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Immortal University 56 Pacal II

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Strategy & Tips' started by Habitus, May 21, 2011.

  1. Habitus

    Habitus Emperor

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2011
    Messages:
    1,138
    Location:
    UK
    Greetings, Immortals and would-be Immortals (and indeed any other players of any level), and welcome to the Immortal University.

    Here is our Leader:



    Here's the opening scene:



    This is the first start I rolled, Huts and Events are, as always, conspicuous by their absence.

    Before we start, here's the copy & paste bit where I get to pretend that I'm TMIT:

    To play, just extract the WB save file into your worldbuilder saves directory, then play it. Use custom scenario if you want some extra settings to tickle your fancy. This series was designed for people learning immortal, so most people here will be at that level or trying to attain it, although deity players are welcome also. Hell, if you want to play this on NOBLE, go ahead, but I'm not peeling off the AI bonuses. The intention of this and any other game thread I post is to get better. Play whatever level you need in order to improve. Just remember, there are immortal bonuses and that's not going to change unless you WB edit it.

    If you are aspiring IMM+, try to remember to add archery back to the barbs in WB. Every time you don't, a deity AI will kill a kitten, although there are a lot of kittens so it's not the end of the world if you prefer easymode barbs .

    I do request people to list their difficulty and speed. In terms of updates, well nobody follows that anyway. Post in the manner you feel comfortable. Typical comparison dates are 1 AD, liberalism, and victory/defeat, as well as any major events. If in doubt, go with that.

    We also have an initial Immortal/Normal autosave which is much more convenient since you can avoid all the worldbuilder shenanigans. It comes with my personal seal of approval (not least as my worldbuilder edits may contain hideous game-destroying errors that could cause your computer to explode) .
     

    Attached Files:

  2. iDagon

    iDagon Chieftain

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2011
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    53
    Location:
    Bucharest, Romania
    This start looks interesting.. Small peninsulas are allways fun to play.

    I'm guessing SIP. BW -> Fishing? And sent warrior NW and continue west..
    I can allmost bet that there is some other Food resource to the N beyond the channel.. Maybe pigs or smth..

    EDIT: also that one unforested file could hide horses..
     
  3. avw94

    avw94 Chieftain

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2011
    Messages:
    46
    Location:
    Here and There, Occasionally
    Looks intersting, though I hate forested starts. I'll give this one a shot after work
     
  4. iDagon

    iDagon Chieftain

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    Location:
    Bucharest, Romania
    I do have a question about this kind of start.. Is it worth puting a lot of those chops in say the mids or Oracle? Or is it better to just chop more settlers/workers. (provided you have good places to settle early)
     
  5. Habitus

    Habitus Emperor

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    We have 2 unforested tiles, the Riverside Grassland 1E (possiblility of Copper, Iron, or Uranium) and a Plains tile 2S1W in the fog, which also could be a visible resource.

    Yup SIP i would say, if no other food resources i'd say Fishing - BW, building a Worker until Fishing is researched, then switching to a Workboat working the 3 hammer tile to build it quickly then working the seafood to finish the worker. Thou i'd probably work out if BW - Fishing with chopping the Workboat out to see if that was faster.

    I possible would even go Warrior as tech Fishing then Workboat - Worker if i worked out alot of idle turns.
     
  6. Habitus

    Habitus Emperor

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    I wouldn't go for mids with no stone and not industrious, but Oracle i'd chop if i thought i needed it. If i remember right 1700BC is about as late as The Oracle is 'Safe' on Immortal.
     
  7. yatta77

    yatta77 Emperor

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2006
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    1,041
    Quick reply just say that I'm definitively not a fan of this leader, its traits, the UU, and neither the UB. And I don't like the starting position. So, of course! I'm in! :) :D :lol:
    yatta.
     
  8. lymond

    lymond Rise Up! (Phoenix Style!) Hall of Fame Staff

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    Wow...I consider Pacal one of the strongest leaders and he is a personal favorite. Great traits, a good resourceless anti-barb UU (of which you are only 1 tech from this unit), and the UB is actually quite good and very synergistic with his traits. You can get some whopping cities up early with Pacal.
     
  9. yatta77

    yatta77 Emperor

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2006
    Messages:
    1,041
    I was half serious and half self-ironic joking about another thread I started. :D
    The UU is actually pretty nice, at least if you are not as silly as I am to forget about it while playing. Yeah... I played a quite poor session.

