[HybridComp] Promotions & Perks

[GeneralMikeIII]

About the aid promotions, do you need to buy those with experience, or will they be automatic, like the fort bonuses? And I don't know if I like the crowded bonuses too much. Each one of those tiles represents quite a large amount of space, especially if it is some kind of field. Maybe for cities it would be a good idea (I am kinda sick of the AI stacking 20 units in a city). Maybe jungles and forests too, but I think that should be it.

Also, I had a suggestion for the traits and how you could tie them in. Maybe it could be an automatic with a certain level. For example, a unit would get the exceptional trait when it gets to level 4 (10 XP), then the other ones at higher levels. This is what I have been doing with the world editor (a little bit of a side note: how do I edit the XML files? Do I need to download something? I wanted to make the limit for XP from barbs higher than 10, but I opened the XML file and my computer treated it like an internet site. I could highlight and read the things but I couldn't change them. What am I missing (I'm really new at this editing thing)). I think the auto-promotion is a good idea because as a unit fights, it is going to gradually get better. I know this is the principle the promotions system tries to address in the first place, but in cIV a unit could theoretically win 17 battles (or more) and still not have any bonuses to it's strength, if the player chooses sentry and other promotions that don't impact strength. Plus, this would make it more important to keep well trained units. Also, I can't think of many other good ways to include the traits promotions, and they were a very good idea that deserves to be added. The suggestion earlier to have them come up randomly after a certain level was a very good idea too, but I think this is a little simpler and more predictable. IMHO, either would be a good idea.

Next, I wanted to say I liked the other suggestions made by other people. I really liked the stealthy, sonar, strike and attack harbor promotions. I don't use subs much, but this could really make them worth it.

Lastly, a few pages ago I made a suggestion about a field general promotion. The aid promotions seem to do a lot of the same thing, but maybe the general could enhance that? No one really responded to it at all; I'm not sure if people forgot about it or if they just thought it was so stupid they didn't want to acknowledge it.

BTW, I haven't tested the last few versions, so I am sorry if anything I said has already been addressed (I am home for break, and we only have a dial-up modem. Good enough for most things, but not downloading)

 

[AWolfe]

XML files are plain text. Rather than double-clicking them, open your editor first and then use the program's File Open dialog. It's easier still if you have configured your Windows Explorer to be able to do a right-mouse-button menu "Send To" to your editor.

 

[Zuul]

GeneralMikeIII: Promotions have a predefined sets of abileties, I have added most promotions that are possible. Many of the ideas people have suggested are not possible without adding more than just xml (even though the ideas are very good).

Because of the limitation of max 97 different promotion in total in the xml file, im thinking or redoing all promotions to remove some and combind some (even the the original ones), so I can include the stack Aid. I also think I should make all promotions a bit better, like +15% instead of +10% from Combat I (between original and Fall of Heaven), to make experienced unit survive longer.

 

[Pfeffersack]

@ 97 promotions problem

Do you have a save to reproduce the crash? This would be extremly useful for fixing it...

 

[Zuul]

Just uncomment "Archer Aid I" last in the CIV4PromotionInfos.xml (remove the <!-- -->) in version 6 of the mod. You can start the game and look in civiliopedia, but when you start a new game or load, the game crash.

And to be sure this is no xml error, just comment any of the other promotions and it will work again (with archer aid, and other ones as long as it's max 97 of them in total)

 

[Zuul]

Here is a list of the new promotion bonuses I think I will make. If someone have any suggestions about this please say so now before I start editing the files.

Combat I:          +15% strength.
Combat II:         +15% strength.
Combat III:        +15% strength.
Combat IV:         +15% strength.
Combat V:          +15% strength.
Combat VI:         +20% strength.

Attack I:          +22% attack.
Attack II:         +22% attack.
Attack III:        +22% attack.
Attack VI:         +34% attack.
Defence I:         +22% defence.
Defence II:        +22% defence.
Defence III:       +22% defence.
Defence IV:        +34% defence.

Ambush I:          +40% vs. Armoured Units.
Ambush II:         +50% vs. Armoured Units.
Charge I:          +40% vs. Siege Weapons.
Charge II:         +50% vs. Siege Weapons.
Cover I:           +40% vs. Archery Units.
Cover II:          +50% vs. Archery Units.
Formation I:       +40% vs. Mounted Units.
Formation II:      +50% vs. Mounted Units.
Pinch I:           +40% vs. Gunpowder Units.
Pinch II:          +50% vs. Gunpowder Units.
Shock I:           +40% vs. Melee Units.
Shock II:          +50% vs. Melee Units.

