Zegangani
King
- Joined
- Oct 9, 2020
- Messages
- 862
Not a real question, but would having an enormous amount of Wonders in the Game reduce their Uniqueness?
Sure, from the Graphics Perspective the more Wonders we have the merrier, but from the Gameplay Effects Perspective it would be a real challenge to come up with unique effects for each Wonder that are actually useful and good.
Anyway, I have some, probably, good (and bad) News for you Wonder Lovers and Mod users:
Good News: I recently got help from someone who helps me with making Models for some Game Assets for 4XP, but I also intend to make some myself too, which means we will also be making New World Wonders for Civ6 (also a Reason why it's taking longer than expected to finish the first Pack).
Bad News: Not really bad, but...; Eventhough Wonders don't add much to the Asset Limit (each counts as 1 Asset, Map Resources and Improvements have even more assets!), making a Wonder takes quite some Time (modeling, adding materials, and the process of importing it into the Game (this latter is very cumbersome and nerve wracking tbh)), which means there is a certain amount of Wonders we can make realistically in our free Time (till we lose interest in the Game or Civ7 is on the Horizon...etc). I just got to know that Wonders practically don't affect the asset limit at all, if I knew that before I would have started working on them much earlier, and now my Hands are mostly tied to coding
.
What that all means is that we have to decide which Wonders to make and which to dismiss, I've already decided for some that we will be working on, but there are a bunch of Wonder Slots that I wanted to leave the option to fill them to you.
I was trying to focus on Wonders in Continents/Regions that are underrepresented, like Africa and America, but I also want the Number of Wonders to be balanced in every Era (maybe less in early Game and very late Game). Although we have an overrepresented Europe and Asia (due to mods) in terms of Wonders, however doing some Research, I have to say that the other regions in the World can't compete much in terms of Wondrous Wonders (worth having in the Game) and their amount built with the ones in Europe and Asia. And in these latter Continents you will notice certain Countries/Regions offer way more Wonders than their Neighbours. Ex: Italy, Germany, Russia, England and Spain are the big Builders in Europe and China, India and Japan are the big Ones in Asia.
As a Reference here are the current Wonders in the Game (including modded ones):
- Europe: 18 Firaxis Wonders + 9 modded ones = 27
- Middle East*: 7 Firaxis Wonders + 1 modded = 8
- Asia: 9 Firaxis Wonders + 9 modded ones = 18
- Africa*: 7 Firaxis Wonders + 1 modded = 8
- North America: 4 Firaxis Wonders + 2 modded ones = 6
- Central & South America: 6 Firaxis Wonders + 1 modded = 7
- Oceania & Antarctic: 2 Firaxis Wonders.
* I'm counting Egypt Wonders into Africa here and not Middle East.
And here are the infos on how many Wonders are available in each Era:
- Ancient: 7 Firaxis Wonders + 7 modded ones = 10
- Classical: 12 Firaxis Wonders + 2 modded ones = 14
- Medieval: 10 Firaxis Wonders + 4 modded ones = 14
- Rennaissance: 8 Firaxis Wonders + 5 modded ones = 13
- Industrial: 8 Firaxis Wonders + 1 modded ones = 9
- Modern: 4 Firaxis Wonders + 4 modded ones = 4
- Atomic: 6 Firaxis Wonders + 2 modded ones = 6
- Information: 0 Firaxis Wonders + 1 modded ones = 1
You can clearly notice the lack of Wonders in the late Game, and Mid Game should also offer some more Wonders.
The Wonders I listed down here are all Wonders which are suggested by CivFanatis in a Thread and/or another, there were much more (ofc) but I sorted out all Wonders that I didn't found interesting or feel eager to make, so all these Wonders I'm interested in making them (excluding the Ones I've already chosen, like The Registan and Red Fort for example), and I will leave the Option of which One to you:
Note: I think you also should now that I try to choose Wonders that aren't very similar (like Forts, Castles, Pagodas, Churches, Cathedrals, Mosques...etc), and I also prefer to limit the amount of Wonders I pick from Wonder builder Civs/Countries/Regions. After each Region/Country Title there is "(n)" which indicates how much Wonders I want to pick from that part of the world.
