I must be doing something wrong in the early game?

Solinus

Chieftain
Joined
Jan 12, 2004
Messages
23
Okay, here's my predicament. I've been playing Civ ever since Civ1. I loved Civ2 and Civ3, played both on the intermediate diff settings and sometimes even the harder ones, and could win on them too. I bought Civ4 when it came out, but haven't had the time to start playing until recently. (Don't ask! :) )

Anyway, I have one real glaring problem with doing well in Civ4, and it happens in both vanilla and BTS: City upkeep. I've read a lot of the newbie help posts and I already know a lot about the very early game tactics. I build a few cities, I defend those cities, I work the tiles around them, I build barracks and walls, I avoid riots.

Somewhere about the fourth or sixth city though, things start to get really f-ed up. My city upkeep costs begin to skyrocket with every new city, meaning I have to keep knocking down the science slider. Eventually, that expansion ends up pulling my slider down to around 20%. I don't have to explain why 20% and ~60 turns for Iron Working is bad, do I? ;)

Oh, and I can't solve it because I don't have banks, grocers or courthouses at this point in the game. If I keep working through it, don't get attacked, etc etc, I can eventually just build up a massive ton of improvements, build wealth, etc etc, that all fixes the money issue and then go on to crush my opponents in the late game. But usually, this issue is so crippling that I can't get past it.

Any advice?
 
Oh, and I can't solve it because I don't have banks, grocers or courthouses at this point in the game. If I keep working through it, don't get attacked, etc etc, I can eventually just build up a massive ton of improvements, build wealth, etc etc, that all fixes the money issue and then go on to crush my opponents in the late game. But usually, this issue is so crippling that I can't get past it.

Any advice?

You said it yourself. You simply can't expand that fast until you do have the techs that allow these buildings. Usually that means no more than 4 cities at the beginning until you get Code of Laws and Courthouses. Don't worry what the AI is doing, just limit your early expansion until you can afford it.
 
Solinus is having the same problem I'm having.

People say to only build 4 or 5 cities ... but the AI builds twice that many. If that AI declares war on you (and it often does), you're done. Your 4 or 5 cities can't outproduce the waves of units the AI sends. You'll eventually lose due to attrition.
 
overexpanding in a civ3 style is a killer now

try picking a FINANCIAL leader, and knock out cottages rather then farms esp on floodplains, also work sea tiles for the extra cash

don't bother building city improvements unless/until you need them (eg - a barracks/stable if that city isn't going to churn out units, or aquaducts if health isn't a problem)

when warring, pillage plenty and don't be afraid to raze cities

good luck:goodjob:
 
Solinus is having the same problem I'm having.

People say to only build 4 or 5 cities ... but the AI builds twice that many. If that AI declares war on you (and it often does), you're done. Your 4 or 5 cities can't outproduce the waves of units the AI sends. You'll eventually lose due to attrition.

The goal is not to build 4-5 cities only, but to build 4-5 cities in the beginning of the game, because at that time, your economy can't handle more. But after this phase, you should expand to much more, or you will lose every time. Or you should have a good strategy for this situation.
 
People say to only build 4 or 5 cities ... but the AI builds twice that many. If that AI declares war on you (and it often does), you're done. Your 4 or 5 cities can't outproduce the waves of units the AI sends. You'll eventually lose due to attrition.

Read this walk through and see exactly how one city can outproduce entire AI nations.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=231222
 
Code of Law and Couthouses to reduce the maintenance is one side of it. The other is obviously getting more money... The important thing here is - as already mentioned bu one of the previos posters - COTTAGES.

The important thing is to build the cottages early, and to actually work them, so they can grow. This is where city specialization comes into play. A city working just ricerside cottages to grow them (and to harvest the money of course) will have very low production. But its ok - it will pay for your production cities.
 
Cottages!! Courthouses are almost never worth it before monarchy at the latest.
 
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