Guerilla I:        +40% hill defence.
Guerilla II:       +40% hill defence, double movement on hills.
Woodsman I:        +40% forest/jungle defence.
Woodsman II:       +40% forest/jungle defence, double movement in forrest.
Arctic Combat:     +50% tundra & ice defense, double movement in tundra & ice.
Desert Combat:     +50% desert defense, double movement in desert.
Fieldsman:         +20% grass & plains defense, double movement in grass & plains.

Accuracy I:        +15% City Bombard Damage.
Accuracy II:       +20% City Bombard Damage.
Amphibious:        No penelty attacking from water & over rivers, +15% attack.
Barrage I:         +30% collateral damage.
Barrage II:        +40% collateral damage.
Barrage III:       +50% collateral damage.
Blitz:             Multiple attack.

Drill I:           +2 first strike chance.
Drill II:          +1 first strike chance, +1 first strike.
Drill III:         +2 first strike.
Drill IV:          +1 first strike chance, +2 first strike.
Flanking I:        +15% withdrawal chance.
Flanking II:       +15% withdrawal chance.
Flanking III:      +15% withdrawal chance, immune to first strikes.

Medic I:           +7% heal same tile, +3% heal adjecent tile.
Medic II:          +7% heal same tile, +3% heal adjecent tile.
Medic III:         +11% heal same tile, +4% heal adjecent tile.
Heal:              +12% friendly lands, +10% neutral lands, +8% enemy, defence +10%.
March:             Heals when moving, +5% attack.

Mobility:          -1 movement cost, +10% attack.
Navigation I:      +1 movement for Naval Units.
Navigation II:     +1 movement for Naval Units.
Speed:             +1 Movement for Mounted & Armor units (need Flanking III or Combat4).
Commando:          Can use enemy roads, +10% attack.

Sentry I:          +1 Visibility Range.
Sentry II:         +1 Visibility Range (Naval & Helicopter units).
Sentry III:        +1 Visibility Range (Naval & Helicopter units).


# Traits (green):
Exceptional:       +20% strength, +5% withdrawal chance, heals +4% neutral & enemy lands lands.
Extraordinary:     +35% strength, +10% withdrawal chance, heals +5% neutral & enemy lands, +1 first strike chance.
Hero:              +50% strength, +15% withdrawal chance, heals +6% neutral & enemy lands, +2 first strike chance.
Legendary Hero:    +70% strength, +20% withdrawal chance, heals +8% neutral & enemy lands, +3 first strike chance.
Avatar:            +100% strength, +25% withdrawal chance, heals +10% neutral & enemy lands, +4 first strike chance.

# Perks (violet):
Light:             +1 move, -40% strength, +10% withdraw (Land).
Light:             +2 move, -40% strength, +10% withdraw (Naval/Helicopter).
Heavy:             +1 movement cost, +40% strength, -10% withdraw (Mounted/Armor/Naval/Helicopter).
Berzerker:         +40% attack, -40% defence.
Stalwart:          +40% defence, -40% attack.

# Effects gained in Forts (defence 50%).
Fort I:            No penatly attacking over river, +15% withdrawal chance, +10% attack.
Fort II:           Immune to first strike, +1 visibility range, +10% friendly heal rate (Optics).
Fort III:          +1 first strike chance, +10% withdrawal chance (Steel).
Fort IV:           +1 visibility range, +1 first strike chance, +10% withdrawal chance, +10% attack (Mass Media).


# Effects gained by stacks (Speey = Mounted, Range = Archer/Gunpowder, Heavy = Melee/Armour, Scout = Recon/Helicopter.
Speedy Aid I:      +10% withdrawal chance, +5% strength..
Speedy Aid II:     +20% withdrawal chance, +10% strength.
Speedy Aid III:    +25% withdrawal chance, +15% strength.

Ranged Aid I:      +1 first strike, +5% city defence, +5% hill defence.
Ranged Aid II:     +2 first strike, +10% city defence, +10% hill defence.
Ranged Aid III:    +1 first strike chance, +2 first strike, +20% city defence, +20% hill defence.

