How would you design Egypt in Civ7?

Zaarin

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You know the drill. Here's mine.


Leader 1: Akhenaten: Heretic King: Reforming your religion is cheaper; bonus to Culture; harsher penalties for non-state religions and schismatic religions.
Leader 2: Hatshepsut: Foremost of Noble Ladies: Foreign trade routes are richer based on Luxury resources; Wonders produce additional stability and culture.
Civ Ability: Children of the Nile: Bonus to wonder building and freshwater farming; Faith from wonders; steep penalty to stability from foreign populations but a special project to convert them to Egyptian citizens.
Unique Building: Scribal School: Library replacement, yields less Science but yields Faith, Culture, and Stability/Happiness/Amenities/whatever and has an extra slot for a Great Work of Writing.
Unique Unit: Maryannu works pretty well and can stay; alternately, a Wīꜥiw, a Swordsman replacement with a khopesh.

This Egypt is a culture/faith civ that's not quite as isolationist as Japan but still intended to more or less stick to itself, avoiding rapid conquest due to its difficulty incorporating foreign populations (Ancient Egyptians believed non-Egyptians had no ka, or soul). Akhenaten doubles down on the civ's religious and cultural advantages but also adds a further disadvantage in incorporating heterodox populations, while Hatshepsut balances this inward looking civilization with trade bonuses while adding stability from the Wonders the civ should already be building anyway.
 

Phrozen

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To be fair Japan's isolationist period was really only during the Edo period. Prior to that they interacted with Korea and China a far bit. Just because Japan was a almost resourceless backwater it wasn't a big player in far east politics.
 

Zaarin

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To be fair Japan's isolationist period was really only during the Edo period. Prior to that they interacted with Korea and China a far bit. Just because Japan was a almost resourceless backwater it wasn't a big player in far east politics.
TBH Japan was a backwater until the 20th century; the glorification of Medieval Japan is an artifact of Western Japanophilia and fascination with samurai drama and, later, anime and manga. It certainly interacted with China and Korea more in the past (particularly during the Heian period), but that interaction was chiefly one way: Japan was influenced by China and Korea, not the other way around. Even when Japan traded with and imitated the Mainland powers, it was still overwhelmingly inward looking, and even after breaking its isolation in the 20th century Japan to this day has one of the most homogenous populations in the world. Japan did attempt to invade Korea several times, but each time the result was disastrous for Japan--not exactly something to base the civ on. IMO, Korea, not Japan, would be the base game staple if it weren't for American Japanophilia; Korea was far more influential in the Classical, Medieval, and Early Modern periods than Japan was.

That aside, I was referencing specifically my design for Japan in a previous thread.
 

Xandinho

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I'd like an early builder ability for Egypt similar to Qin Shi Huang's: builders can spend charges to build ancient and classical wonders. Bonus for building districts adjacent to rivers may remain.
For unique improvement, I'd like to see Mastaba. It would be built on flat terrain (except tundra and snow) and would give culture, faith and loyalty/stability/or anything equivalent.
I wouldn't want to miss the sphinxes, so would be nice if this to come back as a wonder of the world: Great Sphinx of Giza.
 
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Unique Building: Scribal School: Library replacement, yields less Science but yields Faith, Culture, and Stability/Happiness/Amenities/whatever and has an extra slot for a Great Work of Writing.
Would have worked well for Babylon in Civ 6 with their ability, which is honestly what I wanted for them in the first place. Maybe a unique watermill/irrigation system for Egypt instead which honestly I wouldn't mind? :p
That would leave the civ ability geared more toward wonder building.

Everything else about the design is great though I would add the ability for workers/builders to add production to wonders like @Xandinho said. It was a great ability for Qin but fits Egyptian civ abilities as a whole.
 

Zaarin

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Would have worked well for Babylon in Civ 6 with their ability, which is honestly what I wanted for them in the first place. Maybe a unique watermill/irrigation system for Egypt instead which honestly I wouldn't mind? :p
That would leave the civ ability geared more toward wonder building.
Doesn't work for me: the Egyptian fields were irrigated by the natural inundations of the Nile, unlike the more erratic and catastrophic flooding of the Tigris and Euphrates.

