I'm finding cavalry a bit more useful now that pikemen become lancers rather than riflemen. I also love having aerial warfare coming earlier in the game. The Gatling guns rock. I love setting them up on a hill and letting my enemy try to remove them. The funny thing is that you may want to keep a crossbow around to plink at the gatling guns from out of range. It's annoying when the AI does this.
     
  19. Gucumatz

    Gucumatz JS, secretly Rod Serling

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    Battleships also have 3 range (meaning you can use like artillery and stay out of a city radius) and indirect fire.

    If anything they are a little too powerful. Able to wipe out almost any navy easily and cities
     
  20. Aurelius321

    Aurelius321 Warlord

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    Loving the Gatling Gun, very nice little unit to spice things up. Also, since units last longer, enjoying upgrading my units. I didn't play much Vanilla CiV before I gave up on it (couldn't take the diplomacy), but from what I remember units didn't last too long unless you really tried. In G&K upgraded units actually last, making the high-grade promotions actually attainable. Had some B-17's that were upgraded like crazy last game.
     

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