How to go on from here, Ragnar? (Immortal, Archipelago)

[DanielTorrence]

For a change, I thought about trying a water map on Immortal with Ragnar. For some reason I like this character, I thing I won my first game with him, following TMITs strategy in his youtube video. However, this time I am kind of lost here, and I reloaded a couple of times to optimise my play. Still, advice is greatly appreciated.

This is the (average?) start:

I don't like not having fresh water in the capital and I could really have something else but incense as a bonus resource.


What I did was:

Spoiler :

I settled in place to have more hammers - questionable, but since I wanted to build GL, I opted against moving. My scout found Hatty north east and her second city ruined my expansion plus I failed GL several times when I try build a worker myself, so I started a war, stole a couple of workers, first one on the rice, and expanded a little while keeping her away from her unique unit. The warrior in the far east tries to prevent her from settling the horse spot that I luckily discovered with my first scout.

Tech path was AH->Mining->BW->Sailing->Wheel->Masonery->Mysticism->Writing

View attachment 320991

In one attempt (not the one with the saves) I tried a chariot rush, which ended in a blood bath and a lost GL. Only metal is iron (in the capitals BFC, so not moving was okay), but no sword rush with so poor commerce(?)

The second save is right after I finished GL, unfortunatly something (the barb city???) is blocking my trade routes so I don't get any real benefit from it. Still, I have two woodsman II guys, as you can see - haven't build a single worker myself, never thought this makes such a difference.
View attachment 320992

The two wounded warriors are the ones...Unfortunatly I lost one later to two suicide archers.

The third save: I played on a bit and expanded, but research still sucks due to blocked trade routes and Hatty build walls and scaring lot of archers, I even lost some chariots in the open field. My trade routes are still blocked somehow

View attachment 320993


The land is a little more developed now and I have five cities - with some potential, I think.

Hattys worker 1SW of the marble is improving her iron! I handled that with the two chariots I am about to build. Still, an uncomforting situation.

So, I would like to sweep Hatty from my continent asap now, but how? She has tons of archers behind walls, I have no metal yet and I am not sure how long I can keep here away from her war chariots and/or the iron in her second city. Nobody has alpha yet, should I go for it and trade for IW? Go for wonders with the marble? Or just expand like HRE?Thanks for your advice...

 

[ahcos]

That's a terrible situation you're in, indeed ... there's no cityspot near your cap for a second city, the cap itself is rather terrible and also the way the land presents itself it's hard to do anything military...

Looks to me that it's one of these maps that are very hard first time you play them without any knowledge. That said, looks to me like growing the cap on watertiles and insta-beeline IW is the way to go here - or AH -> HBR. OTOH Hatty's one of those leaders where a charriot rush can work even on Immortal.

Other than that, maybe just keep playing that save? You'll get 6 cities and Hatty's very forgiving, it's not like she'll cause you trouble after you make peace. You can go after her later when your econ's back in shape.

 

[DanielTorrence]

Other than that, maybe just keep playing that save? You'll get 6 cities and Hatty's very forgiving, it's not like she'll cause you trouble after you make peace. You can go after her later when your econ's back in shape.

I am a little bit scared of her cultural pressure. Played on until 720 A.D., I don't have a tech lead despite GL and nine cities and I am not sure what to do best here.

PS: Civ IV is so terrible, one just can't stop hitting next turn

 

[BornInCantaloup]

Whow, it takes some courage to play that kind of start...


CR swords have favourable odds vs CG archers with 50% cultural defenses. Taking out Hatty with swords alone seems feasable. Expect to lose 2 every 3 archers, I guess.
You can try to attract some archers out of her cities as well. Just step back with your units ('xcept near that Iron tile) and see what happens.
If you want to delay this, it is conceivable to kill Hatty after you've built the Heroic Epic. It will lighten the military investment.
You don't have traderoutes with France, yet. And there still are 2 unknown civs. Get another exploring ship asap to scout past Monty.

Research trade baits.
Compass would shine. Either bulbed or hard researched. Get ready for some other bulbs, maybe ?
Aesthetics is fine seeing how you could get a (quasi-) monopoly on Drama and how it unlocks both Epics.

Good luck

 

[Htadus]

Personally, I would not have played this game if I generated the map for not having fresh water in the capital.

However in regards to the game, I agree with what BIC said above except, expect to loose 1 sword per archer in city It only become worst if she buiild axes.

If taking Hatty out is a priority, you should focus on Construction.

If you want to catch us with techs, then while Aesthetics is good, CoL is better. One AI may learn it and all others will ignore it. Then you do not have to waste couple of turns learning Alpha for trade. Also learning Aesthetics after wards will give you a monoply path to Literature and GLib.