Is late game tech stealing a thing?

[Edusd]

Hello,

I'm new to VP and I'm pretty ignorant about a lot of things.

In this case I have a question regarding spies and tech stealing.

Problem I have is that every spy I send to tech steal gets killed on the late game (industrial+ or so), is this normal? Meanwhile the AI successfully steals techs (and more) from me from time to time, is there something I'm missing here? (playing on prince)

I've tried sending fully upgraded spies to top potencial cities as well as random satellite cities but they fail and get killed every time. Is tech stealing even possible late game? Any tips for this?

I've been playing like a chill warmonger (mostly did warmonger in the early game) but now I've fallen behind in techs (3-4 techs behind most people) and idk how to catch up besides stealing. To top of it off everyone hates me so public relations are quite complicated (I'm sanctioned in the world congress)

Any tips to catch up? Thanks!

 

[andersw]

If you're first in tech or equal to the top keep the spy at home.
If you are behind, send it to the AI to steal techs or send it to a CS to first lvl up and then to an AI.
On prince you probably dont have any problems keeping up so you're more likely just to have him in your capital.
If you go statecraft you will get an extra spy from one of the policys.
You can also use them in CS to sway them to your side.

As warmonger you get science from killing units and capturing cities, practice to war without losing units.

 

[Edusd]

If you're first in tech or equal to the top keep the spy at home.
If you are behind, send it to the AI to steal techs or send it to a CS to first lvl up and then to an AI.
On prince you probably dont have any problems keeping up so you're more likely just to have him in your capital.
If you go statecraft you will get an extra spy from one of the policys.
You can also use them in CS to sway them to your side.

As warmonger you get science from killing units and capturing cities, practice to war without losing units.

Yes I have sent quite a few spies (mostly fully upgraded) to AI cities to steal tech but they always end up getting killed just before stealing the tech, It has been 100% this outcome since the industrial Era or just before, and that makes me wonder if it's even possible at this point in the game.

Regarding statecraft I do feel like the extra spies is really good, but idk if I can afford to go for that since I haven't even opened yet and I'm already about 4 policies behind most civs plus I already unlocked ideologies (went for order), I wonder if it's too late to go for statecraft at this point.

And well right now I'm mostly having problems because of the sanction I got + losing gpt unless I put most cities to good production. I guess I will try to fix my situation first before calling it quits, thanks for the feedback.

 

[andersw]

Yes, you have to make the choice ahead on statecraft instead of fealty or artistry (Artistry is probably the weakest of these three imo.).
Yes its harder to steal when defensive spy buildings (mainly constabularies) are up, especially from statecraft civs who also will have enough to also keep spies at home.
Try to spy on artistry/fealty civs.
Losing gold likely means on or more, you: skipped market/banks? didnt build villages? have no merchant specialists to work? way way too much units? have no own religion?
Producing gold is very inefficient.

 

[Edusd]

Yes, you have to make the choice ahead on statecraft instead of fealty or artistry (Artistry is probably the weakest of these three imo.).
Yes its harder to steal when defensive spy buildings (mainly constabularies) are up, especially from statecraft civs who also will have enough to also keep spies at home.
Try to spy on artistry/fealty civs.
Losing gold likely means on or more, you: skipped market/banks? didnt build villages? have no merchant specialists to work? way way too much units? have no own religion?
Producing gold is very inefficient.

I will try spying on artistry/fealty civs, I didn't think about that thanks.

This weekend I haven't been able to play to try new things, but tomorrow I will.

Regarding gold, I pretty much built all gold buildings but I do have a big army, and haven't put merchant specialist to work. I do have a religion but I'm not sure how to get profit from it yet, can you get gold boosts from religion related actions?

I did put villages in roads and in between my cities inner trade routes but maybe I'm not taking advantage of them enough, do internal routes produce gold from villages? I'm not sure how to boost it but I will pay more attention to it.

In terms of gold I will also try reducing my army a bit + putting merch specialist, will see how it goes, thanks!

 

[andersw]

I will try spying on artistry/fealty civs, I didn't think about that thanks.

This weekend I haven't been able to play to try new things, but tomorrow I will.

Regarding gold, I pretty much built all gold buildings but I do have a big army, and haven't put merchant specialist to work. I do have a religion but I'm not sure how to get profit from it yet, can you get gold boosts from religion related actions?

I did put villages in roads and in between my cities inner trade routes but maybe I'm not taking advantage of them enough, do internal routes produce gold from villages? I'm not sure how to boost it but I will pay more attention to it.

In terms of gold I will also try reducing my army a bit + putting merch specialist, will see how it goes, thanks!

You dont need all of those but something, here are some:
For example open sky (religion) is a great wide pantheon you get lots of gold on pastures.
Cathedrals (religion) provide a lot of gold both on tiles and border expansion.
Thrift (religion) also provides gold.
Crusader spirit (religion) is a great reform belief in that you get a lot of gold (and culture) on city capture.
Tribute (policy) provide gold on border expansion.
Then there are civ specific stuff.

It can be tempting to puppet captured cities but beware that this is VERY expensive, look if you have puppet cities and annex them, that could be your issue.

Villages get +gold when a caravan is running on top of it so you want to have villages in place and caravans running from one end to the other of your empire.
Alternatively feed, in my case usually the capital for food or hammers.

 

[Edusd]

You dont need all of those but something, here are some:
For example open sky (religion) is a great wide pantheon you get lots of gold on pastures.
Cathedrals (religion) provide a lot of gold both on tiles and border expansion.
Thrift (religion) also provides gold.
Crusader spirit (religion) is a great reform belief in that you get a lot of gold (and culture) on city capture.
Tribute (policy) provide gold on border expansion.
Then there are civ specific stuff.

It can be tempting to puppet captured cities but beware that this is VERY expensive, look if you have puppet cities and annex them, that could be your issue.

Villages get +gold when a caravan is running on top of it so you want to have villages in place and caravans running from one end to the other of your empire.
Alternatively feed, in my case usually the capital for food or hammers.

Sadly my religion is fully upgraded already, but I will try using longer trade routes with villages for gold.

About cities all the 8 I have are annexed, I will check into merch specialist though and see if I can turn it around while sanctioned, thanks for the feedback!


Update: I have been able to almost catch up to most civs (besides Assyria) in tech and policies by putting more emphasis in specialists and GPS pops + repelling the trade sanction I had and using international routes more. Now the pain I'm facing is anti warmonger fever which I don't understand much about and is really strong bonus that England has against me. I will see how I can deal with that.

 

[Stalker0]

There is definitely a point in the game when spying becomes worthless. At that point I send the spies to CS and just use them for coups.

 

[stii]

It isn't quite impossible but it doesn't scale very well. If you do a super hard beeline (probably for military techs) you can continue stealing for a while but you will certainly get most of your stealing done right away.