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Iraq protests

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by Socrates99, Jan 2, 2020.

  1. choxorn

    choxorn Watermelon Headcrab

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    They are tilted a bit, you're right.
     
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  2. innonimatu

    innonimatu Deity

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    We'll see, as the inquiry is still ongoing. But the sequence of events is more coherent with the military only trying to cover up heir huge screw-up, reporting no missiles fired. If the head of the agency investigating the crash was trying to cover up something they wouldn't have allowed free access to the site for journalists, and wouldn't have invited foreigners to take part in the investigation. They already took responsibility so what re you afraid of, that the government will give a medal to the base commander?

    The military there were forced to own up to the responsibility, and other governments do not seem to be using this to increase tensions. Perhaps diplomacy will have a better chance now that the costs of brinkmanship getting out of control look high.

    I don't even think there is social regression. That apparently quick "modernization" of the 1970s was a thin veneer applied by "progressive" (not entirely fond of the word, but it'd be hard to explain) governments trying to change their countries where most of the population was not on board with the new ideas. These things take time. And most of those governments got toppled in one way or another before they had the time to get thinks to change. In different ways in each country, so each country should be discussed in its own details if you wise to discuss the past. Even in Israel where there were no coups the political situation is very fragmented, and this is a result of changes.

    "Islamicization" seems to be, for its adherents, an attempt to find some kind of stable basis in a situation that has indeed changed. Its success is a measure of the real change that has been happening in the region as the old (and sometimes more tolerant) ways of life were wiped out by modernization. They have not gone backwards, they've advanced forward and gotten into the problems that change brings: the old is torn down before the new is ready, anything can happen. They'll also find ways to get out of the problems.

    It was perhaps assumed that technical modernization would lead the rest of the world to automatically adopt the "western" social model, as if there was a single inevitable modern way of like. This was absurd. Different countries there have different backgrounds and there is (fortunately) not a global, homogeneous culture. It's up to the people of each to navigate their own paths. But repressive theocratic rule anywhere does not look like it'll have much staying power. Most of the trouble in the Middle East is that too many of the countries there have governments that also want to exercise power in other countries. And believe that necessary for their own safety. And are faced with other countries from outside playing chess there. Deescalation of both ambitions and fears is going to be a very complicated effort but it is the only good way forward. At least now everyone seems to be saying that word. Some hope.
     
  3. FriendlyFire

    FriendlyFire Codex WMDicanious

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    Please Ivan
    We both know what will happen when certain Aryan countries start to feel threatened by certain religious minority. Its not going to end well

    seriously, EU is trying to plug its demographic hole with immigration, which isnt a bad idea its just that they are taking on too many and not forcing them to intergrate. Attitudes are startiing to change already.
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2020
  4. Traitorfish

    Traitorfish The Tighnahulish Kid

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    What does even mean.

    Dictatorships that are secular aren't really dictatorships?

    Democracies that provide personal religious freedoms aren't really democracies?

    That dictatorships and democracies both prefer female television presenters with pretty faces?

    You may need to spell it out for us.
     
  5. Hrothbern

    Hrothbern Deity

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    For now, with our poor level of developed green techs, Climate change forces steady population.
    Somewhere in the future we can again decide to grow population to a new saturation point in fully self sustainable big metropoles.

    For now the world as a whole will need to learn how to govern economy with a steady population at a saturated (very) high percentage of old people, still delivering the goodies we are all used to.
    Japan a clear front runner.

    Especially the rich EU countries are the ones to develop, test, implement the set of policies that are best fitting in a steady population.
    Importing labour like especially Germany does, causing brain drains (and cultural drains) in other countries, is not only short sighted but also lazy.
    Exporting capital and knowledge to the people needing jobs and from there western prosperity is imo much better.
    And yes... add-on capital investments in German clusters are easier (hardly government action needed other than encouraging migrants and mitigating cultural disruptions).
    Easier than setting up clusters in EU countries needing it for their unemployed.
    Easier than pushing for better mobility of EU people within their own countries to such clusters in wording in their own countries.
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2020
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  6. bernie14

    bernie14 Filter Manipulator

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    Can you expand on this?
     
  7. Hrothbern

    Hrothbern Deity

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    yes

    but first

    do you agree (or understand) that economical clusters are the GDP per capita boosters for a country and that add-on investments (from whatever nature: money, education, infra, knowhow, more niche elements, etc) keep the incremental cost low for added products ?
     
