How to alter the Hitpoints of the Units

[Proteus]

Some people asked for a Step by Step Instruction for modifying the HP-Values via the Civ3Editor.
So, for all those interested, here it is


1. After starting Civ3Edit goto "Extras" and deactivate "Use Standard Rules"

2. Goto Rules and choose "Edit Rules". Now a Window should pop up, in which you can alter all different kinds of Game Settings.

3. Choose Combat Experience. Here you can change the Hitpoints for the different Experience Levels (Max = 20).
If you for example wish to multiply all Hitpoint-Valuzes by three it would be: Conscript=6, Regular=9, Veteran=12 and Elite=15

4. After changing the Hitpoints you should also alter the Firerate of your Bombarding-Units (i.e. Artillery-Units, Ships, Cruise Missiles and Planes) by the appropriate Multiplyer.
Go to Units and choose the different Units to modify.
(unless you really want those Units to become less powerful, that is )

6. Save your .bic-File to the Civ3 - Folder. Choose any Name, but not Civ3Mod.bic

7. Rename your original Civ3Mod.bic (for example to Civ3ModOLD.bic). You may need it later.

8. Rename your altered .bic-File to Civ3Mod.bic

Now your Game should start with the altered Rules.

If there are any new official Patches rename the old .bic-File (Civ3ModOLD.bic) to Civ3Mod.bic cause the Patch will only change the unmodified Original Civ3Mod.bic.
After the Patchhas been applied just start the Editor and repeat the above mentioned Steps, to get your modified HP-Values to work again (And don´t foprget to repeat Step 7 [Backup of the original .bic] also)

 

[Proteus]

Ive also changed the Firerate and Bombard-Value of Units with Ranged Weapons, such as Archers, Musketeers and the like.
It appeared only logic to me, that If for example a Pikeman defends a tile in which there is also an Archer-Unit, the Archer Unit would atack the advancing enemy with Arrows, til the enemy unit would be in Range to engage in Close-Combat with the Pikemen.
This Values reflect just this case. If a Unit defends a tile, in which there is also a Ranged-Attack-Unit, the Ranged Atack Unit gets [Firerate] free Shots, before the enemy engages in Melee with the Defender.

How do I change the Values?
To change the Firerate and Bombard-Value choose the Units-Tab in the Editor.

This are the Values I´ve given the Units:

Archer: Bombard=2 Firerate=2
Longbowman: Bombard=3 Firerate=3
Musketman: Bombard=4 Firerate=1
Rifleman: Bombard=4 Firerate=2
Cavalry: Bombard=3 Firerate=2
Infantry: Bombard=6 Firerate=3
Tank: Bombard=8 Firerate=2
Mech Infantry: Bombard=10 Firerate=3
Modern Armor: Bombard=12 Firerate=3
Caravel: Bombard=2 Firerate=1 (Hey, those Ships had Ranged-Weapons [Cannons] too )
Galleon: Bombard=2 Firerate=2 [Galleons just have more Cannons ]
Transport: Bombard=2 Firerate=1 [Only Small Arms on those Ships AFAIK]
Carrier: Bombard=4 Firerate=2 [I am not sure about this]
Bowman: Bombard=2 Firerate=2
Musketeer: Bombard=4 Firerate=1
Panzer: Bombard=8 Firerate=2

Maybe those Values appear not balanced enough. But it´s just a first try. Maybe I change one Value or another, as I gather Experience.

btw.
remember thta those Changes work in connection with the changed Hitpoints. If you haven´t changed the Hitpoints the Firerates may be far too high

 

[LayZMan]

When you say "bombard" I'm assuming bombard strenght. I figure this might be worth trying (sound interesting, and logical for some units, esp tanks) what are the rage values?

PS-Not sure about carriers given bombard properties, they should just have an escort, but I'm not a military buff.

 

[Proteus]

Originally posted by LayZMan
what are the range values?

I´ve give them all a Range-Value of 0, cause even Artillery-Units (like Catapults, Cannons etc.) have only Ranges of 1 or 2 (maybe the Range of the Tanks/Armor-Units could be altered to 1, cause they pretty sure have at least the same range as Catapults or Cannons, but i haven´t implemented it yet).

 

[royfurr]

Proteus,
Just saw this thread, and I LIKE IT. Seems like the combo of increasing hit points and giving a zero range bombardment factor and multiple firerate (set appropriately) should "fix" the crazy results syndrome of the combat system, ancient vs modern, tech gap, etc etc.

Personally, I'm a fairly conservative person prefering to make as small a change in things as possible, (that produces the desired results), to hopefully minimize any possible "un-intended consequences" fallout. Things are so interelated in Civ that its like an ecology- changes tend to ripple out effecting everything around them. EG throwing off the economics- making a unit more powerful should increase its cost? maybe yes maybe no? (not meant as a serious question, just an example of why minimising changes IMHO is desirable, as a general thing). SO, what I wanted to know, is how are these changes working for you and have you gotten feedback from others?