- Northern Europe (1): Heddal Stave Church (Norway) - Swallow Nest/Palace in Kolomenskoe (Russia) - Trelleborg (Slagelse, Denmark)
- North-West Europe (1): The Crystal Palace (England) - skellig michael (Irland)
- Central & Western Europe(1): Belvedere (Vienna, Austria) - Atomium/Palais de Justice (Belgium) - Kölner Dom/Dresden Frauenkirche/Elbphilharmonie/Marktkirche, Wiesbaden (Germany) - CERN (Switzerland)
- Southern Europe (1): Acropolis of Athens/Palace of Knossos/ (Greece) - Pena Palace (Portugal) - The Giralda/Maestranza, Seville/El Escorial (Spain) - Circus Maximus/Doge's Palace/Pantheon, Rome/Sacra di San Michele (Italy)
- Africa(3): Serapeum of Alexandria/Karnak Temple Complex (Egypt) - Great Mosque of Djenne (Mali) - Chefchaouen/Hassan II Mosque/Hassan Tower (Morocco) - African Renaissance Monument (Senegal)
- Middle East (1): Atlantis The Palm/Palm Island (UAE) - Ishtar Gate/Nineveh/White Temple and Ziggurat of Uruk (Iraq) - Citadel of Aleppo/Umayyad Mosque (Syria) - Sana’a City/Marib Dam/Al Saleh Mosque (Yemen)
- Eastern Europe/Western Asia (1): Tatev Monastery (Armenia) - Svetitskhoveli Cathedral (Georgia) - Geghard/Monastery of Saint Thaddeus/Noravank - Holy Trinity Cathedral of Tbilisi (Georgia)
- Central Asia (1): Great Mosque of Herat (Afghanistan) - Hawa Mahal/Lotus Temple/Swaminarayan Akshardham (India) - Badshahi Mosque/Faisal Masjid (Pakistan)
- East Asia (2): Grand Lisboa/Wujin Lotus Conference Center/Summer Palace/Old Summer Palace (China) - Mozu Tombs/Byōdō-in/Osaka Castle/Himeji Castle (Japan) - Shwedagon Paya/Shwezigon Pagoda/Mandalay Palace/Kuthodaw Pagoda (Myanmar/Burma) - Gyeongbokgung (South Korea)
- Oceania(1): Great Mosque of Central Java (Indonesia) - Gardens by the Bay (Singapore) - Nan Madol (FS of Micronesia) - Puʻuhonua o Hōnaunau National Historical Park (Hawaii)
- North America (2): Château Frontenac/Centre Block (Canada) - El Capitolio (Cuba) - Palacio de Bellas Artes/Pyramid of the Sun (Mexico) - Brooklyn Bridge/Central Park/One World Trade Center/Walt Disney World/West Point (USA)
- Central & South America (2): Chan Chan/Caral/Moray, Inca ruin (Peru) - Kuhikugu (The Lost City of Z)/ Theatro Municipal, Rio de Janeiro (Brazil) - Las Lajas Shrine/Museo El Castillo (Colombia) - Tazumal (El Salvador) - Saint Peter and Paul Cathedral, Paramaribo (Suriname)
(**) The Wonders in Italique are my personal favourite ones.
I don't know if we can hold onto this - I won't call it Promise - Plan of releasing +20 Wonders by the end of 4XP, but we will do our best to achieve that. And to save some Time and effort, I think we won't make detailed Wonder Animations, but something like the Yellow Crane Tower Animation (Mod - Preview) would suffice I think (it's the completed Wonder that we want to stare at after all
). This way we might be able to make more Wonders.
You can suggest other Wonders if you want (I certainly haven't stumbled over every Wonder in the World), if you think that Wonder(s) is worth having in the Game. But, please Guys, don't suggest Buildings with the Brutal Modern Architecture
! I can only bear a few of them, and I've already chosen some, but for Gameplay Design purpuses rather than Aesthetics. Thanks!
