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How to play PRINCE

Discussion in 'Civ4 - General Discussions' started by Tekee, Oct 3, 2006.

  1. Tekee

    Tekee Bahama Mama

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    Hi!
    Ok I am trying to make the JUmp from NOBle, (too easy) and Prince (too hard)
    I usually always be second worst and I only won one game, as the Vikings, killed Japan and won by Space Race

    But every toher game do I quit to early? I usually quit at around 1000 AD and don't go further becuase I feel I am so far behind, even if I recently conquered my neighbour, I am still behind in points

    And I do't understand an AXemen rush, everytime I make an army of about 6 axemen I always lose even their Capital is 14 spaces away.

    Anyways can anyone tell me how to get Over the learning curve?
     
  2. synthboy

    synthboy Prince

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  3. Sisiutil

    Sisiutil All Leader Challenger

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    A good suggestion above.

    Beyond that, don't get intimidated if you're behind in score. This is pretty normal on the higher levels. You will also probably fall behind in tech. But you can still eke out a victory, and with practice, you'll learn how to catch up and overtake your opponents.
     
  4. automator

    automator King

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    Keep on going, good sir. I'm at the same crossroads. I've been able now to pull off three Prince wins (a domination on Terra, and a space and time victory on Fractal map).

    If you're constantly frustrated by Prince, make your Noble games more difficult:

    • Try for a different win (e.g. conquest) or an earlier win
    • Play with Agressive AI
    • Turn on Raging Barbarians
    • Use a civ you aren't trained to use (e.g. a non-financial civ if you've become a slave to the financial civs)
    • Play with more AIs

    After getting my butt handed to me on Prince over and over again, I went back to Noble and and added two or three extra civs and put them to agresssive -- I was guaranteed a game more difficult than the cake walk that is Noble, yet not so much difficult as Prince. It had the added benefit of teaching me the value of the early war, since I was more likely to have a neighbor get all up in my face in the 6th Century AD.
     
  5. Syagrius

    Syagrius Warlord

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    If you want to play PRINCE just put a Prince cd in the cd player and push the play button eheheh :lol:
     
  6. Tekee

    Tekee Bahama Mama

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    Ok but I have never won a Domination Ivcotry, never even close but I always win signifigantly in Noble, yes I am a slave to FInacial Trait
    But I think I won one Noble game by Score but I was romans and killed 3 people
    But how do you do a COnquest Vicotry?

    // Thank you for helping me FIgure out how to play my Prince CD's
    hmm the Play button eh? ;D
     
  7. Mango

    Mango Tasty Fruit

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    To me conquest is difficult on certain maps because you HAVE to raze and yet without sufficient planning you can't keep the AI from resettling the areas you took. It's probably because I always play with 7-8 Civs minimum. I despise tiny maps with only 2-3 other opponents.
     
  8. ElJojo

    ElJojo Chieftain

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    To be effective an axemen rush must be made quite early. Sometimes I only build one settler, to get copper. And I start producing axemen. 6 is a start you should keep building some for reinforcement.
    Your opponent must be close and its cities should not be well protected.
    two archers and 20% cultural defense : you should go, maybe you will lose one or two axemen but that's it.
    Beware of cities on hills they're quite hard to take. So if you see a capital on a hill maybe you should ask for peace. It's why you should scout a bit.
    Axemen rush is not the only way, far from it. In fact there's a lot of preconditions. Sometimes classic expansion through settler building is better, but you'll have to wage a war at some point so get ready as soon as possible
     
  9. podraza

    podraza Warlord

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    In the span of 8 or 9 games I went from Warlord to Monarch. It was quite easy when I started doing a couple of things differently.

    1. Micromanage everything. At least for a while. Turn the governor off. Do not automate the workers. This is the only way to learn the basic mechanics of the tiles and their yields. This is really the only way to understand Civ, in my opinion. When I started micromanaging, it changed my whole game. It might take a game to two to get past the learning curve. Once you feel comfortable, you can turn some automation functions back on, but this is the best way to learn.