EG, if it worked to "fix" the crazy results aspect of the combat system, (still allowing for "1/1000000 chances"- after all war IS the kingdom of bizarness - its just bizarness happing 3 times in 6 several times per turn is what is crazy) then I would perfer to double hit points rather then triple them and proportional changes in the other factors. I had personally considered changing hit points by a slight add on for conscripts and a twices as big add-on for the other units (eg +1 and +2 for all the others).

So your changes are bigger then I've complmented, how have they worked? Any "unintended conseqjuences"? What have people trying it out commented about it?

BTW I think your carrier changes could be best toned down, most CV's had very very little "bombardment" type weaponery, some had none at all. I think they should only have ecough to JUST protect against galleys and frigates and ironclads. Of course, could be those values do that. I don't have a game running right now thats in the modern era, so I can't immediatley test that out. IF ships could fight against air units that would be different maybe. DOES this bombardment attack effect attacking air? Wouldn't THINK so but ....

(The entire AIR/NAVAL thing needs major surgery by Firaxis. I will not even start on that one, it'd make this WAY to long!)

ANYWAY REAL good thinking! And nice of you to do the tutorial, some folks are, I am sure, a little iniminated by the idea of editing the game, and many definitely might not understand about backing up and restoring the .bic file, ESPECIALLY before running the patch. VERY GOOD WORK!

Please post some "after action report" on how the changes are working for you and what others have reported back to you!!!

 

[Dark Sheer]

No worries about the effect. I have long implemented the bombardment abilities for tanks and modern armor and they work great! Of course the only problem here is whenever you try to attack a city or a stack with one of those unit inside you get bombarded

I notice how the AI handle the special abilities :

1) Attack
2) Defense
3) Others (Terraform, bombardment etc)

Thats the sequence how AI looks at them. If a unit can do three things, say Attack, Defense and Terraform, Attack will come first if there is a war

 

[Wolfshanze]

Okay... I've heard of the "hitpoints/bombard/firerate" fixes before to help with the odd combat results...

But what's the deal with "non-traditional" units getting bombard factors and setting them to range "0"?

For example... a catapult can bombard at range-1

What is the effect of giving a tank a bombard value at range-0.

What does that do?

How does it effect the game? Can a tank (or any unit) with a bombard range-0 "pre-bombard" a city like a catapult or canon? What is the purpose in giving any unit a range-0 bombard factor? Why should you do it?

I ask, because I'm trying to understand the reason and effect/desired effect of doing this to units that otherwise have no bombard value at all (to be honest, I already added bombard values to Galleons in the Fascist patch for obvious reasons).

 

[Moulton]

Looks good... I sunk a Frigate with my battleship covering my carrier.. and discovered a transport under it... (Of course I could have looked, but had not) So I decided, well use the carrier's 1 attack point to sink this defenseless transport, lest it escape. I was rather surprised when they sunk my Carrier... and not too pleased, BTW.
I just wish there were a way to increase the hit points of modern units, leavaing the ancient ones alone.

 

[Proteus]

Originally posted by Wolfshanze
Okay... I've heard of the "hitpoints/bombard/firerate" fixes before to help with the odd combat results...

But what's the deal with "non-traditional" units getting bombard factors and setting them to range "0"?

For example... a catapult can bombard at range-1

What is the effect of giving a tank a bombard value at range-0.

What does that do?

How does it effect the game? Can a tank (or any unit) with a bombard range-0 "pre-bombard" a city like a catapult or canon? What is the purpose in giving any unit a range-0 bombard factor? Why should you do it?

I ask, because I'm trying to understand the reason and effect/desired effect of doing this to units that otherwise have no bombard value at all (to be honest, I already added bombard values to Galleons in the Fascist patch for obvious reasons).

Nope, those Tank-Units still can´t prebombard their Targets before they Attack (I had hoped, they could make one Bombard Attack before getting into Close Combat, but such things obviously aren´t implemented into the Game).
But it works for Defensive Purposes. Just imagine Knights charging a Row of Pikemen which is supported by Archers. The old System had Archers function in a sole Offensive Way, with high Attack Value and low Defense. If you add a Bombard Value they are now able to support other Defenders in the same tile. In the case of Knights attacking Pikemen supported by Archers the Knights would first get bombarded by Archers (i.e. they would lose 1-2 HPs if the Bombardment succeeds) before they get into Close Range to attack the Pikemen.

 

[Dark Sheer]

Well, actually a tank/armor or any unit can pre-bomb a tile before attack. In order to do this you must do the following:

1) Let the unit has bombardment strenght.
2) Let the unit has blizt ability
3) Let the unit has more than 1 movement (take tank for example)

If the above is done, the tank will take 1 move to do the bombardment and the next move to attack the weaken unit