  8. bernie14

    bernie14 Filter Manipulator

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    Sorta...
     
  9. Lexicus

    Lexicus Deity

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    Trump very clearly began this latest round of escalation by first refusing to certify that Iran was meeting its obligations under the JCPOA and then withdrawing the US from the JCPOA completely. To argue otherwise is Orwellian nonsense.
     
  10. Birdjaguar

    Birdjaguar Hanafubuki Retired Moderator Supporter

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    I think he is saying that the big job creation hubs (like the tech hubs in the US: Boston, Austin, San Diego, Silicon Valley etc.) are producing both jobs and capital investment that grow GDP. Other places are left to fend for themselves and are losing.
     
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  11. bernie14

    bernie14 Filter Manipulator

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    Right, so my question is on how to export that, without the "colonialism" label
     
  12. Birdjaguar

    Birdjaguar Hanafubuki Retired Moderator Supporter

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    Export across the world or to more cities within a nation or region (EU)?
     
  13. Hrothbern

    Hrothbern Deity

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    I used Germany as example.
    The add-on potential of Germany versus the brain and culture drain of mainly nearby East-European countries (hindering them severely in having enough choice of kinds of resources)

    In general it applies also to much less developed countries, but the hurdle, the "surprises", the risks, the project planning, frauds, corruption, more in general the "distance" in more than one way... it is all much more difficult.

    So it is about Eastern Europe from fairly developed countries like Czech Republic to every road only potholes countries like Romania.
    And it is about the South of Italy, Greece, Portugal.
    And rural areas of France and Germany (former East Germany).

    I come back in a few days on it

    And it makes ofc no sense at all to start really big projects in countries like Iraq where the next war will only destroy your investments in infra, machinery, humans.
    Peace is prio 1, stability prio 2. Without these first two prio's nothing makes sense except humanitarian aid with low level local economy aspects.
    Big Corporates neo-colonialism initiatives for local perks of a country (in this case fossil) do generate ofc cash for the wealthy, but are hardly imo really building up anything.
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2020
  14. hobbsyoyo

    hobbsyoyo Deity

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    The US admitted today that it did not have any direct evidence of imminent attacks against 4 separate embassies as claimed in the early post-assassination time frame. That's a good thing for them if only because they didn't alert the embassies in question which would have been both criminal negligence but also a repeat of what they accused Hillary of doing in the Benghazi embassy storming.
     
  15. Estebonrober

    Estebonrober Deity

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    Yea when he said that I was like well that easily verifiable. Why such a stupid lie, but then it occurred to me it's Trump.
     
  16. FriendlyFire

    FriendlyFire Codex WMDicanious

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    Japan is going down a different path with its goal of heavy reliance on robots. I think it stated goal was 1 Mil robots by 2025 to replace its shrinking labour pool its has also loosened the legal immigrant workers rules
    While it dosnt want immigrants to become Citizens its happy to have immigrant workers doing all the unskilled low wage work.
    Japan needs to fix its work culture, education system and barely functioning government.

    Its current economic policy seems to be set to implode as government is busy trying to prop up its economy with debt, it seems its banking on future technology to save itself.
    Instead of taking more logical steps.
     
  17. amadeus

    amadeus As seen on OT

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    What do you think needs to be changed in Japan’s education and working systems?

    I’d disagree through that the government barely functions.

    This is something that gets talked about a lot and I’m not sure exactly what the implications are, but Japan finances a lot of its debt through the purchase of bonds by the Bank of Japan. The government here has been pushing for years to try and get inflation up to 2%, but I wonder what effect that would have on investors if bond yields fail to keep up, and the government needs to keep itself afloat somehow.
     
  18. FriendlyFire

    FriendlyFire Codex WMDicanious

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    I believe that you have a name/word , where people work themselves to death ? I can understand working long hours but in Japan its epidemic and it generates a lot of unhappy youths
    Education system is antiquated and needs to be modernised, trim away everything useless from the postwar period.

    Japan debt is already a drag on your economy, you cannot keep subsidizing your banks with bad debts to avoid the inevitable correction that is needed. It will be bad but once you go through this period with good govenance things will slowly become better.
    Otherwise once you can no longer service the debt, your economy will implode anyways.
     