    2. You must build what will seem like a stupidly large number of units. I always hated building a unit because it just didn't seem as valuable as any of the various buildings. So this is a tough adjustment to make, but it must be made. Rather than give you a number or ratio of units to build, I would tell you to get used to the idea of building units in perpetuity. Every couple of turns for the whole game a unit is being popped out somewhere. You'll need these to keep the enemy afraid of you, and to finally kill him when the time is right. The investment in the units is a good one, because you can use them to ultimately capture an entire city, complete with several internal and external improvements. Worth the hammers. In fact, having done exactly no math to back up this claim, I would say that the cheapest way to acquire stuff in Civ is to capture it with units.

    3. Learn to make a friend for the sake of having the friend. If that means making a trade that doesn't particularly benefit you, do it. A friend won't attack you (usually), will give you better trades, and might even help you fight a war someday (though I wouldn't count on it)

    4. When building units, build what will seem like a disproportionately high number of catapults and other artillery. The value of the catapult is two fold. First, cheap. Second, collateral damage. These two combined mean you that you can produce a giant stack of catapults that can cut through just about any defenses. Don't be afraid to lose them. That's the point. They are cheap and be replaced easily.

    5. Don't be intimidated by the AI. On prince, they really are pushovers. But the only way to gain confidence is to discover how weak they are for yourself by beating up on them a bit. Build a lot of catapults and lay waste.

    6. Make an effort to learn whatever everything is and does. I am still learning this. I don't happen to know what many of the wonders do yet, or at least, I don't have this memorized. But learn everything that the rest of the more common buildings do. This, combined with micromanaging, will help you make better decisions. Not to sound cliche, but this game is just about decisions. If you make better ones, you win. To do that, you need knowledge and practice. So look up everything here or on the civlopedia.
     
  10. Tekee

    Tekee Bahama Mama

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    Haha I now spend more time here in Civ fanatcis then actually playing XCivoilization, but yes I understand what everything does but with your help
    *I actually already read that guide it diodn't help much**
    I might just win as the Incans
    But i can never get a Quecha rush done right anymore :( I used to be able too, start building Quecha at begining and then rush nearest neighbor,
    Maybe the AI is smarter against Quecha rush in Warlords becuase I tried sveral times :((
     
  11. Oddible

    Oddible signal / noise > 1

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    How much upgrading do you do? Do you destroy old, lightly promoted units and build new ones or mostly pay for upgrades?
     
  12. podraza

    podraza Warlord

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    I rarely upgrade. I use older units as city defenders (for safe cities) or I just suicide them to the most damage as I can.

    I am not sure that this is a smart way to play. But I just can't stand to pay the upgrade premiums.

    I do tend to be at war quite a bit, so I usually have opportunity to kill them off without having to destroy them myself.
     
  13. Sisiutil

    Sisiutil All Leader Challenger

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    Just to voice a dissenting opinion...

    I will often upgrade my best units--Level 4 and up.

    In particular, Axemen, Swordsmen, and Macemen can get City Raider promotions, while Grenadiers and Riflemen cannot. So if you don't upgrade your veteran CR units, you're without effective city raiders from the end of the medieval era until you get tanks. :eek: Sometimes I'll even build several CR Macemen once I have Grenadiers but before I research Rifling just so I can promote them. Especially if I'm playing as England. CR Redcoats seriously rock.

    Units with no or few promotions, or obsolete ones (like Cover or Shock when the enemy has gunpowder units) get deleted, unless they're the "honour guard" in safe cities in my interior.

    Also, war weariness results from the death of units (yours and the enemy's) in foreign territory. So if you're throwing obsolete units at the enemy instead of deleting them, you're increasing your WW back home in a big, fat, ugly way.
     
  14. sirford

    sirford Title indicates royalty

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    never quit at 1000ad, "just because you were behind".

    I've been playing at emporer(huge maps), and i'm always behind at 1000ad, but thats mostly because i was busy conquering my neighbors. 1000ad is about the time i wrap up my conquests and domination on the battlefield. I'm very far behind in my techs, and then i start a huge push on getting cottages everywhere, and advancing my tech every way possible.
     