I'd like an early builder ability for Egypt similar to Qin Shi Huang's: builders can spend charges to build ancient and classical wonders. Bonus for building districts adjacent to rivers may remain.
Everything else about the design is great though I would add the ability for workers/builders to add production to wonders like @Xandinho said. It was a great ability for Qin but fits Egyptian civ abilities as a whole.
Yes, this would actually be a good edition. Does this mean Egypt gets "Deliver Us" from The Prince of Egypt as theme song? :mischief:

For unique improvement, I'd like to see Mastaba. It would be built on flat terrain (except tundra and snow) and would give culture, faith and loyalty/stability/or anything equivalent.
I like the idea, especially since funerary cults were a big deal in Ancient Egypt. Pharaohs whose reigns were long forgotten were still preserved as local deities. That being said, the Mastaba was the least interesting of the various Egyptian mortuary temples. I'd rather see a Cenotaph or Necropolis with the same role and rules myself.
 
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Doesn't work for me: the Egyptian fields were irrigated by the natural inundations of the Nile, unlike the more erratic and catastrophic flooding of the Tigris and Euphrates.
It was more of a joke really.
I did forget about the unique Holy Site that Egypt and Nubia got in the "Gift of the Nile" Scenario. I think that would be graphically be stunning and would love to see that implemented in the base game of Civ VII. Not sure of what to call them, not sure if Necropolis would work?
 

Zaarin

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It was more of a joke really.
I did forget about the unique Holy Site that Egypt and Nubia got in the "Gift of the Nile" Scenario. I think that would be graphically be stunning and would love to see that implemented in the base game of Civ VII. Not sure of what to call them, not sure if Necropolis would work?
I'd call it a Mortuary Temple. And yes, it's gorgeous; I use a mod that adds it to the ordinary Civ6 Egypt (outside the scenario), though I haven't actually played as Egypt since adding it...
 
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I guess to put it all of my ideas together it would go something like this:

Leader: Akhenaten-

Ability: House of Aten- All Religious buildings gain +2 culture as long as those cities follow your religion. Use faith to purchase builders.

Civ ability: Gift of the Nile- Builders/workers may use a charge to add production to wonders and districts adjacent to your home river system. Farms gain extra production and food when adjacent to your home river system.

UB: Mortuary Temple (replaces Temple)- Gains extra faith toward adjacent world wonders. May also hold artifacts and any artifacts placed from your civilization are automatically themed.

UU: Maryannu Chariot Archer similar to Civ 6.
 
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8housesofelixir

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My thoughts on Egyptians rose from a "general principle" question - what would make an Egyptian play unique, different, make one thinking "I'm not just playing another Builder civ"? And I really like Sukritact's answer to that question, make everything about Egyptians happening alongside one river, from downstream to upstream. (TBH I hope every civ plays differently as if playing different games.)

To that end, I more or less think of a Builder-Culture civ that could farm cultural influence and (use them to, possibly) put down internal strifes - propaganda efforts done by Ramesses II came to mind. Akhenaten's struck down the old priest class in order to promote his new monotheistic worship is another theme I would think about from time to time - which might require a rethinking of Religion mechanics.
 
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My thoughts on Egyptians rose from a "general principle" question - what would make an Egyptian play unique, different, make one thinking "I'm not just playing another Builder civ"? And I really like Sukritact's answer to that question, make everything about Egyptians happening alongside one river, from downstream to upstream. (TBH I hope every civ plays differently as if playing different games.)
Great now I have to redo mine. :p

But seriously I love this idea about keeping them and being productive around one river, or river system at least. That would also get geographical feature names back in the game. :mischief:
 
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Some random ideas...
Add a "funerary art" type of great work which egypt would get bonuses to ancient works.

(TBH I hope every civ plays differently as if playing different games.)
Make the trade route gold bonus depend on how much desert is being worked. Just make it more interactive then the flat bonus of bride of the nile. And make the wonder bonus based on how many desert flood tiles being worked.
 

Zaarin

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Make the trade route gold bonus depend on how much desert is being worked. Just make it more interactive then the flat bonus of bride of the nile. And make the wonder bonus based on how many desert flood tiles being worked.
The Egyptians had nothing to do with the desert beyond the narrow strip of Nile flood plain they inhabited; it was the Libyans (Berbers) who lived in the desert. Egypt was one of the most compact ancient empires just because of how tightly they hugged the Nile.
 

Phrozen

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The Egyptians had nothing to do with the desert beyond the narrow strip of Nile flood plain they inhabited; it was the Libyans (Berbers) who lived in the desert. Egypt was one of the most compact ancient empires just because of how tightly they hugged the Nile.

Japan's bonus from Civ6 would fit Egypt well.
 

