How the hell do people win via culture; especially those T200> wins?

[Tre]

I might be missing something because i stopped playing this game for a while after GnK, but to my knowledge, I don't know what. I'm even playing on prince, so i'm gobbling up all the relevant wonders. My tourism is mediocre imo (50 at T200, maybe 150 T300) even though i'm making tons of Great works, assigning specialists, etc. And all of this doesn't even matter because there is always 1 civ who's culture makes my tourism look mediocre and my musicians won't do jack. The only thing i can imagine i'm missing is the themeing bonuses. Is there a guide on how themeing works? I'm crap at it and don't really understand how it works. Also how do i deal with the pesky culture civs? Do i bribe others to go to war with them or spam musicians like crazy? Which civ should i play for a basic culture victory?

 

[Browd]

Theming bonus is really easy. Go to any building with more than 1 GW slot and mouse hover over the +0 to the right of the building. The tooltip tells you what you need to get a theming bonus.

And you can trade with other civs (writing-for-writing, art-for-art, and artifact-for-artifact -- no music trading that I've been able to find) or you can conquer their cities and take their works.

 

[Buccaneer]

Make sure you really pay attention to the Civilization/City-State and Era of the Artifact. Also, spend some time moving stuff around your slots until you find the best bonuses. With certain multipliers, it may be worth removing a theme from one city just to load up another city. For example, I moved a writer out of my capital that was getting me +1 or +2 theming bonus into into a single slot in another city that gave me +4 tourism instead.

 

[maxp]

Also, if you can manage it

Open borders
Trade Routes
Common Religion
Same Ideology
Dipolmat

with the civs with the most culture

 

[maxp]

Read this guide:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=500824

 

[Tre]

perfect thanks for the link to the guide. My biggest concern is still how to handle those runaway culture civs. In my most recent game, it was brazil. I imagine i would've caught up, but by T450<. How do i handle these people?

 

[Petiscator]

perfect thanks for the link to the guide. My biggest concern is still how to handle those runaway culture civs. In my most recent game, it was brazil. I imagine i would've caught up, but by T450<. How do i handle these people?

You could take their cities! Or eliminate them, if you want.

 

[Magil]

You could take their cities! Or eliminate them, if you want.

Or pop a few Great Musicians on them.

 

[Roxlimn]

150 at turn 300 sounds low, even at Prince where you can't milk the AI for cash and beakers. Something's not right there. Theming is based on era and Civ. Museums award same continent Civ and same era or different Civ. The wonders have their own conditions for theming bonuses.

Get every tourism source you can. If you don't have a culture producing improvement, settle as many Great People as you can spare, then get Historical Landmarks and Hotels (Refrigeration tech). Speed up your GWAM rate. Put it into a food-heavy city, put every Guild in there, and boost it with Garden and National Epic. Get Avant Garde or Hero of the People, too.

Save your Musicians after the first few. Plan to have about 2 to bomb by the end (turn 300ish at the latest), then bomb the hell out of whichever Civ is still resistant. If that still doesn't work, finish off with International Games for +100% Tourism.

At Prince, the AI doesn't make enough culture to resist even a relatively unfocused tourism game much past turn 300.

 

[Petiscator]

150 at turn 300 sounds low, even at Prince where you can't milk the AI for cash and beakers. Something's not right there. Theming is based on era and Civ. Museums award same continent Civ and same era or different Civ. The wonders have their own conditions for theming bonuses.

Get every tourism source you can. If you don't have a culture producing improvement, settle as many Great People as you can spare, then get Historical Landmarks and Hotels (Refrigeration tech). Speed up your GWAM rate. Put it into a food-heavy city, put every Guild in there, and boost it with Garden and National Epic. Get Avant Garde or Hero of the People, too.

Save your Musicians after the first few. Plan to have about 2 to bomb by the end (turn 300ish at the latest), then bomb the hell out of whichever Civ is still resistant. If that still doesn't work, finish off with International Games for +100% Tourism.

At Prince, the AI doesn't make enough culture to resist even a relatively unfocused tourism game much past turn 300.