    Immortal, Standard Speed, Session 1, Turn 66, 1360BC
    Spoiler :
    Moved the Warrior East. So now, where to settle? One East I gain a Grass Hill, so one East.
    Effects of Murphy's Law: I lost the Ivory.
    So let's build a WorkBoat! Ehm... no Fishing. And nothing to do with a Worker in the CFC for a while.
    Yeah, I know, it's unorthodox and not correct, but I picked Settler again, hoping for a good 2nd city spot at least.
    Spoiler :

    Warrior Scouting: not such a great land, except for the Stone. I have Mining: so... Masonry >> The Wheel I guess.
    I don't really want to reply the same game as Game #54, but I already see no alternatives here.
    Spoiler :

    I met few Civilizations, so to don't dilute them I directed all the Espionage points toward Gandhi.
    Spoiler :

    Next Pottery >> Writing
    Spoiler :

    Settler ready, WorkBoat next in the Capital, founded the Second City next to the Stone and started a Worker there.
    Spoiler :



    Workboat ready, The Capital starts building The Pyramids
    Spoiler :

    Turn 40, 2000BC Mansa Musa already Discovered The Alphabet! Ok, it's Immortal, but... it is this normal???
    Spoiler :

    Worker ready, next a Settler, Quarry finished, now a road to the Capital to connect the Stone.
    I'm starting researching The Alphabet in Turn 56, this Map is so Dry.
    Spoiler :

    Capital at size 5, :) Cap, waiting for the Stone.
    Spoiler :

    Turn 62, 1520BC, Mansa Musa already Discovered The Code of Laws!
    And not from The Oracle. Yeah, I'm generating a very low amount of Research, but again:
    Ok, it's Immortal, but... it is this normal???
    Spoiler :







    Capital connected, 22 Turns to The Pyramids, but the Second City have big problems with Barbarians, I switched production from Settler to a third Warrior, but I fear it is too late.
    Spoiler :

    Yes, it was.
    Spoiler :

    Turn 66, 39 turns for The Pyramids, again. I guess I might switch the Research from The Alphabet to Bronze Working, to Chop/Mine a couple of Hills, but I dont know yet.
    Spoiler :



    Well, at least Diplomatically it's going fine so far.
    Spoiler :

    First Attempt, no Cheats, no Reloads.
    Screen Shots in the Spoiler, Game Save Attached.

    Greetings,
    yatta.
     
  10. TheMeInTeam

    TheMeInTeam Top Logic

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2008
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    25,680
    Pacal has had some of the harder games in the IU despite his status as top tier. Maybe RNG gods will be merciful to him this time <3.
     
  11. yatta77

    yatta77 Emperor

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2006
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    1,041
    Spoiler :
    With already half the Tech Tree Discovered in BCs, seems like Mansa Musa will colonize Alpha Centauri sometimes around 1200AD... Job now, details later.
    If someone is playing this, I'd like to read some comments.
    yatta.
     
  12. Knightly_

    Knightly_ Warlord

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2009
    Messages:
    271
    Location:
    Münster, Ger
    Spoiler :

    Haha techspeed of Mansa is really insane. Alphabet 1920 BC :eek:. I bet something like double riverside gold...
     
  13. Knightly_

    Knightly_ Warlord

    Joined:
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    Location:
    Münster, Ger
    Spoiler :

    ...and he lets me know it:



    :D

    Btw does such a gift add to WFYABTA limit ?

    edit: I played until 1AD and GLH is really keeping me in the race. I clearly missplayed some stuff. I missed the spots a few tiles north because i built GLH first. Gandhi got a barb city near me which he captured. I can get 7 cities and i am planing to make an uber bureaucracy capital. Hopefully everyone declares on Gandhi soon and i can grab a few citites then...

     
  14. lymond

    lymond Rise Up! (Phoenix Style!) Hall of Fame Staff

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    Spoiler :
    Why Gandhi did not capitulate to me after taking more than half his cities including Delhi (shrine/GLH and some other wonder) is the most baffling thing ever. He's usually so easy to vassal. I had 2 consecutive peace treaties with Zara to prevent a stupid Gandhi vassaling to him. However, my plan fell through when Gandhi did not cap at the right time. As expect, he vassals to Zara and now I'm at war on 2 fronts. Fought off Zara but it just turning into a slog, even after actually getting a nice tech advantage on everyone but whatever insanity Mansa had going on - never saw him. Anyway, I have 12 cities but need to finish off a dern island city of Gandhis. :mad:

    This should a have been much easier had things gone my way. I can still win it but it's an uphill battle now.
     