Lord Lakely

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Hatchepsut Leads Egypt in Sid Meier's Cilivization VII

She was one of the first women to rule an Empire in history, and had to deal with a lot of prejudice and backlash along the way. However, Hatchepsut persevered and under her rule Egypt experienced an economic and cultural boom like they would rarely see again. Most Egyptologist consider her one of the best, if not the best pharaohs of all time.

Egypt's Civilization bonus is Bounty of the Nile. Tile improvements on Fresh Water tiles provide extra yields, starting at +1 in the Ancient Era, and increasing to +2 after Machinery, and +3 after Steam Power. Egypt's infrastructure is also immune to Flood damage and more likely to gain Food and Production gains from Floods and Sandstorms.

The Mastaba is Egypt's Unique Tile improvement, which unlocks at Masonry. This burial tomb yields +2 Faith and +2 Culture, as well as +2 Gold if built on Flat Desert. It gains additional culture from nearby quarries, Faith from nearby camps and Gold from nearby Oasis tiles. It also grants a major adjacency bonus to nearby Holy Sites, Commercial Hubs and Industrial Zones. Mastaba's cannot be built adjacent to Fresh Water, nor can they be built next to each other. They grant Tourism equal to Faith after Divine Right, and Tourism equal to Culture after Flight.

The Medjay is Egypt's unique unit, which unlocks at Bronze Working. This unit can be built as either a Melee (30 Strength, 2 Speed, 90 Production) unit or a Heavy Cavalry unit (mounted on a Chariot, 35 STR, 3 Speed, 130 Production), and gains a combat boost when fighting inside or adjacent to Egypt's borders (+4 Strength). Unmounted Medjay can also inflict a bleeding wound on enemies they strike, preventing them from healing for two turns.

Hatchepsut was a great builder. Her ability, Holiest of Holies, allows her to build World Wonders +25% faster if built on Flat Desert or adjacent to Fresh Water. Moreover, Mastaba's and World Wonders built by Hatshepsut are guaranteed to spawn excavation sites once Archaeolgy has been discovered. Any Artifacts dug up from these Excavation Sites will provide double the usual Culture and Tourism yields to whoever is brave enough to extract them.

As Egypt, Rivers are your prime real estate, as their banks will give you additional yields and you don't need to fear the occasional flood. The Medjay is a versatile defensive unit that disable as infantry or quickly intervene as cavalry. Place Mastaba's on dead tiles, such as Flat Desert, to rake in early Culture and Faith yields. Use Hatshepsut's bonuses to build many discounted Wonders. Once Archaeology has been researched, build Archaeologists and send them to your excavation sites to get your powerful artifacts. Egypt is a prime contender for Cultural victory, but with Mastaba boosted Commercial Hubs, Industrial Zones and Holy Sites, can be competent at winning Scientific and Religious victories as well.

Will it be your mission to punt your rivals out of the cultural race? How will you play Egypt in Sid Meier's Civilization VII?


Sigil & Cities

Sigil
I love the Eye of Horus, but I'm all for trying new logos whenever possible. I've found that a Scarab Beetle works just as fine, Gold on that beautiful, lush Egyptian Blue.

I was unable to find a transparent version of my prefered Scarab Icon so I had to pull this one from my spreadsheet :( (*painstakingly fails to ignore the hideous white border as OCD itensifies*). Egypt's current colours of Gold-on-Teal serve well as Alt Colours for me.

City List

Whenever possible, I tried to keep the names as authentic as I could.
Capital: W'aset (Thebes)
Other Cities: Men'nefer, Sâqqara, Nekhen , Râ'qedyt, Iunu , Abeju, Akhetaten, R'ubaw, Zau, Zawty, Ha'atwurat, Dj'anet, Tjebnubtjer, Per'wadyt, Swenett, Hetepsenusret, Dj'edet, Hutnennesut, T'perso, Shedet, Tjenu, Per'ramessu, Behdet, Ta'senet, Dj'edu, Khem, Per'bastet, Hutheryib, Iunet, Meidum, Gebtu, Pi'emro, Khito, Nubt, Tamiat, Per'medjet, Per'atum, Pikuat, Men'at Khufu, Napa, Nekheb, Buhen, Yamu, Timinhor, Pape, Nut-R'aset & Pilak.
Spoiler :
Other Cities (Popular names): Memphis, Saqqara, Hieraconpolis, Alexandria, Heliopolis, Abydos, Amarna, Elephantine, Saïs, Lycopolis, Avaris, Tanis, Sebennytos, Buto, Syene, Kahun, Mendes, Heracleopolis, Giza, Crocodilopolis, Tinis/This, Pi-Ramesses, Edfu, Khnum, Busiris, Letopolis, Bubastis, Arthribis, Dendera, Meidum, Coptos, Naucratis, Rosetta, Ombos, Damiette, Oxyrhinchos, Heroönpolis, Hermonthis, Pelusium, Canopus, Oryx, Napata, Ihab, Buhen, Apis, Damanhur, Luxor, Karnak & Philae.