2 things I think are wrong:

-Museum's theming bonus: it doesn't have to be same continents. If you are Portugal, it is either 2 portuguese artifacts or 2 artifacts to someone else, on the other continent or on yours, could be from anyone besides you.

-Saving GM doesn't work. Their strenght is based on the tourism output of the turn they were created, unlike the GS.

 

[GoldenShadow]

I find I have too many artists/musicians/writers and not enough buildings to store great works. What's better, to use their other function now(like free golden age) or save them for when you finally get a building?

 

[ggmoyang]

Read this too: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=501996

 

[Vidszhite]

2 things I think are wrong:

-Museum's theming bonus: it doesn't have to be same continents. If you are Portugal, it is either 2 portuguese artifacts or 2 artifacts to someone else, on the other continent or on yours, could be from anyone besides you.

-Saving GM doesn't work. Their strenght is based on the tourism output of the turn they were created, unlike the GS.

-As long as it's from the same era and civilization, it can even be 1 art and 1 artifact and you'll still get the max theme bonus. "Hunnic Museum of the Renaissance." Of course, I was the Huns, so maybe that only works if it's yours.

-This is true. If you want to Tourism Bomb someone, never save your early Great Musicians, since they will only be worth around 100 tourism. Always great work the early ones and culture bomb with the late ones, since their power is 10 times the tourism you were generating on the turn they were created, with a lower limit of 100.

 

[Vidszhite]

I find I have too many artists/musicians/writers and not enough buildings to store great works. What's better, to use their other function now(like free golden age) or save them for when you finally get a building?

Depends.

Musicians: Save for great work. If you don't have a building, chances are you didn't have the tourism for their bomb to be worth much. Besides, if you get 3 and use them in the same era, you can put their music into Broadway for a nice fat theme bonus.

Writers: Use if the culture they give you would give you another social policy. Their bomb also helps defend against other cultures. Otherwise, save.

Artists: Use unless you are about to finish the Sistine Chapel or are waiting on faith for a Monastery. Great Art isn't necessary for a museum bonus, and easily the vast majority of your Museum tourism will come from artifacts, rather than art. So, Museums make Artists more useful, rather than the other way around.

 

[Heart Break Kid]

I'm gonna agree with using Great Artist. I had a lot of GA's lying around my first culture game, when in hindsight I should have just had perma-Golden Ages. The works I got from them were nice (it took me forever to find a building for them where Musicians and Writers I was putting their works up immediately) but I was pee'd when I noticed that artifacts basically did the same thing as art.

 

[chazzycat]

put artifacts in museums. art is for wonders.

for me it's all about hitting "peak tourism" of up to about 1,000 tourism per turn. that means basically hitting the Internet while the bonus from the international games are in effect. that requires good investment in science. and you have to have your hotels/airports and your slots filled of course.

then buy a couple musicians with faith while you're at that peak. couple concert tours on your #1 opponent and game over.

 

[werothegreat]

-Piety - grab a couple religious buildings in your religion (Cathedrals are best for this), then grab Sacred Sites as your Reformation belief. City spam to get lots of Tourism without any GWs.

-Aesthetics - lots of related Culture bonuses, and doubles your theming bonus as a finisher, as well as allowing you to purchase all GAs with Faith. A must. Also unlocks the Uffizi.

-Exploration - the opener and finisher are the best here - the Louvre is awesome, and being able to raid hidden sites no one else can see is awesome.

-Ideology - they all have Tourism bonuses, but Freedom is the best, with the 3rd level tenet that gives +34% Tourism in cities with a Broadcast Tower. Nab the CN tower and you're golden!

-Wonders: Obviously any of the ones with GW slots. Eiffel Tower directly gives 12 Tourism. Leaning Tower increases GP production in all cities, and gives you a free one.

-Guilds - Spread these out between three cities (preferably on a river or lake for a Garden) to even the Specialist load, and get them early. Don't save GAs unless you don't have a GW slot open - you want that Tourism pumping out as soon as possible. Until you're making at least triple digit Tourism, GMs should be turned into GWMs, and not sent on Concert Tours. An 11,000 Tourism bomb is much more useful than a 100 Tourism bomb.

