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How to beat Deity on Standard speed?

Discussion in 'Strategy Section' started by Minh Le, Jan 9, 2019.

  1. Minh Le

    Minh Le Chieftain

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    Hi guys.
    I've been trying to play on Standard game speed lately and get my ass kicked hard by AI.
    There are several aspect I cant keep up with them:
    - Tech level: AI on Standard seems to advance in tech very quickly, I was always behind by 4 to 5 techs and there was always a civ that run away very far ahead.
    - The wonder race: there are wonders Im very confident to get on Epic which gone very early on Standard.
    - The unit replenishment: It seemed that I wasnt able to kill the AI units fast enough, even if I prepared very carefully for the war. The AI always had some troops left and the war dragged for too long, until they have more advanced unit and pushed me back...
    - Religion: Yeah... Unless I played a civ with faith bonus, I cant found at all, and capturing a holy city is not an easy task...
    I know there are a lot of more experienced players here who can easily beat Deity on Standard. Can you share some tips for doing so? Its funny that I can beat Deity very comfortably on Epic but Standard is too hard.
     
  2. CrazyG

    CrazyG Warlord

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    Can you win peacefully on epic? It seems to me the biggest difference would be military.
     
  3. Leondegrance

    Leondegrance Chieftain

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    I will tell you one strategy and leave to you to evaluate effectiveness.

    It is similar to OCC. Maybe two cities if you see a nice terrain for the second city.

    Basically you prepare for early war. Your biggest issue is unit cap so it pays off to launch the attack when your units are promoted and advanced in technology.

    The ultimate idea is to vassalize your neighbours one by one.

    A well timed early war will bring your neighbour to the knees. If you draw into the war the neighbour next to your neighbour, task gets easier. Raze their cities to bring them to vassal capitulation early. Do not, I repeat, do not take their capitals. You need strong vassals, not to beat then to dust.

    When does this work ? When you have good rng to have iron and horse early around the capital. Why is it a strategy ? Because with one strong capital you can dedicate to war plan and build advanced building to support it, enjoy high happiness.

    To keep up with cities, have settler on the ready waiting to settle on top of razed cities.

    When to launch first attack ? Preferably await your neighbour to get into conflict. But more importantly start offensive after building armory building. Rush war technoligies early rather than civic or wonder or religion. OCC may be challenging, but with two strong cities should become clean job.

    Essentially the idea is to get the buffed AI on your side rather than brute-forcing the race peacefully. Tough job to outrace the buffed AI, but you can conquer it and use its buffs to work for you.
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2019
  4. Minh Le

    Minh Le Chieftain

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    Yeah I can win peacefully on epic without much problem. Standard is much more challenging.
     
  5. CrazyG

    CrazyG Warlord

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    Based on your description so far, I would try the following~

    Play a civ who is good with progress and has good early game (to help with religion). Try to play mostly peacefully.
    You shouldn't need any early game wonders.
    You should be able to swing the tech to at least somewhat even by medieval era.
    If you need to fight, focus on having the most up to date units available. Sometimes in order to grind through, you need to upgrade some of your units.
     
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  6. Leondegrance

    Leondegrance Chieftain

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    If you just care to win, follow my strategy. Total war.

    If you want to win peacefully with style on deity, then good luck. Maybe possible but I am not proficient at pure peaceful deity.

    I just tried another approach and it is just too powerful. Maybe will be boring to you. Spammed 4 quick desert cities, chose Authority full tree. Rushed military technology and prepared for war for immediately when Medieval unlocks. Got the armories and castles and raised my unit cap to 22.

    No luck for horses, but had lots of iron. Unstoppable, Harun - vassal, Isabel - vassal, Alexander - vassal. I am surrounded by vassals literally.

    Now with all my sides protected by vassals I can take my army to far away without worry. Maybe I will go to harass my vassal's neighbours now. Maybe I will make them vassal too. Why not ?
     
  7. Minh Le

    Minh Le Chieftain

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    Thanks for the advices.
    Seriously, did you ever play the game?
     
  8. Leondegrance

    Leondegrance Chieftain

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    If you did not appreciate my strategy then I will no longer tell you about powerful strategies.
     
  9. Minh Le

    Minh Le Chieftain

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    Yes, please! I didnt mean to offend you but what you said doesnt make any sense. I am a person who spend more than a couple of thousands of hours into the game and I can tell who is making advices.
     
    Owlbebach likes this.
  10. Leondegrance

    Leondegrance Chieftain

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    Did you not read my post ? Don't you play monger strategies ?

    Let me try explain sense to you now since you said made no sense to you.

