I am skeptical
- Thread starter coolegg
- Start date
Suspiria
Warlord
It looks way less cartoonized than Civ 4 was...I love the look and feel of the units and maps...Im not big on the menu graphics...
Dark_Jedi06
"Deus ex Machina."
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Cartoonish (CivRev):
Non-cartoonish (Civ5):
Are we looking at the same game?
Spoiler :
Non-cartoonish (Civ5):
Spoiler :
Are we looking at the same game?
To clarify, when I expressed concern that Civ 5 would be a "cartoonized" version of Civs 1 to 4 I wasn't so much referring to the graphics as the gameplay implied by the graphics. Look at the options available in the City View of Civ 4 attached. Based on the screenshots of Civ 5 that have been supplied so far do you think it is going to have the same level of complexity and hardcore "builder-style gameplay"? I think the indications are that it is going to be less.
Even in several of the preview reviews the game is being described as "more accessible than Civ 4". In my mind that is codeword for simplified gameplay and a departure from the hardcore builder gameplay which made the Civ franchise the Civ franchise.
It looks to me like Civ 5 might be part way between Civ 4 and Civ Rev - which I personally would find disappointing.
The other reason why I am skeptical is that the conventional thinking is that the hardcore builder game is dead - killed by the console. So is Civ 5 a revival? Probably not, and the screenshots seem to back up that skepticism.
So I am not getting too excited about Civ 5. But I will keep an open mind and maybe I will be pleasantly surprised.
Even in several of the preview reviews the game is being described as "more accessible than Civ 4". In my mind that is codeword for simplified gameplay and a departure from the hardcore builder gameplay which made the Civ franchise the Civ franchise.
It looks to me like Civ 5 might be part way between Civ 4 and Civ Rev - which I personally would find disappointing.
The other reason why I am skeptical is that the conventional thinking is that the hardcore builder game is dead - killed by the console. So is Civ 5 a revival? Probably not, and the screenshots seem to back up that skepticism.
So I am not getting too excited about Civ 5. But I will keep an open mind and maybe I will be pleasantly surprised.
Attachments
What complexities do you see there that we know won't be in? Religion/corps? Those were very simplistic and I have a feeling will be fleshed out in greater detail in an expansion. The culture bar? Culture/expansion will be far more complex in civ5 than border pop, border pop, border pop... Resources? More complex with limit builds on strategic resources. That (2) next to the iron and horses will actually matter now.
The screens (especially the city screen) have been deliberately simplified, in the name of accessibility, but the underlying complexity appears so far to be the same. Shafer said in the E3 interview that they had removed a lot of information from the default screens, but that much of it can be added back if the player desires. Hopefully that will be true.
The Civ V city screen is definitely way too sparse... I understand keeping the standard view as clutter-free as possible, but the whole point of double-clicking on a city is that you want to see more information.
I still miss the little population icons from Civ 3 and previous.
The Civ V city screen is definitely way too sparse... I understand keeping the standard view as clutter-free as possible, but the whole point of double-clicking on a city is that you want to see more information.
I still miss the little population icons from Civ 3 and previous.
Mercade
the Counsellor
While I don't share your skepticism, Cooleggie, welcome to Civfanatics.
Schuesseled
Deity
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it has that amount of detail in it, the food gold production summary is still at the top left, the buildings are oveer on the right combined with the specialists. They just did really well at conserving space allowing for the view of the world inside the city screen to be expanded and zoomed out.
Spoiler :
Its all still there it just gives the impression of being simplified notice, the plus minus icons on the tabs on the right, they can be minimised and maximisied to reveal more information or more of the map.
the build queue is hidden away under the choose production tab.
The only things that are noticibly missing is the minimap, religions. at first i thought the automate functions were missing but there there, citizen allocation focus, at the top right.
There's not the same amount of detail. There's no information on trade routes, maintenance costs, happiness, food, ethnic breakdown, great person production %. Of course the sliders and religion stuff is gone, because that's not in the game. I certainly hope there are more options to display some of this information, and that the information itself is not also gone from the game, because that would indeed be disappointing.
The special resources stuff is also gone. I noticed that there's information on strategic resources on the top bar of the main display, but this doesn't tell you what resources are available to this particular city.
I do like how the specialist buildings have clear "slots" that you can assign population to. That's a big improvement over the Civ IV specialist system, which I never liked and is very non-intuitive.
The special resources stuff is also gone. I noticed that there's information on strategic resources on the top bar of the main display, but this doesn't tell you what resources are available to this particular city.
I do like how the specialist buildings have clear "slots" that you can assign population to. That's a big improvement over the Civ IV specialist system, which I never liked and is very non-intuitive.
Ambassador
Peacemonger
Still, I miss a closer city view, with all the buildings in it.
Does anyone say that the screen is already finished?
Peng Qi
Emperor
Ethnic breakdown isn't necessary anymore as city flipping is out (thank God). Happiness or at least something represented by smiley faces is at the top left (17 in that screen). Trade routes, maintenance costs, and other economic information might be visible if you click on "gold" or something as far as you know. Food is right there above production on the top right. Great people might not be produced in the same way.
So out of all the things you listed, the only noticeably missing one is great people.
Schuesseled
Deity
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Just because you can't see it doesn't mean its there. boot up civ 4 and tell me you can see your gold or production breakdowns without having to mouse over them. tooltips are a great way of revealing more information when you want it, and not cluttering up the screen when you don't. And it fits perfectly with the amount of minimising going on.
All the builing tabs can be hidden away at a click, the citizen allocation focus (the auto menu to right of the queue in civ 4) can also be clicked away. The queue can be revealed or hidden, the choose production menu is hidden until needed. It would follow suit, would it not that the things that are missing are just hidden.
Trade routes - Under gold breakdown, tooltip.
Maintenance Costs - Gold breakdown
Happiness - You can clearly see the net happiness at the top of the screen in taht little bar.
Ethinic breakdown - Might not be in, but i its hidden its probably a tool tip when mousing over the citizen:11 box.
Great person production - Would slide nicely into culture tooltip.
Food! - Its in that citizen box I just mentioned. And its net food which is nice, so another breakdown will be there, so tahts where health will appear if its in the game.
As for strategic resources, well done for noticing the net resources at the top, it doesn't really need to say if the resources are in the city, the net resources could vanish from the abr if looking at a city not connected. Or hopefully they'll remain and you'll just get a large imposing notice saying the city has no trade route, and no access to resources.
Civ 5 looks simplified to a point of sheer stupidity, till you get out the magnifying glass, and see the intricate network of complicity.
Did anyone say that the screen is NOT already finished?
There. What I just said is just as meaningless as what you just said.
Peng Qi
Emperor
I like how you totally ignored all of the legitimate points people made to instead opt to try to claim that a perfectly valid argument is invalid.
Schuesseled
Deity
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I agree, the point whether or not its finished becomes mute if you look at the evidence of it already being finished from my post.
Aramel
Warlord
One of their specific design goals for this game was to remove the excessive information clutter that ends up confusing newer players, while giving experienced players the option to enable more of that information. Therefore, it's hardly surprising that the city screen under default settings would have less information than in Civ 4.
M
Me,myself,and,I
Guest
Well let's see, so your saying that if they show you an Alpha screen, you should assume thats what the finished game will look like?
Spoiler :
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