Sure, from the Graphics Perspective the more Wonders we have the merrier, but from the Gameplay Effects Perspective it would be a real challenge to come up with unique effects for each Wonder that are actually useful and good.
Anyway, I have some, probably, good (and bad) News for you Wonder Lovers and Mod users:
Good News: I recently got help from someone who helps me with making Models for some Game Assets for 4XP, but I also intend to make some myself too, which means we will also be making New World Wonders for Civ6 (also a Reason why it's taking longer than expected to finish the first Pack).
Bad News: Not really bad, but...; Eventhough Wonders don't add much to the Asset Limit (each counts as 1 Asset, Map Resources and Improvements have even more assets!), making a Wonder takes quite some Time (modeling, adding materials, and the process of importing it into the Game (this latter is very cumbersome and nerve wracking tbh)), which means there is a certain amount of Wonders we can make realistically in our free Time (till we lose interest in the Game or Civ7 is on the Horizon...etc). I just got to know that Wonders practically don't affect the asset limit at all, if I knew that before I would have started working on them much earlier, and now my Hands are mostly tied to coding

What that all means is that we have to decide which Wonders to make and which to dismiss, I've already decided for some that we will be working on, but there are a bunch of Wonder Slots that I wanted to leave the option to fill them to you.
I was trying to focus on Wonders in Continents/Regions that are underrepresented, like Africa and America, but I also want the Number of Wonders to be balanced in every Era (maybe less in early Game and very late Game). Although we have an overrepresented Europe and Asia (due to mods) in terms of Wonders, however doing some Research, I have to say that the other regions in the World can't compete much in terms of Wondrous Wonders (worth having in the Game) and their amount built with the ones in Europe and Asia. And in these latter Continents you will notice certain Countries/Regions offer way more Wonders than their Neighbours. Ex: Italy, Germany, Russia, England and Spain are the big Builders in Europe and China, India and Japan are the big Ones in Asia.
As a Reference here are the current Wonders in the Game (including modded ones):
- Europe: 18 Firaxis Wonders + 9 modded ones = 27
- Middle East*: 7 Firaxis Wonders + 1 modded = 8
- Asia: 9 Firaxis Wonders + 9 modded ones = 18
- Africa*: 7 Firaxis Wonders + 1 modded = 8
- North America: 4 Firaxis Wonders + 2 modded ones = 6
- Central & South America: 6 Firaxis Wonders + 1 modded = 7
- Oceania & Antarctic: 2 Firaxis Wonders.
* I'm counting Egypt Wonders into Africa here and not Middle East.
And here are the infos on how many Wonders are available in each Era:
- Ancient: 7 Firaxis Wonders + 7 modded ones = 10
- Classical: 12 Firaxis Wonders + 2 modded ones = 14
- Medieval: 10 Firaxis Wonders + 4 modded ones = 14
- Rennaissance: 8 Firaxis Wonders + 5 modded ones = 13
- Industrial: 8 Firaxis Wonders + 1 modded ones = 9
- Modern: 4 Firaxis Wonders + 4 modded ones = 4
- Atomic: 6 Firaxis Wonders + 2 modded ones = 6
- Information: 0 Firaxis Wonders + 1 modded ones = 1
You can clearly notice the lack of Wonders in the late Game, and Mid Game should also offer some more Wonders.
The Wonders I listed down here are all Wonders which are suggested by CivFanatis in a Thread and/or another, there were much more (ofc) but I sorted out all Wonders that I didn't found interesting or feel eager to make, so all these Wonders I'm interested in making them (excluding the Ones I've already chosen, like The Registan and Red Fort for example), and I will leave the Option of which One to you:
Note: I think you also should now that I try to choose Wonders that aren't very similar (like Forts, Castles, Pagodas, Churches, Cathedrals, Mosques...etc), and I also prefer to limit the amount of Wonders I pick from Wonder builder Civs/Countries/Regions. After each Region/Country Title there is "(n)" which indicates how much Wonders I want to pick from that part of the world.
