IMMaw Suleiman : Alone In The Dark

[BornInCantaloup]

On my door, a dull brass plate says "Private detective".
The few friends I have call me Carnby ; the others call me the Reptile.
I don't care to think what my banker calls me.
These days, I leave my letters unopened ; bills and threats to send in the receivers just ruin my day.



The attorney's letter came as a deep shock to me.
My uncle Jeremy had died by his own hand !
The coroner's report was unequivocal : he hanged himself in the loft.
My initial surprise and distress past, I considered the news ; it seemed clear that Derceto had exercised a thoroughly morbid influence on my uncle's mind.

​

 

[BornInCantaloup]

Ready ? Reload ?
Don't be a fool : run !

In this installment of the Immortal Always War series, we start as Suleiman of the Ottoman Empire.


The map is a Pangaea with everything standard except for :
- Low sea level ;
- Natural coast line ;
- No huts, no events ;
- Handpicked opponents.

The crew onboard is made of : Catherine the Great, Hannibal of Carthage, Julius Caesar, Mansa Musa, Shaka Zulu and Wang Kon.


Here's the start :



Take a deep breath,
Make yourself comfortable,
Good luck !

 

[Rusten]

Now I know where the makers of Eternal Darkness got their inspiration from. Spooky.

 

[dutchfire]

1) Turn resource bubbles on
2) settle 1SW?

 

[BornInCantaloup]

Spooky since 1992, Rusten. Scared the kid out of me.

1) Turn resource bubbles on
2) settle 1SW?

Yes to all

 

[Rusten]

Tech trading is on for this which changes a few things. Can't play as conservative. Before the game I figured the GW was a must for espionage later, but with such a good capital maybe you can get away without it. I still think I'll make it a priority though, it synergizes well with both IMP and PHI. An early settled GSpy will be very good.
Harder to get a good choke going here too without the DW so there's time to make the GW.

Nasty neighbours.

 

[BornInCantaloup]

I've thought Wang Kon might be over the top...
... And then I clicked and found this map. Maybe having your own Catapults is the best defence against Hwachas. Or mounted as you've shown in the last map.
I think it's pretty clear, though, that there won't be a single win-it-all unit, in this game, and forces will have to be mixed.

The Great Wall + PHI is a tremendous combo that, I think, guarantees tech parity until the very late game. At least until Cavalries or, should I say, Cossacks.
I don't know how safe it can be but it is conspicuous to me that the most dangerous wonder builders were left aside (Huayna, Qin, etc. those dudes).
Wang starts with Mysticism and Mining... he might get a fast GW. Him again !

 

[dutchfire]

Impi's Praets and Skirmishers? That'll be hard.

 

[BornInCantaloup]

There are concessions to be made to a strong start...



On early wonders :
Apart from the GW, there's also the Oracle to consider.
Oracle --> Monarchy can be extremely strong, allowing unlimited growth from very early on and as a headstart towards Feudalism.
Getting both of these would be the nuts. We can see +12 food surplus for the capital in the opening screen.



First warrior moves :
Explore for city 2 and kill the scouts for Woodsman 2 promo ?

 

[Rusten]

True that. I will try to get both of those if possible. Play around it as much as the map allows. But overall the one wonder I truly want is TGW.

There is something to be said about not polluting the GP pool, though. Once CS kicks in you really want to have your 2nd Great Spy for the Scotland Yard and not a prophet.

 

[BornInCantaloup]

You're right and the pollution is even worse for Scientists.
I'd be more worried about never getting an Academy than about the 2nd Spy, with the Oracle + GW combo.
I didn't have Scotland Yard in mind, though. I like settling the earliest Great Spy and then usually go for infiltration missions (a single infiltration mission for about 5000 takes one to the Renaissance). But... depending on the capital, with Bureaucracy bonuses... I can see the Scotland Yard paying off nicely.
I think I've never gone full on espionage.


For an Academy,
Prolly a peripheral city should be tasked with popping a Scientist for GP n°2. In this case, growing it is key.
However, whether one can spare the hammers for this or not remains to be seen. If the cap builds wonders, it would be the logical task of city 2 to train settlers.


All this talk about wonders and GPs is very greedy
I like it like that.
The obvious downside is the hammer cost towards Empire development. A GP, a couple wonders... we're looking at the cost of 3 settlers or more.
Thankfully, being IMP can make up for that, slightly.
Also, it shows how crucial worker stealing will be to afford those shinies. Chop, chop, chop.


I've played to T16 and am still alive
Now got a decision to make, prolly an easy one but I'll take this game with caution.

 

[dutchfire]

Preliminary thoughts: I'd rather spend my precious resources on pillaging Rome's iron than on optimizing a second city for an early academy.

 

[Rusten]

I think not making the SY would be a mistake. It's a very efficient way to get a commerce multiplier and you need markets and banks in this setting.
I'll probably skip on libraries. Very costly to make both science and wealth multipliers.

 

[BornInCantaloup]

Preliminary thoughts: I'd rather spend my precious resources on pillaging Rome's iron than on optimizing a second city for an early academy.

Yes, that's probably the wise state of mind.
I don't count the times I've lost to my own greed.


@ Rusten :
Foregoing self-research entirely, then ?
Hmm... I'm not sure if I'm ready for that. It's interesting.

