How to get rid of your vassal!

[EquinoxOmega]

I've a problem. A long time ago I've accepted a vassal but now I don't want him anylonger. Half of his territory is surrounded by my territory and most of the rest is extended along my border. I want to expand my empire in this direction defeat an other civ that lives on the other side of my vassal.
So, how can I get rid of him? As a master you can't cancle the treaty, I've already tried to ask really everything from him, but he didn't even get angry. What can I do?

 

[Bostock]

It's very difficult.

Essentially, you can let him become very small (after a certain threshold, he can break free, to simulate him being sick of your lack of protection) or very big (blah blah to simulate feeling confident he no longer needs to be in your shadow). I'll leave the exact numbers to someone else.

The "very small" condition is perhaps easier to meet - bring him into a war where he can be attacked, and then don't defend him.

 

[Jaaboo]

Yeah, pick a fight, let the AI take his cities and then you take them back and convieniently "forget" to liberate them.

 

[blitzkrieg1980]

Worldbuilder.... j/k

Who's got 2 thumbs and acts like a jackass? This guy! ... That joke doesn't work that well over the net.

Back to reality. I suggest warring with the other civ anyway. Take his lands and build theaters/libraries/temples in those cities as well as spreading your state religion to them. Unless the newly captured cities are close to your vassal's, you shouldn't have too much trouble keeping the BFC or at the very least most of the BFC. Don't forget that since 3.17 (IIRC) unless the city is in revolt, vassals do not encroach on your BFC.

 

[EquinoxOmega]

well, that might be an idea
my vassal isn't very advance and I could give the other AI who lives on the other side of my vassal some modern(but not the best) technology and declare war on him afterwards(I intend to do anyway, because I longing for some part of his territory). Let him conquer some parts of my vassal until he breaks away and then I lauch my attac, first on the vassal and then on the other enemy.

This plan leaves me with another problem. The vassal I want to get rid off, isn't my only vassal, I've 3 others, which might help the one vassal I want to conquer. A possibility would be to pick an other fight, with a small AI somewhere far away on the world and ask my vassals to send their troops there, but 3 wars at the same time are a bit risky.

 

[blitzkrieg1980]

This plan leaves me with another problem. The vassal I want to get rid off, isn't my only vassal, I've 3 others, which might help the one vassal I want to conquer.

Sounds like your well on your way to a conquest victory (if Domination doesn't trigger first). I wouldn't worry about investing time/resources into getting rid of that vassal. Just keep pushing on taking more capitulates until domination triggers or you have everyone under ur thumb.

 

[JTMacc99]

I've a problem. A long time ago I've accepted a vassal but now I don't want him any longer...What can I do?

What I did when this happened to me was make a mental note to never take a vassal without being REALLY sure I was going to be okay with a vassal for life. In my case, I also had to go like a bat out of hell to win a domination victory, because my friendly vassal was doing a really good job of moving towards a cultural victory. (Later, through these forums I learned how to use spies to mess around with a vassal in a case like that, but the real solution was to not take a vassal that still has a good chance of preventing you from winning.)

 

[6K Man]

Yeah, the moral of the story is, be really sure you want someone as a vassal before taking them on as one. Most (all?) of the ways to get rid of vassals have been detailed above, and none of them are particularly easy or pleasant.

Vassals are great if you are trying for a quick domination win, or have gone conquering on another continent and already built the FP/Versailles. In some cases, the bonus in your core cities will be quite helpful, and some vassals will research for you or fight decently on your behalf.

Unfortunately, more often, I find vassals lead to:
- crippling motherland unhappiness in captured cities
- worsened relations with other AIs, wrecking diplomacy
- cultural pressure in border cities necessitating big garrisons
- large gaps in my defences taken up by vassal cities
- micromanagement of vassal activities, in order to avoid cultural/space victories by vassal
- vassal gifting/trading techs to unfriendly AIs.

So now, I seldom take vassals unless in extremis.

 

[rilke]

Firaxis ought to include a unit called the Vet that lets you put your vassal to sleep (for a large sum). There should probably be some penalty as well, or maybe some restriction as well as the $.

 

[Spectator20]

I've only lost vassals by liberating a colony which counted as declaring war on the vassals and a few of the other civs. Supposedly that bug is fixed now in newer versions.