Infinity War (spoilers within)

[Arwon]

It's really good, hey. I recommend seeing it quickly. And since it's really Thanos' movie you can get away only having a fairly vague sense of who the Marvel heroes are and with not having seen many (maybe even any?) of the previous movies.

I suspect when the rest of the world gets it there's gonna be people wanting to discuss it.

 

[Cutlass]

I'm looking forward to it. I've been a big fan of the series so far.

 

[EgonSpengler]

I haven't seen it yet, so I've nothing to say on the movie, but can I suggest putting "spoilers" in the thread title? I hate reading a whole thread of those drop-down windows in every post.

 

[Arwon]

There ya go

 

[BenitoChavez]

Alright so since this is a spoiler thread, I guess I'll kick things off. This is your last warning, spoilers below!

So whose death is permanent? My guess is nobody who died when Thanos snapped is permanent. Reason being Sebastian Stan is signed on for a bazillion more movies and there is no way Marvel kills off Spiderman and Black Panther as they are relatively new and huge money makers. So the remaining heroes have to find a way to reverse it somehow. I don't think Gamora is dead either since I've heard they want to do a Guardians 3 and it would be weird without her. That leaves Vision, Loki, and Heimdall. Loki in particular has to be final since they made such a big deal about it, it would be cheap to back out now.

Also no Sherlock reference between Cumberbatch and Downey was a missed opportunity.

 

[BenitoChavez]

And since it's really Thanos' movie you can get away only having a fairly vague sense of who the Marvel heroes are and with not having seen many (maybe even any?) of the previous movies.

That is probably true but there are so many moments that are more impactful if you've seen the other Marvel movies. If you haven't then the significance might be lost. An example is in Age of Ultron, Stark sees a vision of all the Avengers dead and him alive. That vision exemplifies his character. It is his greatest fear and avoiding that coming true it is what has driven him throughout the latest movies. Then in Infinity War he sees his friends die in front of him while he is alive...well it just means so much more knowing the background.

 

[Arwon]

Alright so since this is a spoiler thread, I guess I'll kick things off. This is your last warning, spoilers below!

So whose death is permanent? My guess is nobody who died when Thanos snapped is permanent. Reason being Sebastian Stan is signed on for a bazillion more movies and there is no way Marvel kills off Spiderman and Black Panther as they are relatively new and huge money makers. So the remaining heroes have to find a way to reverse it somehow. I don't think Gamora is dead either since I've heard they want to do a Guardians 3 and it would be weird without her. That leaves Vision, Loki, and Heimdall. Loki in particular has to be final since they made such a big deal about it, it would be cheap to back out now.

Also no Sherlock reference between Cumberbatch and Downey was a missed opportunity.

Even ignoring contracted future movies, the Snap deaths cannot be permanent, just because killing half the universe locks down future storytelling possibilities. How do you make more movies, Netflix series or TV shows set on earth with half the population dead and have them be about anything other than the unprecedented catastrophe that's just destroyed society? There's a few interesting stories to tell there set in the chasos that's befalling Earth, and I hope we get some, but there'd have to ultimately be a reset button.

The Snap clears the way for the next movie to be focusing on the surviving heroes (most of whom aren't contracted past Avengers 4 and might well be done after that) trying to reverse it, which is pretty much what the corresponding comic series was about anyway.

I strongly suspect the pre-Snap deaths (Loki, Gamora at least) will not be reversed by another Snap or by preventing it, however. Either she's still alive in the Soul Stone or GoTG 3 is going to have to deal with the consequences of Gamora dying I reckon.

 

[GoodEnoughForMe]

(Spoilers about both Infinity War and spoiler-y potential discussion about Avengers 4 with actual spoiler info based on set photos and actor/director interviews and stuff?)