 

[BornInCantaloup]

ooops

 

[Rusten]

My very first SG was an all-espionage one (ungy-01). It works.
But I'll probably get library and academy in capital still if possible. It's nice to have the capacity for limited research towards a crucial technology. But I don't think it's worth it empire-wide. 90 hammers for a library is a lot considering you'll spend most of the game below 50% science slider. Probably closer to 25%.

Played 15 turns and had a much stronger start than last time.
I'll probably play this one very slow and cautiously as well. Can't afford any mistakes.

 

[Rusten]

3400 BC

Spoiler :

Yeah, it's short I know, but it's such a crucial stage.

Was delighted to find another source of pigs when settling. Furthermore there's seems to be room to settle behind the capital later without enemy interference.

Was not delighted however, to find JC so close to home.
But it works out brilliantly as I get the opportunity to snag an important worker and set him back. Big moves. I didn't even need woodsman as all of his improvable tiles were in the 2nd ring.



But now there's a big decision to be made. Do I commit to taking out JC early or do I go for wonders? I know that he doesn't have metal/horses in his starting BFC as everything is forested.

Do I count my lucky stars and pull back the warrior for scouting or do I go in for more?
My guess is JC will get an archer with attacking script now and kill my warrior, but maybe I can circle around him and disturb.
However, if I circle around JC then I might not be able to scout metal/horses in time.
Decisions.... Stopping here for now.

This got tense quickly.

Finally installed BUG for regular games. It was driving me crazy last game not having certain info and having to manually cancel all forest chops.

 

[BornInCantaloup]

My 3360 BC :

Spoiler :

Played similar to Rusten with a few differences.
I chanced my warrior on forest scouts at... 72% chances... Is that bad ? It may be bad. Such an early risk.

Anyway, that got me this turn 8 6xp warrior :

Spoiler :

He healed and retreated 1SW a few turns later, when approached by a lion.
That had him spot Julius' worker mining the marble.
So I got a t14 steal, there, and could pillage the mine on top of it.

Now the worker is on the way back :

Spoiler :

And this is where I stopped.
I suppose it's better to split the workers to improve the food and then double them on the gold.
But I'd like to see better what it gives if they double up to improve a food special faster. For now, I doubt that could make up for all the lost worker turns.

Not too sure about the tech path.
The wonder opening would go Myst into Masonry. Bronze is appealing, too, with 2 workers and lots of commerce.

Capital will go for a settler (or 2) at size 4. With all improved tiles, it will do 19 hammers per turn towards settlers.
Seen like that, maybe there's little use for BW just right now.

The warrior is definitely going to scout for city 2 :
Julius doesn't have a worker to steal anymore. We can return in 10+ turns to find the new one.

 

[BornInCantaloup]

3000 BC :

Spoiler :

Spoiler :

Got 2 more scouts on flatland and the initial warrior reached 10xp.
It can now go check Julius' marble tile again.


Splitting the workers worked out fine : the gold was improved the turn we grew to 4.
Also, due to lost worker turns (6 in total, if I'm not mistaken), doubling up the workers to improve the food tiles would accelerate the Rice by 1 turn... without accelerating any city growth... and would delay the Pigs by 1 turn. So there wouldn't be any net gain. Actually a net loss due to later improved gold.

Spoiler :

6-7 turns away from Masonry.
Now there's 3 options :
- either we complete the Warrior. Having a 3rd unit out could prove useful both for scouting and for promoting ;
- in this case it may be best to grow to size 5 on, say, the Barracks ;
- either we start straight on the settler and overflow into warrior --> Great Wall.

I think the chosen option should keep in mind the Great Wall's completion date :
- If we grow now, we're delaying the Settler by 1 turn (build takes 1 less turn but we take 2 turns to grow) ;
- If we grow now, we get extra hammers from 1 extra tile for some turns ;
- If we start on a settler at size 4, we get a huge overflow from Settler into GW, about 15 hammers. So there is some appeal to producing the settler at size 4, pumping 19H/t.
- On the other hand, if we grow to 5, we can improve a mine. The mine wouldn't be better than a forest silk to build the settler but would give a 3h/t advantage towards the Great Wall (extra pop + improved tile).

Just things to be pondered.
There seems to be benefits to growing to 5 right now.
The overflow hammers may not matter as much as those from the extra size + tile.
Also, there's the extra unit for map knowledge and early promotions.

 

[Rusten]

BiC (crosspost)

Spoiler :

Nice!
As for the risk, I don't know. It's a big gain to have woodsman-2 but if you lose the warrior you can't even explore properly in time. Hard to say. You'd need to win two of those if not on flatland which means <50% chance.

If city #2 is placed 1e of the cows* then perhaps mining->pottery->bw could be good. There's still time for masonry and the GW after. I'm getting my second city before the GW. Maybe even another whipped settler into it later. It doesn't go as early as SH and we don't have stone so it makes sense to chop it anyway.

I'll probably double workers on the rice -> gold. At least if I do the pottery path -- need the commerce then. But my captured worker is 1t behind yours.
Edit: Actually, thinking about it I agree with you on splitting the workers. Faster size 5.


*My default spot if I don't find anything to change matters.