How many of those that subscribe to Islam support terrorism?

[Katheryn]

And this isn't really accurate either:

Quote:
That's fine for you to do so, but my focus is on those that do not.


Close enough; Syria actively supports terrorist groups like Hezbollah, is allied to Iran, and holds Syria's Jewish community hostage.


I don't care about nuances, I care about the Americans who are being murdered in the name of Islam.

Haha, this is the exact problem: how most Westerners are unable to intelligently view another peoples and their history, culture, and current affairs. This ignorance is blinding. It is ludicrous how you say "close enough" to the idea that Syria are Islamists when in fact they are Baathists. But I'm afraid that you can never truly appreciate how funny of a statement that is. I just told you that Baathists are the avowed enemies of Islamists, and yet you find it OK to group them together, lol. I think with your mentality, the idea of just nuking everyone who looks brown would be a tenable idea.

It is NOT ludicrous. These groups, the Allawites, the Sunnis and the Shias do get together and cooperate with one another in order to fight a common enemy. Then, afterward, they go back to fighting one another. This happened in the fight between Afghanistan and Russia. It is also going on between the Syrians and Iranians in the support of Hezbollah against Israel, so let's not be disingenuous in order to make someone else look ignorant.

They do work together, and so from an American perspective, it doesn't matter that much. Yes, it is interesting to discover which groups have different views, but for the most part, the difference between Wahabbis and Salafists are infintesimal, and it is exaggeration to make it seem important. It isn't relevant when they are constantly shifting loyalties, don't mind ignoring their differences to fight a common enemy.

Ayman al Zawahiri is NOT a Wahabbi, he is an Egyptian Salafist, and yet he has been #2 loyal companion to OBL, and even married off his daughter to OBL's son. There is not that much difference. They both adhere to the Khalwaariji theory that says you can proclaim a Muslim a kafir and kill him if he does any compromising with a secular government. That is what happened to Ali, Mohammed's son in law. They killed him for negotiation with a kafir. That seems to be all that is important to them. They want to kill, kill, kill.

 

[Katheryn]

The newest poll out of England:

More young Muslims back sharia, says poll


Stephen Bates and agencies
Monday January 29, 2007
The Guardian


A growing minority of young Muslims are inspired by political Islam and feel they have less in common with non-Muslims than their parents do, a survey reveals today. The poll, carried out for the conservative-leaning Policy Exchange thinktank, found support for Sharia law, Islamic schools and wearing the veil in public is significantly stronger among young Muslims than their parents.

In the survey of 1,003 Muslims by the polling company Populus through internet and telephone questionnaires, nearly 60% said they would prefer to live under British law, while 37% of 16 to 24-year-olds said they would prefer sharia law, against 17% of those over 55. Eighty-six per cent said their religion was the most important thing in their lives.

Nearly a third of 16 to 24-year-olds believed that those converting to another religion should be executed, while less than a fifth of those over 55 believed the same. The survey claimed that British authorities and some Muslim groups have exaggerated the problem of Islamophobia and fuelled a sense of victimhood among some Muslims: 84% said they believed they had been well treated in British society, though only 28% thought the authorities had gone over the top in trying not to offend Muslims. Munira Mirza, a doctoral student at Kent University who wrote the report, said: "The government should engage with Muslims as citizens, not through their religious identity."

Hmmm... a third of these Muslims said to kill those who convert to another religion. I guess we should be happy that less than a fifth of the over 55 crowd think so?

 

[Katheryn]

The newest poll out of England:

More young Muslims back sharia, says poll


Stephen Bates and agencies
Monday January 29, 2007
The Guardian


A growing minority of young Muslims are inspired by political Islam and feel they have less in common with non-Muslims than their parents do, a survey reveals today. The poll, carried out for the conservative-leaning Policy Exchange thinktank, found support for Sharia law, Islamic schools and wearing the veil in public is significantly stronger among young Muslims than their parents.