    You playing deity. What is the most important thing to know about deity ? It is the buffed AI. How do you address buffed AI ?

    Here is how I do - I conquer the AI and make him vassal. Now his buffs work for me. For example, Harun is one of my vassal, I left him his capital plus one more city. Do you know how much money he makes per turn ? Tons. Because he is buffed. And I levy with tax his money. Guess what, I receive more money from him than I can make myself. Because he is buffed in Deity. I receive 80 gold per turn from him. Plus culture, plus science. I use his strength against him, his buff in my favor.

    Furthermore, I gave him one of my own cities, one of my original Moroccan cities. Just a gift. Because he will make more money out if it than me due to the buffs. And I will reap the benefit.

    Similar with Isabel and Alexander. And they provide protection. You should try more monger strategy like this.
     
  11. Minh Le

    Minh Le Chieftain

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    Did you ever play a deity game?
     
  12. Leondegrance

    Leondegrance Chieftain

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  13. Rekk

    Rekk Chieftain

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    Instead of asking him this question, tell him why you think he's wrong.
     
  14. Minh Le

    Minh Le Chieftain

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    Well basically everything he said is wrong. A common knowledge on deity is that you cant 'conquer' an AI if youre weaker than it. Also for warmongering, the longer you wait, the harder you do it.
    Picking authority and waiting to medieval to wage war is ridiculous. It is like playing without a policy. And you just dont win deity with that level of competency.
    What I need is advices of an experienced player, like CrazyG, not some...ummm internet boys pretending to know it all?
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2019
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  15. CrazyG

    CrazyG Warlord

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    I can't understand what he is saying very clearly. Does he mean he always goes 100% warmonger and get vassals? If it is, I really disagree with the approach.(building castles for unit supply? why?). Heavy warmonger can work, but its not the only way to win. His "advice" does suggest that winning peacefully on Deity isn't possible, which has been clearly refuted.

    Futhermore, I think Minh Le's question is about how to win wars, and why would he be losing wars on standard that he wins on epic. I think the answer comes down to grinding. On epic, you can win wars just by being a human against an AI. On faster speeds, even if you move the units perfectly, sometimes you jut can't grind out the AI. You need other advantages such as timing the war with the unlock of a new unit. If in AI gets really far ahead in tech and culture, and you try to beat him by getting key wonders, you'll lose. On the other hand, if he is teching for the Sistene Chapel, but you tech for curaissers and get a well-time attack off, you can win. Often AI races for Biology or other techs in that area, even at a 5 or 6 tech disadvantage you can have a weapon he or she doesn't.
     
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  16. Minh Le

    Minh Le Chieftain

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    Yes, that's it. I think I planned my attack not very well, but even with an advantage, it seemed that I couldnt maintain it for long enough to win war. Or I couldnt win fast enough on standard. Do you plan for multiple fronts attack or break through at one front? As for my games, if I focus on military techs then I always falling very far behind in Renaissance because Im not very successful with war. If Im not focus on military techs then I should play a peaceful game. I think it depends on how you can take advantage of your civ power spike and snowball from there. If you fail to do so then it will be gameover.
     
  17. Leondegrance

    Leondegrance Chieftain

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    Castles give + 10% pop unit supply. That's why.

    No I don't play monger always. I like playing "peacefully" too, for wonders and civics, religion, culture, you name it. But I play these on lower difficulty because as he said in his post....you will get beaten to those races. And he is right about one thing there indeed.

    I see what his distrustful issue is. He is fixed by the Tradition and Progress openers, and completely unaware of the Authority strategy. He even calls Authority "a no policy".
     
  18. Minh Le

    Minh Le Chieftain

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    You picked an ancient policy tree which gives yield on killing units and taking city and wait until medieval to do so? :) 10% supply from population gives you like 1 more supply per 20 pop? Castle is for defend, I dont even build them if Im on the offensive and even on defensive I only build it in maybe one or two border cities (I only build it everywhere if I pick fealty but it was because of the food and happiness)... It was actually the opposite of what you said. I CAN win deity standard peacefully (only 50% though) but I CAN'T win by warmongering (which is a peace of cake on Epic with any civs).
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2019
  19. Leondegrance

    Leondegrance Chieftain

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    If you react with mistrust to monger advise like you did, then it is no surprise to me you can't win monger strategy.
     
  20. Minh Le

    Minh Le Chieftain

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    But what you said is a wrong way to play as the warmonger, not a strategy. And Im tired of correcting you, so I give up, you win, Im the stubborn noob who doesnt listen. Happy? :)
     
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