Spoiler :

Gamora is in the next Avengers movie for sure, whether that means she gets brought back to life or is in the Soul World or appears as an apparition or flashback or something, who knows. I feel like bringing her back to life would make Thanos' sacrifice a little more meaningless but, the reality is all the deaths at the end are sort of meaningless in that shareholders and Disney and money exists. It takes 5 seconds to both look up what movies are in the pipeline and what everyone's contract situation with Disney is.

The dude who runs the MCU has said repeatedly that Captain Marvel will be far and away the most powerful hero of all the movies, and it won't even be close. And the next Ant-Man and Wasp movie deals with them accessing the quantum realm or whatever it is called where rules about time and space and all don't necessarily apply. So that's a potential time travel/alternate reality plot development. And they're both in the next Avengers. We also know there are tons of set photos from Avengers 4 and some actors have divulged stuff in interviews.

My rudimentary guess is that we time travel back to the Battle of New York (the directors have said it all comes back to that, and there are set photos of all the heroes there wearing outfits from all different time periods, which would be the time travel element. Some of the actors have also mentioned there's a scene with every single MCU superhero and Shield character in battle or something.) where the Avengers, all back together, and now with all the new characters, get at Thanos then, and some of the original movie Avengers die. Or maybe part of what makes Captain Marvel so powerful in these movies is that in her Binary character she can bring back life. Maybe it requires a sacrifice (sort of like Thanos) did to do so, thus the 'old' crew dies while the newer characters come back. Or maybe ALL of this is wrong.

Anyways, I liked IW. It handled the amount of characters way better than I expected. I honestly expected a cluster-you-know-what. I didn't really like Spiderman's role, sadly, nor how it treated Wakanda and Black Panther. But the humour, while familiar, was on point, and it was overall a very fun experience. Visually stunning too. Also Dr Strange was better in this than his actual movie lol.

 

[Gori the Grey]

So the remaining heroes have to find a way to reverse it somehow

That was my sense when I watched it: that the plot of the next three or four movies will be the remaining characters trying to retrieve the Time Stone and reverse what was done in this movie.

I even think it will turn out that Strange knowingly (temporarily) sacrificed half of the galaxy's population as a gambit to prepare for the 1 in 14 million ways that the Avengers (eventually) win.

 

[GoodEnoughForMe]

I even think it will turn out that Strange knowingly (temporarily) sacrificed half of the galaxy's population as a gambit to prepare for the 1 in 14 million ways that the Avengers (eventually) win.

Agreed. For a dude who was adamant about Iron Man and Spiderman dying if that's what it took to protect the Time Stone, his offer of the stone for Stark's life like 2 seconds later leads me to believe he saw this as being the only way. Or at least, that Stark needs to be alive (to sacrifice himself later, formulate a plan, whatever).

 

[Gori the Grey]

Also the thing he said back to Stark after the fact: "This was the only way" or something like that.

 

[EgonSpengler]

I saw it over the weekend. One of the most amazing things about it, to me, was the pacing. For all that the movie crammed in, it didn't feel rushed or overstuffed to me, and as long as it was, it didn't feel like a grind. The crossover team-ups were all fun. Thor and the Guardians together was great. Tony Stark and Dr. Strange was great. Of course I always want to see more of Steve and Natasha, but there was nothing I would take out in order to fit more of them in (I guess what I really want is "Captain America 4" with Johansson as a co-star, or Steve to co-star in Black Widow).

James Brolin is the clear MVP, and the cgi for Thanos and his minions was probably the best of the non-human beings in the series so far. I don't want to jinx us and declare that Marvel has "solved its villain problem", but they do seem to be on a roll. I think Steven DeKnight wrote one template for a good Marvel villain, with Wilson Fisk, as someone with understandable motives, but whose methods are nutso.

I really liked the ending. It's maybe a little too obvious that many/most/all of the people who disintegrated aren't really dead, and it's the people who are left behind who are in the most jeopardy, but I don't know how the writers could have handled it any better. As one reviewer I heard pointed out, the characters don't know there's another movie coming. Tony losing Peter Parker and Steve's "Oh, God..." at the end were both effective and affecting.