  15. obsolete

    obsolete Deity

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    Too easy...

    Spoiler :
    Stupid Ghandi supplied one holy city after another to me...


    I decide to give him a little break at his last city so I can get more goodies. I simply see no point in continuing from here...

     
  16. yatta77

    yatta77 Emperor

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    Spoiler :






    And I'm pretty sure I got another Cheap Tech Gifted... :D

    In Turn 102, 325BC, Philosophy (Mansa Musa) and Theology were Discovered.



    I finished that second session in Turn 114, 25BC.
    A :culture: Victory would be a decent option so far, if, as said above, Mansa Musa won't colonize Alpha Centari in 1200AD... :lol:

    Greetings,
    yatta.
     
  17. obsolete

    obsolete Deity

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    I decided to do another deity stomp but this time go after the 'Green Giant' target.

    I finally got the dumb-f@ck to vassal after warring on and off for a while. But on the same turn he vassaled to me, he broke off and insta-declared war on me because I demanded a tribute.

    What a horrible mechanic Firaxis designed here.
     
  18. yatta77

    yatta77 Emperor

    Joined:
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    Immortal, Standard Speed, Session 3, Turn 132, 425AD
    Spoiler :

    Positive :gold: at 100% :science:
    Spoiler :

    Here it is Aesthetics, let's fill up the Tech Tree some more
    Spoiler :

    Picked Drama targeting Music, but again...
    Turn 126, 275AD, Gandhi Discovers Music: what's wrong with those guys?!
    Spoiler :

    Few Tech Trades trying to catch up for the Sistine Chapel
    Spoiler :



    Turn 132, 425AD: 14 Turns to the Great Engineer who will build the Sistine Chapel, in the Second City. Then Caste System and 3-4 Representation Artists in the Capital.
    Spoiler :

    The major issue now is the lack of a Third Wanna-Be Legendary City: Barbarian right in the beginning, Zara second, and Gandhi last by just few turns are cutting me out from previously chosen Second City Spots.
    I had to settle the Second City next to Capital, and I have to invent something with a Galley and a Settler to found a Third City.
    Quite fun till now. And quite an uncommon and unpredictable Game for so many reasons...

    First Attempt, no Cheats, no Reloads.
    Screen Shots in the Spoiler, Game Saves* Attached.
    *(end of this session and end of the previous, second, session).

    Edit - As always:
    • Comments are Welcome :)
    • Advices are Appreciated :goodjob: (but I can't promise I will follow them :D)
    • Sarcasm is Accepted :rolleyes: (and friendly returned :p)
    • Absurdities... are barely Ok. :lol:
    Greetings,
    yatta.
     
  19. yatta77

    yatta77 Emperor

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    I opened only Knightly_ spoilers till now (and after playing a good number of turns), since I could guess they were likely answering mine. But now, before continuing with my game,...
    Spoiler :
    ...since in order to have a chance to win this game myself I decided to gamble again everything on an Hail Mary Pass :culture: Victory, so further information won't really influence my future moves...
    ...I guess there is nothing wrong with lurking a bit in lymond and obsolete spoilers...
    Spoiler :
    ...and find out they are just about some nice played early war campaigns! :lol: <- self-irony here, of course ;)
    • One was a bit unfair/unlucky on Capitulation issues, but from the report (12 total cities) seems succesful anyways :goodjob:.
    • While the other, with positive results and played on Deity, was even claimed to be easy! :goodjob:
      (no wonder here, after reading about some of the other games played)
    What was next? Did you continue play the map? Did you achieve a Victory? A Partial Target (Liberalism Race, ...)? Did you manage to handle Mansa Musa Tech rate?
    Uhm... I understand that it might be quite irritating that a Cease-Fire treaty cannot be broken before 10 turns, while a Capitulation can in the same exact turn. What Tribute did you ask?

    Anybody else is playing this map?

    Greeting,
    yatta.
     
  20. Noogai

    Noogai Still Just a Settler

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2008
    Messages:
    237
    Location:
    Finland / HK
    Am I the only one who has trouble with food in these games recently?
    Anyway I oracled MC and built colossus. 1000AD I got MT from Lib.
    Then I started cavalry rush against our western neighbor but somehow he/she got rifling fast even though he/she didn't even have gunpower or anything when I declared. And it's not cool to kill several riflemen from behind 80% cultural defences.
    Dunno if I'm gonna continue or not.. I should though for the principal.
     

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