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Iraq protests

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by Socrates99, Jan 2, 2020.

  1. Broken_Erika

    Broken_Erika Nothing

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    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-51062369
    https://twitter.com/elizapalmer/status/1215525563961630720?
     
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  2. hobbsyoyo

    hobbsyoyo Deity

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    Can you even call it a cover up if it happens in public view?
     
  3. Broken_Erika

    Broken_Erika Nothing

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    By arresting any member of the public that speaks up of course.
     
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  4. Estebonrober

    Estebonrober Deity

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    it’s like a trump cover up! I didn’t ask for Russian meddling in elections! “Russia if you’re listening. . .”
     
  5. hobbsyoyo

    hobbsyoyo Deity

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    I wonder what people on the ground in Iran think about it?

    I'd mostly be pissed that Trump created the necessary conditions for this tragedy if I were them. I am mostly pissed about that and I'm completely detached from what happens over there.
     
  6. rah

    rah Deity Supporter

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    Trump is guilty of a lot of crap, but accidentally shooting down the plane is not one of them. Yeah, he made people paranoid but maybe if the Iranians had not been reciprocating this wouldn't have happened. Both sides have plenty of guilt on this one. More so for the side that actually shot the jet down.
     
  7. hobbsyoyo

    hobbsyoyo Deity

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    You are right. They probably would not have been on high alert had they not just attacked US bases with missiles.

    At the same time, this whole chain was kicked off by an assassination of one of Iran's leaders while he was in another country. That act was absolutely unnecessary and a provocation and in the end, that is where primary responsibility lays in my opinion.

    Pompeo admitted today that the US did not have actionable intelligence on exactly when or where Soleimani would have allegedly attacked the US. Thus, the 'imminent threat' justification is out the window. That was the only reasonable excuse for the actions that Trump took in my opinion.
     
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  8. rah

    rah Deity Supporter

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    That's the problem when you try to string blame. While I agree that Trump was out of line here, there are many that argue that the General was truly an evil man and deserved it. And more would say he was only evil because of events that happened earlier. This is the type of logic that ends in century long blood feuds. The type that have flourished in the Middle East. (and not claiming it doesn't happen in the West)
    I believe this was an accident, but that doesn't absolve those that did the accident from blame.
     
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  9. hobbsyoyo

    hobbsyoyo Deity

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    I think the blood fueds happen when you justify a killing - much less the egregious violation of norms that this particularity killing was - because 'he was an evil man that deserved it'.

    There's lots of evil dudes in the world that deserve to die. That doesn't automatically grant moral authority and justification to those that would kill them through air strikes.
     
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  10. Mouthwash

    Mouthwash Escaped Lunatic

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    I don't understand what point you think you're making, but I'm sure it seems perfectly sound inside your head.
     
  11. rah

    rah Deity Supporter

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    While I mostly agree, the death of the general also doesn't grant moral authority and justification to shoot down a civilian jet liner.
     
  12. luiz

    luiz Trendy Revolutionary

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    One more terrible tragedy, as if this case and the region in general needed any more :(

    But at least the blatant and outrageous cover-up of their obvious screw-up is a clear reminder of how evil the Iranian regime is (not that we needed a reminder). Evil and criminally incompetent.
     
  13. rah

    rah Deity Supporter

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    Criminally incompetent I'll buy, evil, I not willing to paint the entire regime that way. The initial response to this type of accident in the past has always been denial. A better indication will be who they throw under the bus when more fact come out. That video is pretty damning though.
     
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  14. luiz

    luiz Trendy Revolutionary

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    Well as I said it's just a reminder they're evil, not the whole case against them. They also sponsor numerous terrorist groups, persecute religious minorities brutally and hang homosexuals with cranes. They're evil alright.
     
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  15. civvver

    civvver Deity

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    We are convinced there were no casualties from the attacks on Iraq though right? Cus I was listening to NPR and they did an interview with someone from an Iranian news agency, I forget the name, but they are reporting as many as 80 americans dead. The anchor, I think it was Cornish on all things considered, asked the guy if his sources might be lying and he said no because they are external sources, mainly Ukrainian and Arab. Which makes me think how they would know about US and Iraqi casualties, but anyway the guy said the US isn't allowing reporters in because it's a cover up.

    I do not believe that, just reporting what I heard.
     
  16. rah

    rah Deity Supporter

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    If the US was an example of good, that argument would carry a tad more weight. Leave out the cranes and that description covers a lot of countries.
     
  17. El_Machinae

    El_Machinae Colour vision since 2018 Retired Moderator

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    Well, the cranes ARE a pretty big component of what makes the 'evil' description valid.
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2020
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  18. luiz

    luiz Trendy Revolutionary

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    Let's put it this way, if you're gay or member of a religious minority your neck is much safer in the US than Iran. This certainly counts for something.
     
  19. Cloud_Strife

    Cloud_Strife Deity

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    Don't forget that America has a history of exporting it's own bigotry against LGBTQ people across the world in the form of Christian organisations
     
  20. luiz

    luiz Trendy Revolutionary

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    Yeah Im sure most LGBTQ people would rather try their luck with US-backed Christian organizations than with the ayatollahs or the numerous islamist organizations they export.
     

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