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Immigration & Trade Caravans

Discussion in 'Civ5 - General Discussions' started by helpless_writer, Feb 20, 2010.

  1. helpless_writer

    helpless_writer Warlord

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    Immigration:

    Seriously, this is a key factor when it comes to any type of civilization. The Romans had a problem (and eventual) solution for this and its still a major political topic in modern history. Plus, when going against someone more tech advanced it should only be natural those behind him's or her's citizens to want to go there.

    And there should be +s & -s for that. One being (Albeit Einstein) type immigrants than of course those who just take up space and possibly may take you down a peg. I mean it should depend on your neighbors. If your neighbors are modern and your futuristic that means if your citizens are unhappy they leave with the tech knowledge with them. However, if your citizens are happy then you get additional people who may help or hurt you in the process.

    Also, I'm a big fan of R&F of civs. I think immigrants should lead to what starts some civilizations. Be it randomized or history based (america from england for example).

    Trade Caravans:

    The main reasons I think this should be added is solely to give pirates & barbarians some type of reason for being there. Pirates especially, I mean for god sakes Pirates didn't just roam the coast attacking ships! They attacked cities, took goods, kidnapped and such. I think it would be a good upgrade if they made trade vehicles for when your sending gold, rice or w/e and allow other users or the AI to take it.

    Taking the BTS Blockade feature it makes sense to do that. Plus, imagine the idea of kidnappings, organized crime and stuff like that (more geared towards mods or expansions but still). Then lets not forget this could help when it comes to making wonders in cities with little culture. Combining that with my immigration idea you can pool all your resources and resources from allies to one city to build a wonder rather than hope you spawn a great engineer.

    What you dudes think?
     
  2. helpless_writer

    helpless_writer Warlord

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    And on kidnappings I was thinking this could be for if you have monarchies, great spies, generals, doctors, ambassadors and such. If not for captured warriors and worker (prisoners of war)
     
  3. mitsho

    mitsho Deity

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    Yes and Yes, together with stability these are interesting concepts for a civilization game. I don't want to say how exactly, but these should be contenders for inclusion. It of course all then depends on the final gameplay..-
     
  4. ahmedhadzi

    ahmedhadzi Relocation Consultant

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    Someone also mentioned that there should be an option when you capture city that if there is any settled Great People there should be mechanic that they flee and go back to their original nation, or if you are more tech advanced they might be "willing" to join your nation. That mean that whole concept of great people could be geared towards immigration idea.
     
  5. CrimsonEmperor

    CrimsonEmperor Chieftain

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    I like that idea. Great people immigration. Other 'immigration' waves should be kept to events Id say.
     
  6. Kissamies

    Kissamies Prince

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    Migration is something I've wanted to see in these kind of games for a long time. Could make some ethnically interesting cities and have some more complex culture effects. I just can't figure out a good mechanism for it. That's probably why we haven't seen it yet. It's not simple to implement.
     
  7. Steenberger

    Steenberger Chieftain

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    NO Hatzeput!!! The Great peeps are mine! Mine alone! Noooo Mr. Van Gogh, don't leave.. please, my green card program is much more beneficial than anything those lousy egyptians can offer.
     
  8. Öjevind Lång

    Öjevind Lång Deity

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    Aahh! Frank Kafka is defecting to the Americans to play jazz! Having an Americanized name has gone to his head.
     
  9. Bangra 7

    Bangra 7 The Port Of Call

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    I just want the game.
    And that is a great idea - Immigration and caravans.
     
  10. helpless_writer

    helpless_writer Warlord

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    Also, thinking back, when you look at a city its a mixture of different cultures so really having a new city or your country overran due to a bad foreign civilization (or its destruction) should matter.
     
  11. WastedEfforts

    WastedEfforts Chieftain

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  12. helpless_writer

    helpless_writer Warlord

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    Taking what you said (minus the slight tinge of hatred) I think it would give more power to beginning an open border policy between two civilizations. Heck it would open the way for an Ellis Island wonder and embassys (which can be used to determine how your perceived in foreign lands)
     
  13. AriochIV

    AriochIV Colonial Ninja

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    In Galactic Civilizations II, when you establish a trade route, the income is abstracted (like in Civ IV) but there is a little "space lane" that appears on the map between the two planets, and little automated cargo ships run back and forth. These little ships can be interdicted by hostile forces, encouraging the player to patrol the routes to keep them clear. However, because it's a space game, the trade lanes are pretty much straight lines; this would be much harder to do in Civilization where the routes may have to follow a very circuitous path along the coasts.
     
  14. helpless_writer

    helpless_writer Warlord

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    Well considering in ciV that there will be higher maintenance cost for roads and no longer will we be making webs of roads, I think it's entirely possible that what happened in Galatic Civilizations could happen in ciV.
     
  15. The_Hess

    The_Hess Chieftain

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    If it can be made to work well in games then it is a fantastic idea. Trade routes formed a major part of history and shaped civilistations. Perhaps once countries build airports these trade routes switch format to air based routes. Planes can avoid enemy airspace but can still be attacked? This could lead to some far more realistic and interesting situations.

    The same for immigration, if it can be made to work then I'm all for it. Just don't rush it.
     
  16. Souron

    Souron The Dark Lord

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    That just make being behind such even more, and make it harder to catch up. I don't think it would make the game more fun, which, ultimately is what matters most.

    They had trade caravans in civ 1 and 2. In my opinion the trade mechanics in civ 3 and 4 were better.
     
  17. Souron

    Souron The Dark Lord

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    More problematic I think is when trade routes are over the ocean. Such roots did not historically prevent pirate activity, but in civ the rule for trade routes is that any path between to cities forms a route, even if it isn't the most direct.

    As a new idea: Barbarian highwaymen popping on fog of war roads would be a cool feature.
     
  18. StittsvilleJame

    StittsvilleJame Warlord

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    This sort of trade exists in Total War games as well, so it wouldn't be too hard to implement in civ, especially with less roads as you mention. Little boats or wagon zoom along roads and sea lanes, and it adds to the feel of the world, making it feel less static, imo.

    Besides, the game could just pick a road, even if there are numerous paths. Afterall, it's just an abstract representation of trade, not an actual "Traders only take this road" .
     
  19. Souron

    Souron The Dark Lord

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    Imagine an inland city on a distant continent, connected to two harbor cities. If one of the harbor cities gets blockaded, realistically you want all trade to be routed through the other city. You don't want obstructing such a path to work.

    From a graphical standpoint drawing traders could work, as long as it doesn't add a game play mechanic. But without such a mechanic, the traders would be confusing as it's not clear what their purpose is. It would also make the art ugly with detail.
     
  20. StStutter

    StStutter Warlord

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    I like the idea of some sort of trading mechanism. Trade was such an important aspect of history that I'm kind of dissapointed by the neglect given the feature.

    The immigration could be interesting. I do feel however, that more is not always better. Immigration should be added if there was a way to streamline the effect. I, personally, don't want to add complexity for the sake of adding complexity. I did like the sound of the great person idea though. Managing great people would not be too difficult but would add emphasis to maintaining happiness and perhaps certain policies.
     

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