Nick Fury's pager dropping to the pavement with the red-blue-and-gold logo on it was kind of cool. "Motherf-" was the perfect exit line, too, even if it was a little too meta. What can I say, I'm a nerd.



So, will Agents of SHIELD disintegrate half of their characters in the next episode? I would have said surely not, but they did reference the 2nd Battle of New York and Thanos' invasion of Earth in the last couple episodes, so maybe they'll do it. It would be ballsy as heck if they did it, especially since (a) this could be the series' final season, and (b) if they do get picked up for a 6th season, it would air entirely before Avengers 4 is released. So if Avengers 4 takes place shortly after the ending of Infinity War, Agents of SHIELD season 6 would have to take place after Avengers 4; or, if Avengers 4 takes place roughly a year after the events of Infinity War, any SHIELD characters who disappeared would be gone for the entire season. Likewise, season 2 of Luke Cage and season 3 of Daredevil are expected to premier before Avengers 4, and again, it would take some stones for the writers of those shows to fold this pseudo-Rapture into their stories. And it couldn't just be incidental - "Hey, has anybody seen Foggy?" - it would have to be a big moment, even if the characters in those shows don't have a clue what's going on and can't do anything about it.

 

[BenitoChavez]

Of course I always want to see more of Steve and Natasha, but there was nothing I would take out in order to fit more of them in (I guess what I really want is "Captain America 4" with Johansson as a co-star, or Steve to co-star in Black Widow).

Yeah, that was the one major flaw I had with the film. Both of them have been major characters so far but they weren't given much to do other than tag along with Vision and Wanda as they try to figure out what to do.

Other minor issues I had was Thanos (Thanos's? Thanos'?) plan. First of all it is at best a temporary fix. Half the population is still alive so after a while the universe is going to repopulate and be back in the same situation. Unless Thanos plans on snapping at regular intervals I don't see how it solves anything. Second, if he has all the stones he could just at easily doubled the resources of the universe, or make it so life doesn't need to consume resources, or some other more benign solution. Instead he takes the evil route. I understand why the writers made him evil because without that there is no movie, and the movie has to movie.

The final issue what during the scene when they are on Titan and Thanos is incapacitated. It took Tony/Peter forever to try to get the gauntlet off. It was an immersion breaker for me. A brief one but it was there nonetheless.

 

[Cutlass]

Saw it last night. Haven't fully processed yet. While I liked the movie overall, I'm left with mixed ideas about it.

 

[tjs282]

Also no Sherlock reference between Cumberbatch and Downey was a missed opportunity.

Never mind that, when is Doctor Strange going to meet [that SHIELD agent who interviewed Bucky in Civil War, played by Doctor Watson Martin Freeman]? That should be where that kind of fun starts...

That was my sense when I watched it: that the plot of the next three or four movies will be the remaining characters trying to retrieve the Time Stone and reverse what was done in this movie.

Mine too. No way that Marvel/Disney goes to all that trouble to get Spidey back (and make a reportedly kick-arse Black Panther movie, which I really ought to see sometime), and then kill off not one but both of them on their very next outing...

And audience expectations have some bearing too. My boys are closer to the target audience of the MCU than I am/we are (if we're honest with ourselves! ), and they were not happy with the ending of IW at all — so it's pretty clear that there's going to (have to) be some kind of reset done to 'fix' that...

"Motherf-" was the perfect exit line, too, even if it was a little too meta.

Ha! (I watched the German dub, but) I knew it! I knew that was what he really said!

 

[EgonSpengler]

Ha! (I watched the German dub, but) I knew it! I knew that was what he really said!

Yeah, it was almost a little too Samuel L. Jackson, but it worked (and, let's face it, Nick Fury was reimagined as Sam Jackson even before Sam Jackson actually played him).

For a split-second there, I hoped that the screen of Fury's little pager would show a white "4" in a white circle on a royal blue background, but Captain Marvel probably makes more sense.