-Science - Beeline for the wonders mentioned (on lower levels, GL->D&P->Parthenon is awesome). Once you're in the modern era, beeline for The Internet, which takes you through Hotels, Sydney Opera House, CN tower, and National Visitor's Center on the way. Once you have The Internet, double back for Radar and Airports.

-Archaeology - Whenever you have a city with decent Production with nothing that needs to be done *now*, pump out an Archaeologist. If the site is in your borders, make it a Landmark. Otherwise, take an Artifact. Go for ones outside your borders first, before other civs snatch them up, or they get sucked into their borders (massive diplo penalty for stealing artifacts). Be mindful of Museum theming bonuses when choosing!

-World Congress - If you can shove through a World Religion, do it. Otherwise, the proposals that gives extra culture to World Wonders and Specialist Improvements/Landmarks give lots of Culture fodder for your Hotels. Also, you obviously want Arts Funding. If World's Fair or International Games are up, make sure you get first place! +100% Culture is too powerful to allow an opponent to get, and +100% Tourism can make the game end much more quickly in your favor.

Remember to theme! Hover over to make sure you're getting the maximum bonus! Make sure your GWs are only in cities that have Hotels.

If you do all that as Brazil, you should win on Prince before the Modern era ends.

Best civs: Brazil, France, Polynesia

 

[RealHuhn]

I'm gonna agree with using Great Artist. I had a lot of GA's lying around my first culture game, when in hindsight I should have just had perma-Golden Ages. The works I got from them were nice (it took me forever to find a building for them where Musicians and Writers I was putting their works up immediately) but I was pee'd when I noticed that artifacts basically did the same thing as art.

You need 2 artists for the Louvre and 3 for the Hermitage. The rest can be burned though, I agree. Not sure about the Uffizi, I only built it once.

A good combination is burning a Great Writer at the end of a golden age. That way, the GW will give you 20% more culture. But I'm not sure I'd do that in a culture game because there are usually a lot of GW slots to fill.

Also keep in mind that finishing Aesthetics gives you double theming bonus. That's huge when you build a lot of wonders.

I'd say sub 200 wins are only possible on Pangea or other maps where all AIs can be met before astronomy. Tourism only influences civs that you already know.
+2 tourism per religious building is the best way to win as early as possible on those map types.

 

[Vidszhite]

perfect thanks for the link to the guide. My biggest concern is still how to handle those runaway culture civs. In my most recent game, it was brazil. I imagine i would've caught up, but by T450<. How do i handle these people?

Brazil is a cultural titan if you leave them alive, just like how Alexander is a Diplomatic titan who runs away with all the City-States. You may just have to conquer them.

 

[chazzycat]

Also keep in mind that finishing Aesthetics gives you double theming bonus. That's huge when you build a lot of wonders.

with France this is downright nasty. +16 for Louvre? not bad...sub 200 is probably not that hard, I won with them under 250 and I'm not particularly good.

But for most other civs I feel like a balanced science-based approach is a better overall strategy. If you're on a competitive level, getting the wonders can be hard anyway. You can expand instead at first, and not really focus on culture too hard other than getting the guilds going. As long as you get to archaelogy first so you can go take all the artifacts from neutral ground and city states, you can win. You just have to push through the tech tree quickly to hotels, airports, visitor center, and internet to get those multipliers. One thing about that strategy is if you're relying more on artifacts than wonders, you need more cities for museums. 6 or more cities is not a bad thing anymore for culture IMO.

The international games is not to be understated. The effect of doubling your output for 20 turns is pretty huge. You want to time this so you start receiving the bonus tourism around the time you build the national visitor center and research internet. You probably want to bulb/Oxford the last few techs. You don't necessarily need to win during the bonus period, but the idea is to hit your maximum tourism output during it. ie, finish all buildings, fill all slots, get all pertinent tenets, etc. Then, you spend all your faith on great musicians when you are at your absolute peak. Assuming open borders is an option, it's the easiest way to wipe out those defensive culture bars. Musicians with strength of 10,000 are no joke. That's the highest I've had so far (as Brazil).