  15. Wlauzon

    Wlauzon Prince

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    Same here - I am ALWAYS behind at 1000 AD.

    My last game just finished at Prince I was #3 of 5 at 1040 according to my save game.

    At 2050 I was #1. I had 5440 points, next was Hattie with 3900. Ghengis was 1900'ish. I had all but a couple of the wonders. I had covered most of 2.5 huge continents. I had reduced Catherine to rubble, with only one token city left. I had nearly 200 million population.

    So being behind at 1000 AD means nothing at all unless you are in such a bad position or location that there is no chance.

    Obviously not all games turn out as good as my last one, but I seldom lose at Prince (though I get totally smooshed if I try to go up a level).
     
  16. podraza

    podraza Warlord

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    I did not know deaths were causing WW. That is a major problem. Thank you!

    Are we to conclude then, that as between an upgrade and disbanding insufficiently promoted units, disbanding them is actually the better option?

    I don't know the mechanics of upgrades that well, but I remember reading somewhere that they take the cost of rushing the upgraded unit minus the cost of rushing the existing unit plus some premium, which I think is 25 gold.

    If the best thing you can do with an obsolete unit is disband it, and if doing so gains you nothing other than the maintainence cost back in your pocket, might not an "upgrade everything" policy be the best?

    Are there any good articles on this topic around here?
     
  17. Sisiutil

    Sisiutil All Leader Challenger

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    You're welcome. On a related note, I recently learned that the death of units in your own territory causes no war weariness whatsoever; so if you can entice the enemy's stack into your borders and kill it there, you'll suffer no war weariness from the death of those units or even some of your own. (The idea being that your population will not object to a defensive military action to defend your home territory.)

    As for upgrades, I'm not familiar with the mechanics. The main factor for me is usually promotions. By mid-game I definitely have the Heroic Epic built and I will probably build West Point in the same city very soon. That means my military city can churn out a modern level 4 unit every couple of turns. Or I can spend gold to upgrade existing obsolete units with no or few promotions.

    Frankly, I prefer to just let my military city produce new highly-promoted units and save my gold. If I'm rolling in dough I try to keep some (500 to 1000) to quickly upgrade units in a city that comes under attack. To deter attack, I send new and upgraded units to border/coastal cities.

    I also prefer to spend gold upgrading naval units as opposed to lightly-promoted ground troops, especially if my military city is not coastal. The AI and the in-game power ratings value navies very highly even if most humans don't. If you own your continent, a powerful navy is a good deterrent to keep away an invasion force, and it's certainly easier to kill one transport than the 4 ground troops they're carrying.
     
  18. podraza

    podraza Warlord

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    I have a lot of irrational Civ "preferences" and I try to ween myself off of them whenever possible. I wonder if this might be one.

    Why do I hate paying for upgrades? Because I have to turn down science spending for several to many turns while I raise the money necessary. That's the downside. But, there an upside. You don't have to build new units from scratch and so you can invest those hammers into other useful things, markets, banks, universities, etc. (ignore the matter of promotions and experience for now)

    The cities that aren't building units during these turns can be building any number of other useful improvements. Those useful improvements, in turn, might help you earn back faster that science you lost out on while this process was going on. Does it all even out in the end? Or turn out for the better? For the worse?
     
  19. CivDude86

    CivDude86 King

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    Then we'll have to call it the difficulty level formally known as Prince.
    I guess I was the only that got that one.
     
  20. Sisiutil

    Sisiutil All Leader Challenger

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    I think it's too complicated to come down to a simple formula of A costs more than B and therefore B is better. It really depends on your situation, goals, and desired victory in each game. You might be pursuing a domination win, bee-line to chemistry, and use gold to upgrade all your city raider macemen to grenadiers so you can quickly attack your next target with superior forces that also have beneficial promotions. Or you might be pursuing a space race win and want to keep the science slider maxed, so you rely on your military city (and maybe the occassional unit build in one or two others) to churn out modern military units.

    This is why I try to be open-minded about options in Civ--its such a complex game that you shouldn't really rule out any tactic.
     

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