- Northern Europe (1): Heddal Stave Church (Norway) - Swallow Nest/Palace in Kolomenskoe (Russia) - Trelleborg (Slagelse, Denmark)
- North-West Europe (1): The Crystal Palace (England) - skellig michael (Irland)
- Central & Western Europe(1): Belvedere (Vienna, Austria) - Atomium/Palais de Justice (Belgium) - Kölner Dom/Dresden Frauenkirche/Elbphilharmonie/Marktkirche, Wiesbaden (Germany) - CERN (Switzerland)
- Southern Europe (1): Acropolis of Athens/Palace of Knossos/ (Greece) - Pena Palace (Portugal) - The Giralda/Maestranza, Seville/El Escorial (Spain) - Circus Maximus/Doge's Palace/Pantheon, Rome/Sacra di San Michele (Italy)
- Africa(3): Serapeum of Alexandria/Karnak Temple Complex (Egypt) - Great Mosque of Djenne (Mali) - Chefchaouen/Hassan II Mosque/Hassan Tower (Morocco) - African Renaissance Monument (Senegal)
- Middle East (1): Atlantis The Palm/Palm Island (UAE) - Ishtar Gate/Nineveh/White Temple and Ziggurat of Uruk (Iraq) - Citadel of Aleppo/Umayyad Mosque (Syria) - Sana’a City/Marib Dam/Al Saleh Mosque (Yemen)
- Eastern Europe/Western Asia (1): Tatev Monastery (Armenia) - Svetitskhoveli Cathedral (Georgia) - Geghard/Monastery of Saint Thaddeus/Noravank - Holy Trinity Cathedral of Tbilisi (Georgia)
- Central Asia (1): Great Mosque of Herat (Afghanistan) - Hawa Mahal/Lotus Temple/Swaminarayan Akshardham (India) - Badshahi Mosque/Faisal Masjid (Pakistan)
- East Asia (2): Grand Lisboa/Wujin Lotus Conference Center/Summer Palace/Old Summer Palace (China) - Mozu Tombs/Byōdō-in/Osaka Castle/Himeji Castle (Japan) - Shwedagon Paya/Shwezigon Pagoda/Mandalay Palace/Kuthodaw Pagoda (Myanmar/Burma) - Gyeongbokgung (South Korea)
- Oceania(1): Great Mosque of Central Java (Indonesia) - Gardens by the Bay (Singapore) - Nan Madol (FS of Micronesia) - Puʻuhonua o Hōnaunau National Historical Park (Hawaii)
- North America (2): Château Frontenac/Centre Block (Canada) - El Capitolio (Cuba) - Palacio de Bellas Artes/Pyramid of the Sun (Mexico) - Brooklyn Bridge/Central Park/One World Trade Center/Walt Disney World/West Point (USA)
- Central & South America (2): Chan Chan/Caral/Moray, Inca ruin (Peru) - Kuhikugu (The Lost City of Z)/ Theatro Municipal, Rio de Janeiro (Brazil) - Las Lajas Shrine/Museo El Castillo (Colombia) - Tazumal (El Salvador) - Saint Peter and Paul Cathedral, Paramaribo (Suriname)
(**) The Wonders in Italique are my personal favourite ones.
I don't know if we can hold onto this - I won't call it Promise - Plan of releasing +20 Wonders by the end of 4XP, but we will do our best to achieve that. And to save some Time and effort, I think we won't make detailed Wonder Animations, but something like the Yellow Crane Tower Animation (Mod - Preview) would suffice I think (it's the completed Wonder that we want to stare at after all

You can suggest other Wonders if you want (I certainly haven't stumbled over every Wonder in the World), if you think that Wonder(s) is worth having in the Game. But, please Guys, don't suggest Buildings with the Brutal Modern Architecture

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