Heavy Aid I:       +15% strength.
Heavy Aid II:      +30% strength.
Heavy Aid III:     +45% strength.

Siege Aid I:       +1 first strike chance, +15% city attack.
Siege Aid II:      +2 first strike chance, +30% city attack.
Siege Aid III:     +1 first strike chance, 1 first strike, +45% city attack.

Scout Aid I:       +1 first strike chance, +5% withdrawal chance, +5% strength.
Scout Aid II:      +2 first strike chance, +10% withdrawal chance, +10% strength.
Scout Aid III:     +1 first strike chance, 1 first strike, +15% withdrawal chance, +15% strength.

Crouded:          +1 movement cost, -25% strength, -20% withdrawal chance, -3 first strike chance, -2 first strike.



Other recomanded changes:
Fort defence: 25% -> 50%
Upgrade xp keep: 10 -> 40
Animals max xp: 5 -> 8
Barbarians max xp: 10 -> 20

Total 91 promotions (6 more to the 97 limit).

 

[Pfeffersack]

A stupid question...how to install the mod? Or perhaps rather...how to start it? I wanted to test out the too-many-promotion crash, but I simply cannot get the mod running.Both 0.5 and 0.6 does not seem to include a main mod file, so I don't know what to after putting the files in "my Documents/.../.../" Do I miss a file or is the "Load Moad" option the wrong way to start the mod?

 

[Impaler[WrG]]

I dont see the logic behind Fort IV, I know its something you added when you incorporated the RealFort Mod, Mass Media having military aplications is

Perhaps Radio or Combustion or even Physics seems like a better option

I would rather see the original traits remain the same or if anything to be streamlined to just a single effect, none of this +5% kinda dangling off the main bonus stuff.

Fieldsman should have a negative Hill and Forest Modifier to cancel out the bonus in thouse environments, that would truely make it a Flat field oriented combat abilitity and would balance it out.

I think you might want to drop Hero/Avatar things as their not normaly usable, I think you said they were only for people making Senarios, the normal game realy takes precedence now that we see theirs a limit on the number of promotions. And the same effects could be duplicated by giving a combination of other promotions.

I dont understand at all the workings of these "Aid" promotions, they look rather redundant, could you clarify them?

 

[GeneralMikeIII]

Do I miss a file or is the "Load Moad" option the wrong way to start the mod?

Its the wrong way.

If you put the file in the customassets folder you don't really have to "load" it, it starts automatically. Just startup a game, and it should be right there.

 

[Zuul]

I dont see the logic behind Fort IV, I know its something you added when you incorporated the RealFort Mod, Mass Media having military aplications is
Perhaps Radio or Combustion or even Physics seems like a better option

Well I wanted this when you got the radar but there is no tech for this.

I would rather see the original traits remain the same or if anything to be streamlined to just a single effect, none of this +5% kinda dangling off the main bonus stuff.

Do you for example mean the extra +10% attack to the amphibious trait? Well that promotions is to weak on it's own, it need to be better else people would never use it.

Fieldsman should have a negative Hill and Forest Modifier to cancel out the bonus in thouse environments, that would truely make it a Flat field oriented combat abilitity and would balance it out.

Good idea, I will remove extra defencive bonus you get from Fieldsman/Arctic Combat/Desert Combat in Hills/Forests. But you can't easily remove the extra movement without having to code extra python.

I think you might want to drop Hero/Avatar things as their not normaly usable, I think you said they were only for people making Senarios, the normal game realy takes precedence now that we see theirs a limit on the number of promotions. And the same effects could be duplicated by giving a combination of other promotions.

Yes I will make 2 version of the mod, one with all things and one with just the promotions. But in the version after this one I will add hero support fully to the mod.

I dont understand at all the workings of these "Aid" promotions, they look rather redundant, could you clarify them?

They are not redudant at all. When it works as it should, it will makes stacks having many different types of units better than just those that have one sort. They all help out eachother. Scouting for better info in where and how the enemy army is placed, mounted units to hit the enemy in the flank and so on.

But it will also give some negatives if the stack is too large so you wont go around destroying everything with a Stack of Death. So a large crouded stack will be slower in movement and responce to attacks.

 

[[to_xp]Gekko]

They are not redudant at all. When it works as it should, it will makes stacks having many different types of units better than just those that have one sort. They all help out eachother. Scouting for better info in where and how the enemy army is placed, mounted units to hit the enemy in the flank and so on.

