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How the hell do you deal with Loyalty?

Discussion in 'Civ6 - Strategy & Tips' started by RoboEmperor, Jun 6, 2019.

  1. RoboEmperor

    RoboEmperor Chieftain

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    I wage war. In order to not be a genocider I keep cities. But before I conquer the nation all kept cities turn and then suddenly they're spawning an army equivalent to my tech and if I take one down another revolts in an endless circle.

    I find uranium in an unsettled area so I settle on top of it but my city revolts in the next 5 turns. All the governors and civic policies that boost loyalty still can't stop the city from revolting.

    A bunch of AI settles cities near my own and then my city revolts.

    so... how the **** do you deal with loyalty? Capturing cities without war is fine but making it an impossibility to have resource outposts or no-raze wars is not fine.
     
  2. megabearsfan

    megabearsfan Prince

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    You have to be very judicious about which cities you capture and in what order. Build / repair the Monument ASAP, send governors over to the captured cities, and run the Bread & Circuses project out of captured cities or bordering cities that you own and which have Entertainment Complexes. There's also a few civics that improve city loyalty. There's a military one (called "Limitati", I think) that adds loyalty for garrisoned units, and I think there's a diplo policy that grants additional loyalty for having a governor in the city. You can also use governor Amani with the Prestige promotion in you captured city or in a nearby city state. Being in a golden age will also help, since loyalty is boosted during golden ages. Loyalty is also penalized during dark ages, so avoid conquering during a dark age.

    You also lose loyalty for having grievances against the original city owner, and for occupying the city. You may need to end the war in order to neutralize those loyalty penalties and make the A.I. cede the cities to you.

    If all that fails, and there's still too much foreign pressure, then you need to settle some of your own cities closer to the target civ, and grow their population quickly, so that those cities will project some loyalty pressure.

    You might also consider trading away some of the captured cities to a neutral civ. I'm not sure if this would work because I don't recall if losses in loyalty are from a single foreign civ overwhelming your local loyalty, or if its accumulated foreign loyalty. If it's only the single civ's loyalty pressure that lowers your own, then if you can split up the foreign loyalty pressure between multiple different civs, then it might help make your loyalty stronger. I could be wrong about that, though, so definitely save your game before you try it.
     
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2019
  3. Bibor

    Bibor Doomsday Machine

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    I don't. I just raze cities I can’t keep. Yes, it adds grievances, but in a domination game I just don't care.

    If you want to prevent flips, your own cities within 9 hexes need to be BIG, as in high pop.

    OR

    Just keep going and recapture those independent cities later. Chances are, if you wipe a civ, that they'll flip to you eventually anyway.
     
  4. incroc

    incroc Chieftain

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    Not sure if it's always true, but in my games the free city always seem to make a builder if all the tiles are pillaged. Free steal when you come back.

    It's a bit tedious going back, but that's what I tend to do as well.
     
  5. m_mus

    m_mus Chieftain

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    yeah, as said above:

    -send govenors in (although they take 3-5 turns to be established, loyalty increases by 8 from next turn onwards.)
    -wage war in a golden age
    -wip out those cities you don't want anyways, so there'll be less cities putting loyalty pressure on your new acquisitions
    -have enough money to buy a monument ASAP.
    -have the right civics equipped
    -wipe out the opponent you are attacking.
    -some great generals, if I am not mistaken, and great admirals offer 2-4 loyalty per turn if activated in a city.
    ---> this really bothers me. If you leave your opponent alive, his former cities will suffer a loyalty malus because their former owner has grievances against you. Well ... the obvious solution is to finish him off, since their simple won't be a former owner around, who could have grievances against you. So the game kind of forces total wars of annihilation on you, although you might want only 1-2 cities and otherwise enjoy the company of other civs around you.
     
  6. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    @RoboEmperor I suspect war may not always be an option or desired.

    Bottom line is that since Risé and fall getting satellite cities for resources or luxuries or even to hold a key pass/ straight of water is not easy but can be done.

