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How many cities? -Early and late-

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Strategy & Tips' started by austincm, Dec 31, 2010.

  1. austincm

    austincm Chieftain

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    how many cities should I be building in the early and late game? and should they ever overlap? and should they all be specialized? and if so, how many should be commerce and production and agh, i normally go for peacefull games with early warmongering to get all the land i want.
     
  2. xenex

    xenex Chieftain

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    Between 6 and 10 before 1 ad, depending on the map you may only be able to get 6 or you might be able to get as much as 10.

    Overlap can be good and should not be avoided like the plague like many new players tend to do, if overlap means that city is better, or may contribute to yoru empire faster, then overlap might be good, remember that not all cities have to become huge.Many times overlapping means you can work the best tiles in both cities for longer.

    A good example of this is if you have a cottage that falls in both cities workable area, if at one point one city needs more hammers then the other, then you can switch the cottage tile to the other city, so your still growing it and getting its benefit.This applies to every other tile in the game, but the advantage is most visible with cottages.Other example is if a city has "too much" food, you can let the other city borrow the food while it grows.

    They all dont have to be specialized, but focusing a city on certain things, like hammers, commerce and specialist may help you to prevent building stuff that would mostly be wasted by that city.I think the numbers you are aiming for are 2 production, 2 commerce and 2 GP farms, although the numbers aren't set in stone that much, besides the production city, the other ones can go hybrid and still do well especially commerce, at the least you want 2 production 1 commerce and 1 GP farm, but if you can get one more of commerce and GP you should do it.



    How many cities do you usually have before you start taking from your neighbours?After taking their land how many cities do you usually put down? before you get to say Code of Laws?
     
  3. austincm

    austincm Chieftain

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    I don't expand that fast, right now it's like 500 bc and i have 5 cities. Also I really have trouble picking the location sometimes.
     
  4. xenex

    xenex Chieftain

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    Well 5 cities by 500 BC isn't too bad.You can easily get 2 more cities out before 1 AD, which should put you right in the middle of the number you want to aim for.

    After your capitol your first 2 cities are usually gonna aim to get a strategic resource and possibly block a bit of land if possible/ if you already had strategic resource ready.
     
  5. austincm

    austincm Chieftain

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    Is it okay to make the first few cities rather far away to obtain some resources? should they be kinda close? also, is it true that you can only work the 20 tiles directly around your city and that's it, cultural borders mean nothing except for territory?
     
  6. whats a navy

    whats a navy Chieftain

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    Exactly. You can only work the "Big Fat Cross" in you cultural borders. Its basically a 5x5 square without the corners or your first border pop in a city.
     
  7. Ergo Sum

    Ergo Sum Chieftain

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    The first border pop of a city is equivalent to your BFC. When cultural borders increase beyond that they no longer correspond solely to the BFC. You get those ~20 tiles for a city and that's it.

    As for sending settlers far away, it is important to snag early metals or hook up happy resources, but it's often a better idea to settle near the capital. If you can hook up such a city quickly with some food resources and decent production, you save the time and worker-turns it takes to settle farther away and get more hammers and beakers sooner, which sometimes makes the difference. If you're trying to block off a lot of land or absolutely need a city spot, it isn't out of the question to rush far from the capital, but don't underestimate the advantages of settling close to home.
     
  8. cracked

    cracked Wierdo.

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    There is a trade off between blocking the expansion of rival civs and the cost of city mantainance: generally speaking, the extra cost of throwing a city out to block off rivals secures land you can build cities in and thus the cost is worth it. Whether or not this is effective will largely depend upon the type of map and starting position.

    What I would be wary of is building a second city purely to block off a rival civ: still try to pick a good site that will allow for trade connections with your capital and will be useful, otherwise that city is an early drag on your economy. If it looks like it may be better to build elsewhere you can declare war and use cheap units to hold chokepoints and steal workers. If they're in a position where they have few directions they can expand, you can effectively limit them to a very small number of cities.