In the survey of 1,003 Muslims by the polling company Populus through internet and telephone questionnaires, nearly 60% said they would prefer to live under British law, while 37% of 16 to 24-year-olds said they would prefer sharia law, against 17% of those over 55. Eighty-six per cent said their religion was the most important thing in their lives.

Nearly a third of 16 to 24-year-olds believed that those converting to another religion should be executed, while less than a fifth of those over 55 believed the same. The survey claimed that British authorities and some Muslim groups have exaggerated the problem of Islamophobia and fuelled a sense of victimhood among some Muslims: 84% said they believed they had been well treated in British society, though only 28% thought the authorities had gone over the top in trying not to offend Muslims. Munira Mirza, a doctoral student at Kent University who wrote the report, said: "The government should engage with Muslims as citizens, not through their religious identity."

http://politics.guardian.co.uk/thinktanks/story/0,,2000984,00.html

Hmmm... a third of these Muslims said to kill those who convert to another religion. I guess we should be happy that less than a fifth of the over 55 crowd think so?

 

[Mega Tsunami]

Some more stats about Britain – Last year Channel 4 did a survey of Muslims in Britain.

Below is a rather shocking summary of the results. Figures of 24% agreeing with the London bombings which killed 52 ‘fellow Britons’ are not the 0.00001% some of you would like to think.
It seems to me that the average American Muslim (that many people talk about in CFC) is not the same as the average British Muslim.

Linked to such conspiracy theories is a wider reservoir of extremist views. Almost a third of those polled would like to live under sharia law. More than one in ten understand why British Muslims might want to carry out suicide missions in this country. Nearly a quarter thought that the 7/7 bombings were justified because of Britain's foreign policy. Almost one in five respect Osama Bin Laden to some extent. We should not overstate such fanaticism. The poll shows that the majority of Muslims reject such views and that there is a strong drive towards integration. There exists, nevertheless, a wellspring of extremist views which cannot be ignored.

http://www.channel4.com/news/dispatches/article.jsp?id=412

Here is a newspaper summary :
http://news.scotsman.com/uk.cfm?id=1145782006

And here is a pdf of the whole survey

http://www.imaginate.uk.com/MCC01_SURVEY/Site Download.pdf

 

[Tee Kay]

How many of those that subscribe to Islam support terrorism?

Less than 1%, I would think.

 

[REDY]

I think its about area. In Palestine is number high, in Tunis low...

 

[storealex]

And some men fight for silver
and some men fight for gold
but the IRA are fighting for
the land that the Saxons stole


Come all you gallant Irishmen,
And join the IRA
We'll strike a blow for freedom,
When it comes a certain day,
You know your country's History,
And the sacrifice it made,
Come join the First Batallion
Of the Belfast Brigade.


This island of ours now has long been half free.
Six counties are under John Bull's tyranny.
So we gave up our boyhood to drill and to train
To play our own part in the Patriot game.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

These are songs I heard in the Pubs of Ireland while I travelled around there... yet there is peace. My point is there's a huge difference between feeling oppressed and understanding the reason for terrorism, to actually support it or take part in it your self.

 

[MamboJoel]

I don't care about nuances, I care about the Americans who are being murdered in the name of Islam.

This is exactly where some :
1. decide to stop relying on their intelligence by going with easy shortcuts, amalgamating fallacies, trying to simplify a wolrd that is complex.
2. become dangerous.
3. get elected thanks to populism, bonapartism or manipulation of easy patterns to sell to their audience and electorate as a sterilized product.

Considering point 1., I'm often disapointed when somebody I though was a intelligent starts simplifying the world like that : it's an admission of incompetency. But I have to admit over-simplification is not surprising when it comes from well known one-liners...

And by nourishing the binary simplistic debate, you inevitably will get this answer...

Haha, this is the exact problem: how most Westerners are unable to intelligently view another peoples and their history, culture, and current affairs. This ignorance is blinding.