    I discuss the general strategy in my loyalty guide at the bottom of the post. It needs to be updated for the likes of Phoenicia and the Ottomans which can avoid the issue in other ways bet generally the guide discusses how.

    The key thing is to pump the population incredibly fast. Once you get to 5 population things get a lot better, you may need other things but 5 pop or more is the biggest. You get there by chopping cows, wheat, rice and fish. Chop them in with Magnus for more pumping. Trade routes can also quickly help so having a city with a campus, theatre and holy site for a +4 trade route and multiply that by how many traders you can get quickly(plannning) can also help a lot as can buying a water mill and granary.

    Also to push the loyalty fast

    Buy a monument
    Place a governor
    Place a second city near it also pumped with victor, these cities support each other.
    There is roughly +4 loyalty in cards you can use, more depending on when and who but +4 is normal.
    Being happy or ecstatic, so local amenities via cards and Cahokia mounds
    If you founded a religion, convert the city ASAP and keep a inquisitor inside.
    There are the odd other way like great admirals, harbors as England
    Make sure the city has enough food as starvation is a big negative.

    It can be done, you just need to work for it.:thumbsup:
     
  7. Casualty of war

    Casualty of war Warlord

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    Even a feeble Warrior fortified in there can help the city's Loyalty, more if you have the card slotted for +2 Loyalty; buy a cheap unit to hold down the fort. I like to keep a Trader on deck and build a route back to my homeland for the Loyalty and road for reinforcements. You can pick off small cities near your borders but small cities deep within enemy territory will flip Free in a blink; sometimes you have to attack the larger cities first.

    Or play Sulieman. No Loyalty problems there.
     
  8. Leucarum

    Leucarum Prince

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    Another possibility if you are being peaceful with someone is to form a cultural alliance. That will mean neither of you exert loyalty pressure on each other. It can give you enough time to grow a sattelite colony/a couple of cities at resources you need which are near the ally...

    Just make sure to grow the city (or cities) sufficiently, convert them to your religion, keep pops happy, slot in governors, garrison units etc so that you're ready for when your alliance expires.
     
  9. Troy Bruckner

    Troy Bruckner Prince

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    Also chop something to get your population up. The higher the population the better to stop revolts. Size 1 cities deep in enemy territory will revolt in 3 turns regardless of what you do.
     
  10. RoboEmperor

    RoboEmperor Chieftain

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    Loyalty is such bs. I don't realy mind the flipping part but what I do mind is the goddamn tech gap closing. I'm the one who spent so hard creating the tech gap so why do the newly captured and revolting cities also field my level tech?

    Thanks for your suggestions everyone. I did not know garrisoned units created such huge amount of loyalty. Thanks.
     
  11. Troy Bruckner

    Troy Bruckner Prince

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    I have lost control of sections of map because I captured a city right after getting mechanized infantry tech. Since then I will bypass upgraded unit tech when capturing cities if I don't need it.
     
  12. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    Perhaps you missed that bit but it is the most important because it reduces the -20 directly
     
  13. NotThatOneGuy

    NotThatOneGuy Chieftain

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    In addition to the tips about maintaining loyalty with garrisons, governors, high population, etc; I also like taking cities and trading them away to that Civ's weaker enemy if you don't actually care about the city (assuming they have cities nearby). You get lots of resources in the trade and buff their enemy directly so you hopefully won't have to worry about trimming that Civ down again for the rest of the game.

    For distant resources, there's really nothing that can be done besides taking an AI city with very high population relative to its neighbors + loading it up with loyalty civics/garrison/governor and hoping for the best.

    You should play a game or two with Eleanor of Aquitaine. She specializes in flipping cities. It's a fun mechanic once you learn how it works.
     
  14. seanos08

    seanos08 Monarch

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    Having Audience Chamber as your tier 1 government plaza building gives + amenity and housing in cities with governors but -2 loyalty for cities without governors.

    As a pretty peaceful builder I like that bonus.
     

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