    I would still typically try to build my second city towrds the opponent I'd want to eliminate first for two reasons; logistically attacking becomes easier so if you're looking to rush it's a good idea, tactically defending a city is easier than defending open land, strategically, it stops the AI from securing that territory for itself. If it makes more sense to settle city no2 elswhere, I'd definitely use my third city to start blocking them in.

    Watch for the AI building cities really close to your borders: I personally see it as an excuse for war (and an easy way of increasing the number of cities I have if they're in good locations) as it's a statement of their intent.
     
  9. Yoshi1

    Yoshi1 Chieftain

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    not again...read some strat guides or the 100 other topics about that...
    how many beers should i drink per day? should they all be quality ones? Should i ever drink 2 at once?
    If so, how many should have more than 5% alc?
    Hard to answer? Sorry, Civ cannot be generalized, learn to play and gain some experience or...read the damn guides.
     
  10. cracked

    cracked Wierdo.

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    The more cities you have, the greater your mantainance costs, so a large number of poor cities is seldom helpful. What i normally consider more important (though it often depends on the level you're playing) is the placing of those cities.

    2 well placed cities around turn 50 can soon become 4.
    3 well placed cities around turn 75 can soon become 6.
    4 well placed cities around turn 100 can soon become 8.

    And because they're well placed, they soon become strong and further expansion will boost your economy rather than hurt it.

    5 or 6 Strong cities around the 0AD can often offer a strong enough base/starting point to win the game, especially if you can keep expanding peacefully and/or aggressively.

    As such, where you've placed those cities is more important than necessarily having lots of cities.

    e.g. that horse resource in the middle of that tundra may be inviting, but don't forget that you'll have difficulty growing that city and thus making it productive and economically viable if that's it's only resource. An extreme example but I'm sure you get the point: it was a mistake I made in a game some time ago.

    I personally like to build my second city at a point where I can secure at least 2 other resources, preferably three or four, preferably those that I can use really early in the game. Gems may be very desirable but consider, will you be able to mine it if you don't have iron working to clear the jungle it sits in. If not, building a city there then trying to tech for iron won't be as quick as settling somewhere with more easily accessed resources and more easily developed land first.

    If you're fortunate, the following 3rd and 4th cities will also have access to multiple resources: you should also have techs and workers available to start settling those tricky to develop sites after your 3rd or 4th. You may even decide that taking enemy cities is preferable. If you still have the space and land to settle more cities that cover multiple resources after that, then do so (and consider yourself lucky). The 5th and 6th may only have one resource to use and instead be placed because the land is particularly good. After that, overlap if it that is what is required to work all the useful available land.

    Try to avoid an attitude that sais "I must have y number of cities by x time irrespective of circumstance". I've tried that myself: it doesn't work unless you have really good land to expand into.
     
  11. cracked

    cracked Wierdo.

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    I find 6 bottles every new year enough for me:goodjob:
     
  12. kensington888

    kensington888 Chieftain

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    should i drink 6 different kinds of beer or do they have to be the same?
     
  13. TheWilltoAct

    TheWilltoAct I am observe

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    Lol get over yourself.
     
  14. beest

    beest Chieftain

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    not to forget: Should I drink them all at once?
     
  15. Bucephalus

    Bucephalus Shooting from the lip....

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    It's a f****** discussion forum - there is no obligation for you to reply if it troubles you that much.
     
  16. Farm Boy

    Farm Boy I swear..

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    Yosh, your dog get run over or something?
     
  17. cracked

    cracked Wierdo.

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    for the sake of convenience, it may be easier to buy the six bottles as part of a pack.
     
  18. Yoshi1

    Yoshi1 Chieftain

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    lol..so i pointed out that with the "search" function he could have poped up dozens of threads where this is discussed, big deal? Yea i wasn't to friendly, shame on me, i bet you are always in a buttkisser mood. Lucky you =p
     
  19. cracked

    cracked Wierdo.

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    unless you're an experinced drinker, I'd advise against it: Heavy vomiting is a potential outcome.
     
  20. Farm Boy

    Farm Boy I swear..

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    It is fine, I think the reaction was what it was because this is CFC, not WOWHEAD. There do not seem to be many bastions on the internet as civil, intelligent and helpful as this forum so no need to rough up the new and lost.
     

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