But it will also give some negatives if the stack is too large so you wont go around destroying everything with a Stack of Death. So a large crouded stack will be slower in movement and responce to attacks.

I like this man, I like it a lot. having stack combat would be even better, but this system of promotions is lightyears better than the vanilla combat system. keep it up !

 

[Zuul]

Ah thanks, you are the first for a long time to show some interest. Now I get more energy to compleate it.

 

[[to_xp]Gekko]

Don't be negative, there are lots of people that care about your mod, it's just that not ALL of them post on here for every new update
Your mod has been included in many great modpacks and this alone means your work is appreciated... I for one have included your 0.5 version in my very own modpack (it's almost done, but I have no place to upload it to, lol ) and waiting for 0.7

 

[GeneralMikeIII]

Don't be negative, there are lots of people that care about your mod, it's just that not ALL of them post on here for every new update
Your mod has been included in many great modpacks and this alone means your work is appreciated.

Yeah, what he said.

 

[Kael]

Zuul, I took my mod up to 102 promotions and didn't have any problems. I even applied them all to one unit (that was one buff unit!) using the worldbuilder without a problem.

Where do you see the crash?

It could be that the crash is because the file is beyond a certain size or some such, but it doesn't appear to be a hard limit of 97. If you want to PM me your promotion file I will switch it into my mod and see if the crash still occurs.

 

[SilentMage]

I recently updated my Promotions and Traits mod to 0.5. After making the change everything seemed fine until I attempted to load one of my saved games (which were created while using version 0.4:



This message pops up once it starts loading a saved game, which never happened before. Now I can't load any of my saved games!

The game worked just fine up until today, when this error came up. I know this might be related to this mod because up until I upgraded the mod everything worked fine. In addition, I attempted to start a new game instead of loading an old one and, yup, the game works perfectly!

Any thoughts on why this is, or if anyone else had experienced an error like this after upgrading from 0.4 to 0.5? I'd really like to finish my game as Ghandi.

 

[Kael]

I recently updated my Promotions and Traits mod to 0.5. After making the change everything seemed fine until I attempted to load one of my saved games (which were created while using version 0.4:



This message pops up once it starts loading a saved game, which never happened before. Now I can't load any of my saved games!

The game worked just fine up until today, when this error came up. I know this might be related to this mod because up until I upgraded the mod everything worked fine. In addition, I attempted to start a new game instead of loading an old one and, yup, the game works perfectly!

Any thoughts on why this is, or if anyone else had experienced an error like this after upgrading from 0.4 to 0.5? I'd really like to finish my game as Ghandi.

New anything invalidates save games. New units, new promotions, new buildings, anything. Think of it this way, a save game is a list of pointers (not a explicit list of all the objects and there properties), the pointers assume that the database (all of the xml they refer to) is the same. If its not the game crashes.

Or if you would prefer you could look at it from the perspective that Firaxis should have put a UID on all of the objects instead of just using the order they are in the files as the reference.

 

[SilentMage]

New anything invalidates save games. New units, new promotions, new buildings, anything. Think of it this way, a save game is a list of pointers (not a explicit list of all the objects and there properties), the pointers assume that the database (all of the xml they refer to) is the same. If its not the game crashes.

Or if you would prefer you could look at it from the perspective that Firaxis should have put a UID on all of the objects instead of just using the order they are in the files as the reference.

So if I want to finish my Ghandi game, I'll have to bump back my Promotions and Traits mod back to 0.4. I guess I'll do that, cuz I am THIS CLOSE to getting a diplo victory with him. Thanks for the info Kael.

I'll use 0.5 once I finish this game.

 

[Zuul]

Zuul, I took my mod up to 102 promotions and didn't have any problems. I even applied them all to one unit (that was one buff unit!) using the worldbuilder without a problem.

Where do you see the crash?

It could be that the crash is because the file is beyond a certain size or some such, but it doesn't appear to be a hard limit of 97. If you want to PM me your promotion file I will switch it into my mod and see if the crash still occurs.

Yes it could be the size (excluding uncommented stuff). I will check the crash again after I have updated the mod, and give you info how to reproduse it if it's still in.

 

[Kael]

Yes it could be the size (excluding uncommented stuff). I will check the crash again after I have updated the mod, and give you info how to reproduse it if it's still in.

Sounds good, let me know.