  19. amadeus

    amadeus As seen on OT

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    Karoushi (過労死) but saying Japan “has a word for it” is misleading to English speakers because of the way the Japanese language is structured. You can really make a word out of anything with the creative use of Japanese characters.

    I may be wrong but I believe the average workhours have declined over the past 30 or so years according to OECD analysis.

    This is not a specific enough criticism for me to address.

    A lot of what you’re talking about though is, I think, missing the mark. You’re talking about changes in systems, and it’s easy to change systems if you have a benevolent dictator or some charismatic figure that can come along and cajole it into compliance. And Japan has neither benevolent dictatorship or charismatic public figures.

    The only changes I think that could be made to immediate effect would be to totally abolish the high corporate income tax rate so that foreign multinational firms would have an incentive to set up shop in Japan rather than in Hong Kong or Singapore, and to a lesser extent Taiwan and Korea.

    Right now a good many of inefficient Japanese firms are effectively shielded from foreign competition because the high corporate income taxes make it very unpalatable for profit-seeking multinational firms with different governing standards to come in and lure talent when the cost of doing business here is twice that of Taiwan and nearly three times that of Singapore and Hong Kong.
     
  20. r16

    r16 not deity

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    "Do not go with the herd, that's what I mean. ;) Hamsters betray once changed conjuncture. People who can choose unpopular decisions, a much more reliable."


    these sage words are actually from a webpage from 2011 , machine translated . It arises from the then recent Syrian War where tanks need HE power and some Russian guy offers , because the site is an alternative thing , the American M60 tank with the missile launcher gun would be good for urban combat . Gets picked up on patriotic lines , despite he opened his post with the world famous KV-2 , so heavy that the Russians quickly abandoned it . ı have no idea what would be the correct translation of the Russian word that has become hamsters . We were on the brink of war , Iran gained some serious amount street cred , despite all the Sunni snickering about agreing with the Americans before missile launch . Our Sunni brothers are so awesome , they can't agree with the Americans on who will fight and die in the war against Iran , despite oth sides agree the war is sooooo necessary .


    then utterly ruined that rep through downing the Ukranian airliner . ı have no surprise at the image of street crowds who chant Death to the Dictator , because they are young , they have cellphones and they have all seen the pictures of the young couple who came from Canada to marry in Iran , with their relatives attending , those street crowds would go to Canada , too , if they could . 140 out of 176 are said to be Iranians , non-humans for Americans who would take r16 also as nonhuman . 11 or so Ukranians , not exactly White these days and you can see there was no risks and stuff for the plane to go down . Iranians actually arrest the British Ambrassador , too : I was imagining this was the Farsi way of telling they wouldn't receive te Sussex people , ex-Duke and ex-Duchess as informal stuff , turns out he was supporting the street things . He is British , what do you think he would do , shoot them instead of you ? Brits make conjucture change , or at least they fancy they do ... And yes , be my guest and invade Iran . We won't come ...


    which then will suddenly stop American plans to invade Iran , because , man , who's going to fight and die ? American kids ? In an election year ?

    moral of the story , sorry , post . For all the jerk he is , ı have trouble accepting Ahmedinejad could dare betraying Iran and agree with America to tweet Mahdi will arrive in 2020 . Starting a religious craziness and wasting Süleymani who no longer had the power after his failure against ISIL and the regular infighting between the dogmatic and less dogmatic wings of the Iranian State . Which then creates the thing that he is the bait , suggesting his "pals" in the money laundering of the Obama era sanctions that he will be acceptable to the dogmatics is thingz were to happen and Iran was liberated . Which then forces "becoming more Muslim" on neighbours ... Iran has more people than us , 10 million of them Sunni , some Arabs , some Turkoman and a majority thing of Kurds , but it's said 48% of the population is actually various shades , you know , "Turkic" , including this Hamaney guy , you know , the top guy . Which gives a "last chance" people would be fools not to take , ignoring that they won't win the elections . Which saves Iran for a decade more , things will happen and think of the costs of a pacification campaign here , complete with gas chambers , too . Iran might be saved for a century ; this , the good people of CFC , is what you can expect from the Iranians , but like ı won't hold them responsible specifically for this .

    hamsters are the ones with the wheel that spins , right ? Suits all them experts who appear on TV for years and years . They all the same thing in the end , no matter what happens . They will tell the Party was treasonous , too , as soon as the Party is no more .
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2020

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