Is Elon Musk a fraud?

Is Elon Musk a fraud?

  • Yes, he is a fraud

    Votes: 11 55.0%
  • No, he isn't a fraud

    Votes: 9 45.0%

  • Total voters
    20

schlaufuchs

Break My Heart
Joined
Jun 9, 2008
Messages
16,489
Location
Seattle, WA
The fact that "projects" get abandoned does not nullify that we build upon the efforts of others. Gay rights, civil rights, women's rights all built upon the efforts of those that went before. The same with industrial robots, automobiles, airplanes, medical practices, computer chips. The list is endless. It is often a crooked path with stops and starts.

God isn't real bro.
 

Rg339

Prince
Joined
Jun 3, 2022
Messages
300
I suppose the contention is between Musk being criticised and the end result somehow becoming "nobody tries". That's likely where you're losing people (myself included). I'd argue in light of the article I found earlier that Tesla would do better with somebody else in charge, even if it remains a way of generating revenue for the private sector.
NASA only has the resources to employ so many people. Like I’ve said, I believe that’s a mistake, and have argued for a higher budget multiple times.

If Elon doesn’t try, where do the engineers he employs go? There’s nowhere else where they’d produce comparable innovation. It’s SpaceX, or they leave the field entirely, in all likelihood. This is the context I have to include.

From wiki, SpaceX employs 12000. Its closest rival, Jeff Bezos’ Blue Origin, employs 3500. SpaceX likely employs more engineers than the rest of its competitors in the private sector combined.

The limit isn’t technical expertise. It’s will, and it’s money. If NASA’s tapped, and Elon doesn’t try, well, who else is going to step in? Who can else can you point to in the private sector to assume SpaceX’s role?
 

TheMeInTeam

If A implies B...
Joined
Jan 26, 2008
Messages
27,587
i don't think all of his moves are ethical, but most don't reach the definition of fraud.

i question his motives wrt twitter, from the start. he might have felt slighted and sought to screw them over or sink them. if he knew about the extent of its bots wasn't what twitter claimed to advertisers in advance, my estimate for this conclusion goes up by a lot. that problem is bad enough that he shouldn't be on the hook for twitter if backing out.

using insider information to arrange and then legally renege on a deal while exposing them is petty, but probably within his personality. it is also not some huge 4d chess scheme...if anything it only requires musk to identify that someone else is doing what he does (selling a rosy picture of a company's capabilities inconsistent with reality), then thinking about how he might out them.

he also might have just went to purchase twitter over ego though, and only later discovered its problems.
 

Hygro

soundcloud.com/hygro/
Joined
Dec 1, 2002
Messages
25,150
Location
California
I don't think bots factored into his motives at all. I do think his mania subsided somewhat as his money slowed and he started to sober to the reality he was about to blow his empire on getting back at people for calling him racist any sort of shaming.
 

Gorbles

Load Balanced
Joined
Nov 24, 2014
Messages
8,788
Location
UK
The fact that "projects" get abandoned does not nullify that we build upon the efforts of others.
I didn't say it did. I'm saying we don't always build on the past, ergo, lionising Musk now for someone else using his work as a basis in the future isn't a guarantee. Which seems to be what you're presenting it as.
 

TheMeInTeam

If A implies B...
Joined
Jan 26, 2008
Messages
27,587
I don't think bots factored into his motives at all. I do think his mania subsided somewhat as his money slowed and he started to sober to the reality he was about to blow his empire on getting back at people for calling him racist any sort of shaming.
regardless, the bots will still be a factor in letting him back out without nearly the cost he'd have otherwise. they will let him (legitimately) pin blame on twitter.

you may well be right that he just got lucky on this one.
 

Birdjaguar

Hanafubuki
Super Moderator
Supporter
Joined
Dec 24, 2001
Messages
49,644
Location
Albuquerque, NM
I didn't say it did. I'm saying we don't always build on the past, ergo, lionising Musk now for someone else using his work as a basis in the future isn't a guarantee. Which seems to be what you're presenting it as.
Musk is just like most other rich guys with ambition. He wants to leave a mark and has followed his interests to do so. Of course there are no guarantees, but he has already influenced both the space and auto industries. Musk is just easy to dislike because he is fabulously rich, outspoken, self centered, and provocative among other things. The "march of progress" is a real thing.
 
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