...Amalgamating all westerners together... This answer applies perfectly to the comment you made by trying to draw easy shortcuts between Islam and terrorism, but just like yours, it's holistic tendency is desastrous.
I wont get into much details about the impression of lack of knowledge thru traveling that comes out of your shortcuts/ideas that you argumented here @rmsharpe, so I'd just give you this simple advice : take a break from Minnesota, Internet, americano-american conservative/liberal environnement and use your youth to do what it's made for : discovering, traveling.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

I dislike polls because of

1. Inaccuracy. They start out with polling 1,000 muslims and then start drawing conclusions about demgraphics in that 1,000 muslims. For instance 16-24 year olds. How many were polled?

2. The poll can influence the outcome. The way a question is formulated. The area or social circles polled. "1,000 muslims" is a meaningless piece of info. Also the order of questions. A sequence of questions can push answers for the last questions. There's lots of studies on this.

Even knowing all this. None of the polls showed a majority favouring terrorism. Does that suit the OP?

edit: Guess not: "how many of the 1.3 billion". Drat!

Answer: Not as many as you might think, but certainly too much.

 

[Katheryn]

Less than 1%, I would think.

Executing someone who converts from Islam to another religion would be considered 'terrorism', I believe. 33% of the young people in England ages 16-24 in this survey said it should be done. In this survey that was around 300 young people. Even if the number were 1%, that would be 100,000 terrorists.

Over 100,000 terrorists went through the camps in Afghanistan for "jihadi training" with al Qaeda in the 1990s before they were shut down.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

In this survey that was around 300 young people.

Can you show me where you found this 300 number?

I was looking for poll-specifics out of curiousity

 

[Winner]

It's time to see the real numbers and provide the real facts. Put up or shut up. It's go time. Let's roll. Cut to the chase. The buck stops here. Let's get busy. Heeeeere's Johnny!

PEW Global Attitude Project: The Great Divide: How Westerners and Muslims View Each Other

Few interesting graphs:



-> Denial



-> So about 20-30% of Pakistani population support terrorism


There are more interesting graphs in the PDF version.

 

[Rossiya]

Islamism

Is Islam actually known as "Islamism" in America, or are you just having a laugh?

 

[Irish Caesar]

The documentary Obsession gives a figure of 10 to 15 percent; I don't know where they got this figure.

 

[skadistic]

Is Islam actually known as "Islamism" in America, or are you just having a laugh?

Its a way differentiate between ordinary muslims and fanatical jihadist murdering terrorist scumin the name of allah.

 

[amadeus]

Is Islam actually known as "Islamism" in America, or are you just having a laugh?

I asked how many of the 1.3 billion adherents to Islam believe in Islamism.

 

[Pasi Nurminen]

Wait, Ronald McDonald Sharpe, aren't you the one who believes that the Middle East should be nuked or that Tehran should be carpet bombed because of the actions of an insignificant few without ties to any ME government?

And you're lecturing others on why supporting terror is bad? Maybe you should stop advocating terror first.

 

[Red Door]

PEW Global Attitude Project: The Great Divide: How Westerners and Muslims View Each Other

Few interesting graphs:



-> Denial



-> So about 20-30% of Pakistani population support terrorism


There are more interesting graphs in the PDF version.

Again, I'm sure they interviewed every Muslim out there.

 

[Phlegmak]

Over 100,000 terrorists went through the camps in Afghanistan for "jihadi training" with al Qaeda in the 1990s before they were shut down.

I'm not trying to target you, Katheryn. However, I've heard about these terrorist training camps many times in the news. When the Russians hear that term in American media, they can't help but laugh. Why? Because they say that there is no such thing as a terrorist training camp in Afghanistan.

Again, I'm sure they interviewed every Muslim out there.

Oh come on. You know polls are meant to be representative of the whole and don't necessarily accurately reflect the whole population.

 

[Princeps]

Again, I'm sure they interviewed every Muslim out there.

That's what wrong with many polls.

Method, place and time (etc) of the inquiry effects greatly.