What I left out here was a trade bonus for Hatshepsut (see if you can spot the reference i crammed into this post) because frankly, Cleo already had a trade bonus and trade bonuses in *general* are underwhelming in Civ 6. Enjoy your gimmicky Archaeology ^_^

Otherwise, everything I'd like to see for Egypt is there: strong agriculture on the backs of a powerful nile inundation, small but meaningful industry bonuses, but overall a Culture specialist. Civ 7's Egypt should head in a similar direction.
 
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Just one note:

Maryannu refers to a caste of chariot-driving nobiloty, but the word is Hurrian in origin, not Egyptian.

Seneny, on the other hand, was the Egyptian word for a chariot-borne archer (his driver was a Kedjet, usually translated as 'charioteer')
Suggest then, that Egyptian Chariots, a fast ranged unit, be called either Kedjet or Seneny
after their crewmen rather than use a foreign 'borrowed' word..
 

Zaarin

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Seneny, on the other hand, was the Egyptian word for a chariot-borne archer (his driver was a Kedjet, usually translated as 'charioteer')
Suggest then, that Egyptian Chariots, a fast ranged unit, be called either Kedjet or Seneny
Seneny (snnj) looks like it's probably derived from an Egyptian root meaning "two" (cf., sn, "brother"; snwj, "two"; snnw, "second; companion"), doubtless referring to its two wheels. Egyptian also had two other words for chariot: mrkbt (a Semitic borrowing) and wrryt.
 
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Seneny (snnj) looks like it's probably derived from an Egyptian root meaning "two" (cf., sn, "brother"; snwj, "two"; snnw, "second; companion"), doubtless referring to its two wheels. Egyptian also had two other words for chariot: mrkbt (a Semitic borrowing) and wrryt.

One shouldn't be surprised that a great many "Egyptian" words relating to Chariots are borrowed, though: the chariot itself appears to have been introduced to Egypt by the Hyksos, very much the way advanced wheeled technology was introduced to the Romans by the Gauls and spoked wheels and chariots to the Chinese by the "Northern Barbarians". It's pretty certain now from the archeology that the spoked wheel chariot was invented Once, between the steppes north of the Caspian Sea and the Volga River, and spread from there east, west, and south.
It's my strongest argument for Technologies being available from Barbarian Camps, frankly . . .
 

Zaarin

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One shouldn't be surprised that a great many "Egyptian" words relating to Chariots are borrowed, though: the chariot itself appears to have been introduced to Egypt by the Hyksos, very much the way advanced wheeled technology was introduced to the Romans by the Gauls and spoked wheels and chariots to the Chinese by the "Northern Barbarians". It's pretty certain now from the archeology that the spoked wheel chariot was invented Once, between the steppes north of the Caspian Sea and the Volga River, and spread from there east, west, and south.
It's my strongest argument for Technologies being available from Barbarian Camps, frankly . . .
I found it interesting that mrkbt seems to come from a Northwest Semitic language. The Canaanites disliked horses and were late adopters of chariot warfare. Egyptian must have gotten the word from the Amorites.
 
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I found it interesting that mrkbt seems to come from a Northwest Semitic language. The Canaanites disliked horses and were late adopters of chariot warfare. Egyptian must have gotten the word from the Amorites.

The one certain thing is that they got chariots from the north: the transmission path seems to have been from the Sintashta Culture north of the Caspian Sea (2100 - 1800 BCE). to Shang China by 1700 BCE, and via the Caucasus to eastern, then western Anatolia, upper Mesopotamia, the Levant, the Mitanni and Hyksos, who introduced the spoked wheel, leather tyred wheels and all the other chariot trimmings in a package to Egypt (1650 - 1550 BCE) and, probably, Mycenean Greece (1600 BCE)

Dates are all the earliest we have archeological or (much more rarely) pictographic evidence of chariots and spoked wheels
 
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