is the great scientist too powerful?

Discussion in 'Civ5 - Strategy & Tips' started by linfeixb27, Oct 11, 2010.

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is the great scientist too powerful?

  1. Yes, too powerful.

    113 vote(s)
    57.9%
  2. No, it is balanced.

    65 vote(s)
    33.3%
  3. No, it is weak.

    3 vote(s)
    1.5%
  4. Other.

    14 vote(s)
    7.2%
  1. linfeixb27

    linfeixb27 Warlord

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    I don't know whether it has been discussed in the forum, but I think the great scientist is too powerful. in civ4 one can use it to find a tech, but one cannot choose, and the tech may be too big to finish so one needs to really tech it using some beakers. But in civ5 one can use the GS to find any tech he/she wants instantly, even a big tech.
    And I think it should be balanced.
     
  2. alpaca

    alpaca King of Ungulates

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    Has been discussed a lot, and yes, I think he is. Add to this that scientists are the best specialists by far.
     
  3. pi-r8

    pi-r8 Luddite

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    yeah... free tech + picking the tech of your choice is just too much. At the very least, they need to change it so it's like the great artist, where you can't use two culture bombs in a row.
     
  4. CornPlanter

    CornPlanter Emperor

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    Other - too early to tell. It's clear many things doesn't work as intended here. Probably in the right context the GS would be just fine. Or maybe not. Too early to tell, lets wait for some patches. At the moment the game is too easy with or without GS.
     
  5. delra

    delra Warlord

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    He should give a fixed based on era amount of bulbs instead of just popping a tech.
     
  6. TheMeInTeam

    TheMeInTeam Top Logic

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    There isn't much balance in the game, so it is hard to judge any one feature. Are scientists too strong, or relative alternative teching too weak, or is it that units don't build fast enough? Any of that (or none of it) might be true.
     
  7. dubrown

    dubrown Prince

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    Well, I did play a science game as Babylon and really abused the special ability with gaining GS twice as fast. And yes, it gave me a huge techlead with a small 4 city empire.

    But on the other hand, beaker generating isn't that balanced either with the large empire warring approach gives you far too many beakers with no or little developement more than alot of cities and population. To counter that as a small empire you really need the GS to pop your way up the science tree.

    Or perhaps it's balanced, and the GS is there for the small empire to counter the warmonger that really hasn't the time to build any libs, unis etc.
     
  8. City Raider

    City Raider Warlord

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    I think they are. But it is not the singular one that is that bad, its when you have 2 or 3 to use.
    Really researching tech comes pretty fast so there is almost no downside to waiting a little bit to use one. So the longer you wait, the more bang for your buck. I think they should probably cap them (maybe 500 beakers or something). That way you can still get some of the early techs in one turn, but you can't necessarily bulb through 2-3 techs at once and make large jumps.
     
  9. KCMcG

    KCMcG Chieftain

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    GS are definitely too powerful. Any tech you want no matter the cost is too much. I still think being able to choose the tech is fine, just it shouldn't finish the whole tech, it should be a set amount of beakers based on era, similar to how the GE works.

    I also think the scientist specialist is too powerful relative to the other specialists. I've never popped a GM before because Market only gives you one merchant specialist and it sucks compared to the 3 science of a scientist. Don't get me wrong, I think the scientist specialist is fine where it is, just the other specialists need to be buffed.
     
  10. Jharii

    Jharii King

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    GE's are pretty damn overpowered, too, imho. I think that if GS's and GE's offer you half of the value of the tech (and wonder) you are currently working on, it would be a much better balance.

    I think that the only one that offers that sweet spot of balance is the Great Merchant. Great Artists aren't far off, either, although their greatest strength is their tile upgrade.

    Generals are worthless except for starting Golden Ages. Occasionally, I'll build a citadel with them, depending on how the AI's are treating me.
     
  11. bryanw1995

    bryanw1995 Emperor

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    yes, but generals are the easiest to get. just dow a couple cs's at the start and let the gg's start coming.
     
  12. THE_COW_IS_OK

    THE_COW_IS_OK Chieftain

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    Exactly. Its all relative. Yes you can say they are too pwerful compared to merchants.How about compared to RA? you can still trade RA with all civs (resurect some if needed) and get much faster teching then a queue of scientists....
     
  13. fugazi

    fugazi King

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    Who the hell voted 'too weak'?! Haha.
     
  14. SS-18 ICBM

    SS-18 ICBM Oscillator

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    I haven't really gotten them that much, but I suppose if I did a Specialist Economy with them I'd find them overpowered.
     
  15. Lyoncet

    Lyoncet Emperor

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    Well whoever it was was obviously too disgraced to post their opinion here. :lol:

    (I kid I kid!)
     
  16. the streak

    the streak Chieftain

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    I think yes, not because it's some unbelievable unit, but because it's so much better than other GPs and the specialists seem to be so much better than other specialists.
     
  17. Jamuka

    Jamuka Warlord

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    Perhaps all the other great people are too weak. :)
     
  18. WeaselSlapper

    WeaselSlapper Prince

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    I think the GS (and pretty much all GP) is a combination of too strong and too weak.

    Bulbing is overpowered and I think if the raised the maintenance cost of the GS it would help encourage people from waiting for a better tech to bulb, or make each bulb result in fewer beakers, similar to the way they do for golden ages.

    Now that being said the tile improvement is pitiful. Only four science on a single tile is really weak (probably why some people said too weak) epically when it replaces any other improvement that's on the tile and can be pillaged. With the right civics even a trading post is supposed to give you two (for now only one) and you will get the extra gold too.

    I think they need to improve the settling for all great people so that it can stack on the improvement the tile already has, this way it might actually be useful to plant some GP instead of only using them for Golden Ages and bulbing.
     
  19. QuixotesGhost

    QuixotesGhost Warlord

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    Exactly my thoughts. You just end up feeding them to Golden Ages. Also, when does it make sense to build an academy instead of bulbing?
     
  20. Gath

    Gath Warlord

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    Academy is 5 science base. Game lasts what, 330 turns on king? So thats 1550 science max (not counting bonuses from buildings).

    Ancient : 20-70 science, 300 turns left or so in game, Academy definetly better
    Classical : 80-150 science, 280 turns left or so in game, academy definetly better
    Medieval : 250-440 science, 180 turns left in game? Academy still definetly better
    Renaissance: 650-1425, academy is marginal
    Industrial: 1680-2200, definetly get the free tech
    Modern: 2600-3350, free tech is better, no question
    Future: 3350-4000, free tech is better, no question

    From that I would say that up until the renaissance, academies are definitely better. Especially when paired with building bonuses.
     

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